Will your next EV be a Leaf or another brand - why?

[lencap]

I'm still pretty new to EV cars, just completing one month of ownership. The Leaf appealed to me when it was first announced and I put a deposit down. Eventually I canceled my reservation growing tired or waiting and not having my questions answered. I also was concerned with the 3.3KW charger limitation and found the lease costs pretty high (I didn't want to own a Leaf not knowing about resale value or battery life).

I bought my 2013 SV because I still like the car and the price is about half of the original lease price. At today's prices I couldn't turn it down. I took a two year lease to see how an EV works for me. So far I'm pleased, but realize that I can't use the car to visit my children (190 mile and 390 mile round trips), and I'm becoming more interested in the Tesla. The increased range interests me, but the cost is something I'm trying to justify. Clearly the Tesla is more of a luxury car than the Leaf (or any other EV), but I'm more interested in range than status.

I considered a RAV-4EV, but they aren't available in my state. I'm hopeful for a true 200+ mile range, but I'm not optimistic that will happen in 2 years, at least at my intended price point.

So my question is: "If not a Leaf, what else and why?"

 

[kikbuti]

I am into my second month on a 2 year lease of a 2013 SL Premium. I use the Leaf for commuting and have other options if I need to travel out of its range. I love the Leaf. I am disappointed in my Jaguar and Land Rover when I have to drive them. I am a senior citizen and I like luxury. I am willing to spend more on an Infiniti, but the prices of the Tesla is out of reach.

The Ford Fusion and Lincoln variation didn't suit me. I don't want to spend 40 grand for something that is not easy to get in and out of. The Prius is too generic and dorky. I'll stick with the Leaf until something better comes along. I would go for the Fiat 500e if I could get one. Cool car. Really easy to get in and out of. My only gripe with the Fiat is that navigation seems to be an afterthought. It's a TomTom sticking up on top of the dash looking very aftermarket. In this day and age, there's no excuse for that.

 

[adric22]

I've had my leaf for over 2 years and it has operated flawless, never left me stranded, and overall been a great car. However, after driving my wife's Volt for a while, I think I'd rather have that. The range extender is not really the reason. heck, I've been driving it for 2 months and have yet to start up the ICE. For me, I just like the styling and sportier ride. It sits lower and somehow is just more fun to drive.

However, by the time my lease is up in 2014, the BMW i3 should be available and I'll test drive one of those, but I suspect I'll still prefer the Volt.

As it is currently, my favorite plug in cars (that I could afford) based soley on my opinions are as follows from favorite to least favorite:

• Chevy Volt
• Nissan Leaf
• Cmax Energi
• Ford Focus EV
• Toyota Plugin Prius
• Ford Fusion Energi
• Chevy Spark Ev
• Fiat 500e
• Honda Fit EV
• Mitsubishi i-Miev

 

[smkettner]

I want more range. Rav4, Tesla S, or Tesla X are the only options afaik.
If Nissan comes out with a 125+ EPA rated battery I would consider a swap.

 

[Deleted member 9549]

Just leased a Leaf last night, so not quite seasoned owner yet, but so far very impressed with the Leaf and with Ghosn's commitment to EVs, more-so than most other manufacturers. I'm currently on a 2 yr lease, will likely get another 2yr lease from Nissan if the price is ok next time around for the latest EV, then my plan 4 yrs out is to get whatever Tesla's gen III car is, hopefully priced in the 30s. My assumption is that Tesla is gonna win, but Nissan seems the most committed of traditional car makers.

My favorite EVs today regardless of price are:
- Tesla Model S
- Nissan Leaf
Looked at and test drove, Ford C-Max Energi (& hybrid), Chevy Volt, Plugin Prius, Spark (ICE), Fiat 500 (ICE). Wouldn't seriously consider any of them.

The BMW i3 sounds interesting. The Volt is too much in the middle between an ICE and EV. Worst of both worlds. All the machinery to propel the car full speed as an ICE and as an EV. Double the weight, cost, space consumed for no added benefit over just one or the other. Leaf is pure EV. BMW has an interesting twist. Most folks want an BEV but don't want to get stranded. So what about having a minimal ICE to get you to a charge point at a not fully comfortable speed but enough to not be a road hazard. If the ICE doesn't add lots of cost, weight, space, then it might be a good formula while we wait for battery technology to improve.

 

[GeorgeParrott]

We currently have:

2011 Nissan Leaf, VIN #320 SL, Pearl White, QC , 20,000 miles
2011 Chevy Volt, VIN #679, Crystal Red, loaded, 24,000 miles
2013 Tesla Model S, 85kW standard, multicoat red, tech, supercharging, upgrade sound, VIN #9649, 30 Miles? Arrives next week actually
5.5 kw Solar PV roof system and ZERO house and charging monthly use costs from PG&E due to this PV system.

The Leaf will be finding a new home because of the Tesla S, and the Volt....will find a new home in February to be replaced by MOST likely the BMW i3, though I had great hopes for the Cadillac ELR, but am not impressed with the "price-payoff" relationship in terms of virtually no better performance than the Volt and $25,000 more as a base price according to rumors so far.

An Infiniti badged EREV would be acceptable, but that seems distant, and the Leaf EV, while totally functional, needs a bit more range and a better heater in the winter, even in California, to satisfy my wife.

 

[veramis]

I think electric cars will continue to improve significantly every 1-2 years, and people buying electric cars today are paying a premium to be first adopters. I will continue leasing economy electric cars when the incentives make it so economical, and delay buying until electric cars use good battery chemistry and temperature management, and battery costs drops to $300/kwh. When that time comes I will most likely go for Nissan or Tesla since they take electric cars most seriously.

 

[Yogi62]

Do PHEV's count?

I plan on keeping the Leaf for 10+ years and use it for a 31 mile RT daily commute and weekend trips around town. It replaced a 2001 Crew Cab dually which now is only going to be pulling trailers on weekends and vacations. $8 a day on diesel vs $1 day of electricity. The price finally came down to where the math worked and it is a lot easier to park.

Our next vehicle (2015?) is probably going to replace a 2005 Dodge Grand Caravan which is used weekdays around town and long distance (300+ mile OW) trailerless trips, often to low population areas that don't have chargers of any kind let alone QC or SuperChargers. So we need something that seats 5 with a little bit of cargo space or 2/3 with seats folded/down removed. I would like a PHEV that gets 15 mile range on battery and 27-32 MPG HWY on gas/diesel. Gas is still the fastest and best distributed way to "charge" a vehicle and I don't see that changing in the next 12 years.

 

[TomT]

When my lease is up it is highly unlikely that my next EV will be a Nissan. The main, but not only, reasons:

1) Lack of a TMS has proven to be a major factor in battery degradation. This is the biggie!
2) QC has significant limitations due to number 1 above.
3) Nissan has been less than forthcoming about so many things that are Leaf.
4) Battery degradation has been significantly worse then we were led to believe it would be the case.
5) Questionable battery warranty support from Nissan.
6) Would like slightly more range than that which the Leaf can presently provide.

 

[DanCar]

Wife says we need a bigger car so hoping the e-nv200 will be available. http://www.env200.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Alternatively hoping the Rav4 EV gets a better lease deal.

 

[planet4ever]

I recently replaced my 2011 LEAF with a 2013, so I guess that is my answer. In our moderate climate we have had none of the battery problems that TomT rails about. Yes, it would be nice to have more range, but we do have a Prius that we can use for longer trips. It turns out the in the last two years we drove the LEAF 13 miles for every 1 mile we drove the Prius, so the "long trip" problem hasn't been at all severe. So why did I switch? I actually prefer the simpler instrumentation in the new S model, I wanted the seat warmers, and I was paying too much on the first lease.

I was originally a Volt fan, but when I sat in one I found I couldn't stand the cramped cockpit feel, and it was very difficult for my ancient bones to get in and out of it, so I crossed that off my list. I considered a Focus EV this time around, but the tiny hatchback space and the non-availability of high speed DC charging pushed me back to the LEAF. Since I like simple, I would have been tempted by the Mitsubishi i-MiEV, but my impression is that the company has given up on that one.

Ray

 

[adric22]

I recently replaced my 2011 LEAF with a 2013, so I guess that is my answer. In our moderate climate we have had none of the battery problems that TomT rails about.

Did you originally have a 2 year lease? If it was a 3 year lease, how did that work out when you wanted to upgrade? I've recently thought about trying to get out of my 3 year lease a year early, but I'm not sure that would be wise.

 

[planet4ever]

Did you originally have a 2 year lease? If it was a 3 year lease, how did that work out when you wanted to upgrade? I've recently thought about trying to get out of my 3 year lease a year early, but I'm not sure that would be wise.

It was a three year lease, and I was "under water", but I got a good deal, so I wasn't out a lot of cash, and I'll more than make that up in lower payments. I also lost something on the CA rebate, since I had to pay back 1/3 of the $5K I originally got. I expect to get $2500, but the net $833 isn't much for a three year rebate.

Ray

 

[cgaydos]

When we decided to get a second EV I test drove a Focus Electric and a Volt and ended up with a second LEAF. If the Tesla were in the financial range I'd prefer that one of the two EVs be a Tesla due to range.

I know the LEAF is not for everyone, but for us the trade-offs between drivability, utility (carrying capacity and comfort for rear seat passengers), and price are the most optimal. If our first LEAF lease were ending now - and assuming NMAC didn't relent on the contracted residual price, which is much higher than the market price for the same car - then we'd just replace it with a 2013 LEAF lease.

 

[leafedbehind]

It depends on what else is available in 2.5 years, when we will likely have to replace our Fit EV because the closed-end lease will end. We will likely keep the LEAF since we bought it. Generally, I prefer driving the Fit over the LEAF, as does my wife. But the LEAF has much more cargo space. If Honda came out with something that was competitive with the LEAF on cargo space, we'd likely go with a Honda. I doubt we will end up with two LEAFs.

I'm also looking forward to the gen-3 Tesla, the Mercedes B-class, and the BMW i3. I'd like a 110 to 120-mile freeway range, which I think is quite reasonable to ask for in 2.5 years from now, at current LEAF/Fit EV prices or slightly higher.

 

[SteveInSeattle]

I leased my second Leaf a few months ago, so Leaf is clearly my preference given all of the current choices. In two to three years I would assume that the Leaf will continue to improve, but if there is something else that seems superior for my needs I would consider switching. But, I am not likely to consider models that are not backed by major car manufactures-- no CODA of Fiskar for me, and I'm not sold on the longevity of Tesla yet, either. I'd really like an electric roadster-- but not one for 100K, something like an EV Miata.

 

[lion]

I was so close to pulling the trigger on the RAV4 EV, but since I'm in NY, the lack of local dealer enthusiasm/support was too much or a risk for a $50,000 vehicle, so I 'settled' for a LEAF. I'm very happy with the LEAF so far. The SL + 2013 SL wheels + black leather gives it a luxury car feel, so that alone might keep me in the LEAF camp, if they up the range, and offer me a good deal once it becomes available.

I would definitely get a Tesla powered vehicle if I could afford it. I did pre-order the Lit Motors C-1, but who knows when that becomes reality.

I hope Nissan listens to its customers, and uses customer feedback to design the next LEAF. If they do, then they probably will have me as a customer for life.

 

[Weatherman]

When my lease is up it is highly unlikely that my next EV will be a Nissan. The main, but not only, reasons:

1) Lack of a TMS has proven to be a major factor in battery degradation. This is the biggie!
2) QC has significant limitations due to number 1 above.
3) Nissan has been less than forthcoming about so many things that are Leaf.
4) Battery degradation has been significantly worse then we were led to believe it would be the case.
5) Questionable battery warranty support from Nissan.
6) Would like slightly more range than that which the Leaf can presently provide.

Echos my sentiments, exactly. It's sad to watch how fast my LEAF's battery is degrading. QC, even if it was available, would be out of the question at least nine months out of the year.

It's almost guaranteed that a Volt will be my next EV (even though it's not a pure EV). I'm just hoping my LEAF can do what I need it to do for the next couple of years until I can turn it in.

 

[evnow]

When my lease is up it is highly unlikely that my next EV will be a Nissan. The main, but not only, reasons:

1) Lack of a TMS has proven to be a major factor in battery degradation. This is the biggie!
2) QC has significant limitations due to number 1 above.
3) Nissan has been less than forthcoming about so many things that are Leaf.
4) Battery degradation has been significantly worse then we were led to believe it would be the case.
5) Questionable battery warranty support from Nissan.
6) Would like slightly more range than that which the Leaf can presently provide.

1 thr' 5 is taken care of by leasing.

 

[lencap]

Thanks to all for the comments - they are very helpful. Despite my very recent purchase of the Leaf I didn't "cross shop" the market and have questioned my Leaf purchase. For me, given the very attractive lease prices the Leaf was my "best" choice.

I had placed an early deposit on the 40KW Tesla, but canceled it well over a year ago when I realized that my $5,000 deposit wasn't placed in escrow but was co-mingled with Tesla's own corporate cash. That concerned me, as did the feeling that even though I was in line for a Telsa - the 40Kw version didn't really have the range I needed. On reflection it may have worked out since we have a second car in the house and Tesla no longer offers the 40KW version - it would have been one of the few "entry level" Teslas and probably held value pretty well.

Again, thanks for the comments - I welcome more. I'm especially interested in Volt owner perspectives (has the car worked out the way you thought in terms of battery use versus ICE), Tesla (if you drive 200 miles from home, how easy is it to recharge and return home), and other users (is the Leaf range "good enough" or do you still have range anxiety), and everyone else (Ford EV, PZEV, etc.).

The more opinions the better - I'm still learning and very much appreciate everyone's comments.