2012 Aug Plugin Sales Discussion Thread: Volt-2,831;Leaf-685

[Herm]

The charge-sustain mileage of the Volt is poor vs. that of the Prius and the Volt requires premium.
If the commute goes beyond the Volt's AER range or aren't able to charge much/at all, then it seems the Volt isn't such a great choice. From http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/09/review-2012-toyota-prius-plug-in-hybrid/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;:

Let’s look at these numbers in terms of a commute. I drive 106 miles a day, and my commute involves city, highway and rural mountain roads. Starting with fuel economy without charging: the Volt averaged 33MPG, the Prius averaged 50 and the Prius plug-in averaged 52. (Credit the greater ability to regenerate for the improved figure.) With charging on both ends of my commute, the Volt averaged 40MPG, and the Prius plug-in averaged 72MPG.

There is something odd about that TTAC review of the PIP.. he gets EPA mileages for the PIP and Prius yet he gets below EPA on the Volt.. I think he was driving the Volt in an aggressive manner.. the Volt is rated at 40mpg on the hwy compared to 38 for a Cruze or 33 for a Verano.. even the 53mile trip could be done on the battery with some care.

 

[cwerdna]

The charge-sustain mileage of the Volt is poor vs. that of the Prius and the Volt requires premium.
If the commute goes beyond the Volt's AER range or aren't able to charge much/at all, then it seems the Volt isn't such a great choice. From http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/09/review-2012-toyota-prius-plug-in-hybrid/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;:

Let’s look at these numbers in terms of a commute. I drive 106 miles a day, and my commute involves city, highway and rural mountain roads. Starting with fuel economy without charging: the Volt averaged 33MPG, the Prius averaged 50 and the Prius plug-in averaged 52. (Credit the greater ability to regenerate for the improved figure.) With charging on both ends of my commute, the Volt averaged 40MPG, and the Prius plug-in averaged 72MPG.

There is something odd about that TTAC review of the PIP.. he gets EPA mileages for the PIP and Prius yet he gets below EPA on the Volt.. I think he was driving the Volt in an aggressive manner.. the Volt is rated at 40mpg on the hwy compared to 38 for a Cruze or 33 for a Verano.. even the 53mile trip could be done on the battery with some care.

The numbers are a bit puzzling but I'm guessing three things:

1) He drives the Volt too fast, esp. on the highway and due to its lack of HV/EV button, he's burning up "valuable" AER range on the highway.
2) He's probably switching to HV mode on the PiP to not waste the limited AER range at highway speeds and only switching to EV mode for when it's most beneficial (low speeds).
3) Both ends of his route have a lot of high speed/highway driving near the beginning, which again is burning up the AER on the Volt, and he can't do anything to prevent that.

 

[Herm]

3) Both ends of his route have a lot of high speed/highway driving near the beginning, which again is burning up the AER on the Volt, and he can't do anything to prevent that.

He could always switch to the Mountain mode or EV mode if its a new model. Very few cars exceed the mileage of a Volt running on the gas engine, only hybrids or nasty diesels.

 

[scottf200]

2,831 Volts sold in August!

http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/news.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2012/Sep/gmsales.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
DOWNLOADS
GMNA Production by Plant August 2012.pdf
Production by Plant

GM US Deliveries August 2012.pdf
Deliveries

GM US Deliveries Auguts 2012.xlsx
Deliveries Chart in Excel

 

[RegGuheert]

2,831 Volts sold in August!

http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/news.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2012/Sep/gmsales.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Congratulations to Chevrolet for record Volt sales! As predicted, the big ad campaign during the Olympics help boost sales of the Volt:

Thanks in part to extensive national advertising during the Olympic Games, Chevrolet passenger car sales were up 25 percent, with the Spark, Sonic, Cruze and Volt all posting their best-ever monthly sales.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

any guesses on LEAF sales for August? have those attractive lease options with discounts made a dent? it would seem it so. the # of LEAFs spotted in the Oly area has definitely jumped up. i always saw a few here and there even one time spotting 3 different ones downtown in a 5 minute span this past spring but the last few i saw were state vehicles (a first) and others still with temp plates.

so i say 700. any takers?

 

[adric22]

so i say 700. any takers?

Ha! 700 would actually be great, welcomed news.. but I'm fearing even less than last month. I hope I'm wrong.

 

[blueblob06]

I would hope with all the deals that seem to be out there that they post a decent number for August.

I live in Cincinnati, OH where the dealers seem to have either 1 Leaf (and the demo Leaf) or just a demo Leaf at each dealership. From your all experiences and such, do the deals seems to be mostly at dealerships where they have a large inventory on site? (i.e. CA, OR, etc.) Thanks.

Edit: And I forgot to add, when I was at a dealership in Ohio, it didn't seem like they were willing to lower the price at all, seems to be a matter of "you tell us the color, trim, etc you want, we order and you come back and pick it up". That was 3-4 months so maybe things have changed.

 

[Stanton]

I don't think we're going to see anything approaching the mid-2011 numbers (>1000/month) until the Smyrna, TN plant comes online. Leaf sales are most definitely supply-limited by Nissan (for various reasons I suspect).

 

[KJD]

any guesses on LEAF sales for August? have those attractive lease options with discounts made a dent? it would seem it so. the # of LEAFs spotted in the Oly area has definitely jumped up. i always saw a few here and there even one time spotting 3 different ones downtown in a 5 minute span this past spring but the last few i saw were state vehicles (a first) and others still with temp plates.
so i say 700. any takers?

You were very close Dave. 685 is the number.
http://green.autoblog.com/2012/09/04/gm-sells-2831-chevy-volts-in-august-nissan-sells-685-leafs/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[EdmondLeaf]

any guesses on LEAF sales for August? have those attractive lease options with discounts made a dent? it would seem it so. the # of LEAFs spotted in the Oly area has definitely jumped up. i always saw a few here and there even one time spotting 3 different ones downtown in a 5 minute span this past spring but the last few i saw were state vehicles (a first) and others still with temp plates.
so i say 700. any takers?

You were very close Dave. 685 is the number.
http://green.autoblog.com/2012/09/04/gm-sells-2831-chevy-volts-in-august-nissan-sells-685-leafs/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

same here
http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/...5f39f06b-afed-4f1e-8031-c966a079204b/download

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

any guesses on LEAF sales for August? have those attractive lease options with discounts made a dent? it would seem it so. the # of LEAFs spotted in the Oly area has definitely jumped up. i always saw a few here and there even one time spotting 3 different ones downtown in a 5 minute span this past spring but the last few i saw were state vehicles (a first) and others still with temp plates.
so i say 700. any takers?

You were very close Dave. 685 is the number.
http://green.autoblog.com/2012/09/04/gm-sells-2831-chevy-volts-in-august-nissan-sells-685-leafs/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ah close but a bit disappointing. i figured 700 to be a bit "low ball" i now hesitate to predict 900 for Sept.

i am seriously starting to see movement online and locally towards the LEAF.

 

[RegGuheert]

Welcome to the forum!

I live in Cincinnati, OH where the dealers seem to have either 1 Leaf (and the demo Leaf) or just a demo Leaf at each dealership. From your all experiences and such, do the deals seems to be mostly at dealerships where they have a large inventory on site? (i.e. CA, OR, etc.) Thanks.

Well, the dealership I discussed earlier in this thread has now sold a grand total of nine LEAFs including the three they sold in August. BTW, they only had two LEAFs on their lot, so they had to get one from another dealer to sell three. But the deal they offered was for their employees. I don't know if any great deals were available for regular customers.

Interestingly, both the sales and maintenance LEAF specialists leased LEAFs on Friday. I don't know if Nissan or the dealership specifically targeted these employees, but I'm thinking this is a good thing since it will help them to be more knowledgable about the LEAF and about EVs in general.

Edit: And I forgot to add, when I was at a dealership in Ohio, it didn't seem like they were willing to lower the price at all, seems to be a matter of "you tell us the color, trim, etc you want, we order and you come back and pick it up". That was 3-4 months so maybe things have changed.

If I were you, I wouldn't purchase under those circumstances. I recommend you sit tight until the 2013s make it onto the lots and start to pile up before trying to pick up a new LEAF, either 2012 or 2013.

 

[kmp647]

unless there is huge movement in the price of gas,and or dirt cheap well adertised Lease deal
685 will be the peak for monthly sales until the 2013 is out
sept thru dec or even jan feb will trudge along at 400 to 600 a month

 

[blueblob06]

Welcome to the forum!

I live in Cincinnati, OH where the dealers seem to have either 1 Leaf (and the demo Leaf) or just a demo Leaf at each dealership. From your all experiences and such, do the deals seems to be mostly at dealerships where they have a large inventory on site? (i.e. CA, OR, etc.) Thanks.

Well, the dealership I discussed earlier in this thread has now sold a grand total of nine LEAFs including the three they sold in August. BTW, they only had two LEAFs on their lot, so they had to get one from another dealer to sell three. But the deal they offered was for their employees. I don't know if any great deals were available for regular customers.

Interestingly, both the sales and maintenance LEAF specialists leased LEAFs on Friday. I don't know if Nissan or the dealership specifically targeted these employees, but I'm thinking this is a good thing since it will help them to be more knowledgable about the LEAF and about EVs in general.

Edit: And I forgot to add, when I was at a dealership in Ohio, it didn't seem like they were willing to lower the price at all, seems to be a matter of "you tell us the color, trim, etc you want, we order and you come back and pick it up". That was 3-4 months so maybe things have changed.

If I were you, I wouldn't purchase under those circumstances. I recommend you sit tight until the 2013s make it onto the lots and start to pile up before trying to pick up a new LEAF, either 2012 or 2013.

Thanks for the warm welcome and helpful info. I was leaning towards waiting. This sounds like a good idea.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

unless there is huge movement in the price of gas,and or dirt cheap well adertised Lease deal
685 will be the peak for monthly sales until the 2013 is out
sept thru dec or even jan feb will trudge along at 400 to 600 a month

not sure i can agree with that. we still have areas just now getting a supply of LEAFs at the dealership and battery issues aside; you can get one Hell of deal on a lease right now to where your savings along with fuel savings makes it a very attractive lure to get a 2012. i can guess the prices for 2013 with be pretty much stable (guessing about a $500-1000 price drop with better features)

 

[kmp647]

hope you are correct Dave.

Local dealer here has had 8-10 on the lot since march,

in fact most dealers i nthis area have had inventory for 5- 6 months

I am alone on the roads around here (northern VA)

seems like it anyway

 

[evnow]

cars.com shows an inventory of 2433 cars. That is about 3 to 4 months worth.

I wonder when the 2013 model starts shipping. That is when Nissan will have a chance to shake up the Leaf market.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

its not as much to do with the LEAF as it has to do with it being a car.

its year end clearance when EVERYONE knows the 2013 will be better, different and more expensive which has always had 25% of sales for last 2 months but been hampered by limited selection. from "all these reports" there seems to be no issue with selection which is 75% of the battle.

so i predict this based on it being a "end of life model" car...nothing more

 

[DaveEV]

InsideEVs has good coverage of Aug 2012 sales numbers as usual:

August 2012 Plug-In Electric Vehicle Sales Report Card - Inside EVs

Summary:
Volt: 2,831 (USA)
LEAF: 685 (USA)
Model S: TBD (best guess ~couple dozen)
Karma: ~250 worldwide
Prius: TBD
Fit: TBD
Focus: TBD
iMiEV: TBD

One of the comments in that article links to this news article which has the following insights:

Nissan to step up EV production - The Canberra Times
TL;DR; version:
Currently capacity / Yen constrained
'13 model won't necessarily be cheaper, but will allow introduction of less expensive version
Also working on plug-in hybrids

And probably the most important quote:

Palmer also dismissed recent reports of battery problems in hot weather for the Leaf. A number of owners in America complained of reduced range during summer, but Palmer says the problem is a faulty battery level display.

"We don't have a battery problem," he says.