Spies said:
I do have a link.
http://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/QuietCar-noi-draft.pdf
The rule that eliminates the off switch appears to be on page 7.
2012 VSP Off switch gone?
- Thread starter leaf4me
- Start date
Help Support My Nissan Leaf Forum:
I do have a link.
http://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/QuietCar-noi-draft.pdf
The rule that eliminates the off switch appears to be on page 7.
I've ended up only defeating it very early in the morning anyhow, so it doesn't bug the neighbors when I reverse out of the driveway. Aside from that, I'm just as happy to have it working all the time. It's not all that obtrusive.
Spies
Well-known member
Thanks, jimcmorr posted the link as well. Looks like its not going to be final for a while though. Perhaps Nissan is getting a jump on it by removing the switch now.kovalb said:
Its already been discussed to death but I do hear the VSP from inside the vehicle just fine even with all the windows rolled up and I would say about half of the time it bugs me enough to turn it off. Perhaps I am just sensitive to VSP. I would certainly miss the off switch if it was gone.
abasile
Well-known member
What a waste of taxpayer dollars. How many Prii operating in EV or "stealth" mode have injured or killed pedestrians? It seems to me that the government is trying to legislate solutions to "problems" that are not worthy of its attention. This probably has more to do with lobbyists than anything else.
I am glad that my 2011 LEAF allows me to decide when and where to use the VSP. During late night and early morning hours, I usually turn it OFF before backing out of the driveway. Driving a twisty, one-lane mountain road at low speed with the windows open, I also prefer to turn it off and enjoy the quiet ride. Otherwise, I normally leave it on.
On the 2012 LEAF, there will of course be aftermarket modifications. All I will say is, if you modify your car to disable the VSP and subsequently hit a pedestrian, you will unfortunately be in a weakened position in terms of liability, even if you're not actually violating the law. So watch where you are driving!
I am glad that my 2011 LEAF allows me to decide when and where to use the VSP. During late night and early morning hours, I usually turn it OFF before backing out of the driveway. Driving a twisty, one-lane mountain road at low speed with the windows open, I also prefer to turn it off and enjoy the quiet ride. Otherwise, I normally leave it on.
On the 2012 LEAF, there will of course be aftermarket modifications. All I will say is, if you modify your car to disable the VSP and subsequently hit a pedestrian, you will unfortunately be in a weakened position in terms of liability, even if you're not actually violating the law. So watch where you are driving!
Herm
Well-known member
jkirkebo said:
How about the remaining range estimator?
Had a 2012 Leaf on order for delivery in mid-December. Read this info about the VSP being absent from the 2012 model. Went down to dealer (Santa Cruz Nissan) and they were unaware of the degrade as they had only taken delivery of a "few" 2012's and really hadn't noticed. Talked to their service department about the possibility of having a 2011 VSP installed in my 2012 and got a negative as it most probably would involve software re-programing. I explained that apparently Nissan had done this degrade based upon the fact that the presence of an electric vehicle low-speed noise maker that cannot be switched off would soon be required by law so it would be better to degrade it at the start of the model year instead of during it.
I, however, would like to make the decision myself about when to use the device, rather than let the government make it for me (I'm like that about a lot of things now that I've reached the wonderful age of 68). I believe that Nissan had it exactly right. A VPN that can be switched off if the driver deems it necessary but that defaults to being on so the driver doesn't need to think about it unless the situation calls for it.
So I immediately (Nov. 26th) looked on Craig's List for Nissan Leaf and found a dealer in San Jose who had several 2011's (with beautiful VPS right where they should be). I wanted a Cayenne Red and no dealer markup beyond MSRP. I made an appointment to see it the next day, and the day after that I was driving home in my own beautiful Leaf. I also turn off the VSP when I am in by own driveway or when I do not want to attract attention (like backing away from an ATM after dark) but leave it on most of the time since it's not too obtrusive.
All of this cost me the augmented heating (which I hardly need in Central California) and it cost me nearly $2,000 less than I was prepared to pay for the 2012. Viva Choice!
I, however, would like to make the decision myself about when to use the device, rather than let the government make it for me (I'm like that about a lot of things now that I've reached the wonderful age of 68). I believe that Nissan had it exactly right. A VPN that can be switched off if the driver deems it necessary but that defaults to being on so the driver doesn't need to think about it unless the situation calls for it.
So I immediately (Nov. 26th) looked on Craig's List for Nissan Leaf and found a dealer in San Jose who had several 2011's (with beautiful VPS right where they should be). I wanted a Cayenne Red and no dealer markup beyond MSRP. I made an appointment to see it the next day, and the day after that I was driving home in my own beautiful Leaf. I also turn off the VSP when I am in by own driveway or when I do not want to attract attention (like backing away from an ATM after dark) but leave it on most of the time since it's not too obtrusive.
All of this cost me the augmented heating (which I hardly need in Central California) and it cost me nearly $2,000 less than I was prepared to pay for the 2012. Viva Choice!
Stoaty
Well-known member
I don't generally care if the government makes the decision for me, but in this case they made the wrong decision. The VSP often bothers me (at low speed it sounds like a scraping noise even with windows rolled up). Glad I have the 2011.nmkinney said:
iluvmacs
Well-known member
I'd be willing to try putting a VSP off switch into my new 2012, because I am highly annoyed by the VSP when in my very echoic garage.
What I need is someone with a 2011 to tell me how/where the switch wires in. Then I can try wiring in a switch to the same place and see if it still works.
Disclaimer: I am an electrical engineer, and I have some experience taking apart car dashes. So as long as I can get to the wiring harness without too much trouble, it should be easy for me to test out.
Any takers for telling me what to try? ;-)
What I need is someone with a 2011 to tell me how/where the switch wires in. Then I can try wiring in a switch to the same place and see if it still works.
Disclaimer: I am an electrical engineer, and I have some experience taking apart car dashes. So as long as I can get to the wiring harness without too much trouble, it should be easy for me to test out.
Any takers for telling me what to try? ;-)
TimLee
Well-known member
I agree with you Stoaty.
I don't mind it making a reasonable noise for pedestrian safety, but making a noise like a worn out brake pad dragging a rotor is a bad choice.
I'm glad the 2011 has the button to where I can turn off the backup warning when backing out of garage, but I haven't went so far as to implement the modification detailed in other topics to make it default to off.
I don't mind it making a reasonable noise for pedestrian safety, but making a noise like a worn out brake pad dragging a rotor is a bad choice.
I'm glad the 2011 has the button to where I can turn off the backup warning when backing out of garage, but I haven't went so far as to implement the modification detailed in other topics to make it default to off.
HankHillNeedsALeaf
Well-known member
Would it be as simple as pulling a VSP off button from a 2011 and connecting it to the wires that are most likely still present in the 2012? If so, I wonder if we could talk some 2011 owners into selling their buttons to us 2012 owners and then head to their dealership to claim they "fell off" and get them replaced
garygid
Well-known member
Check that the 2012 has the wiring.
Test with a jumper to verify function, which might be
disabled in the 2012's firmware.
Then, just price a replacement button?
Test with a jumper to verify function, which might be
disabled in the 2012's firmware.
Then, just price a replacement button?
keydiver
Well-known member
That would be my guess also, just any momentary switch would work. Worst case is they don't have the wire in the harness anymore, so you would have to come up with an extra ECU pin to add.
sckayak
Member
My 2012 SL picked up in November is missing the VSP "OFF" switch also. However, the pin "5" on the VSP module that the switch connects to is there. I made an internal modification to the circuit to automatically disable the VSP upon startup. The disable pin is there so you can add a switch if needed.
See the following link for additional information.
"http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=3296&hilit=vsp+disable&start=150"
What you seek is usually there... you just have to take the initiative to look for it.
See the following link for additional information.
"http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=3296&hilit=vsp+disable&start=150"
What you seek is usually there... you just have to take the initiative to look for it.
garygid
Well-known member
Doesn't the VPS switch in the 2011 LEAF just turn OFF the "forward" sound, and leave the "backup" sound ON?
Or does it turn BOTH sounds OFF, as reported by some?
Thanks
Or does it turn BOTH sounds OFF, as reported by some?
Thanks
Just curious, do any of you who are trying so hard to turn off the VPS switch ever worry about the consequences of hitting someone with it intentionally turned off? Why do you think Nissian removed the switch? The liability for any reverse or slow speed pedestrian accident with it turned off is unimaginable.......and the punitive costs uncalculatable. You would loose everything you own!
sckayak
Member
garygid said:
It disables both forward and backup sounds.
sckayak
Member
youngr3 said:
Well, first off, learn to spell "Nissan", "incalculable", and correctly use the term "loose" (in this context it should be written as "lose"). If you have trouble, look at the top of any forum page for how to spell Nissan. As for the disabling of the VSP, it only operates under 15mph. It automatically cuts off after you reach 15mph. Next, I don't go off-road in my Leaf. Thus, I'm on a road. The road is for vehicle traffic, not pedestrian traffic. If you decide to walk into the road (or parking lot), it is your responsibility to "look" around to make sure a vehicle is not coming toward you before you walk into the path of a vehicle. Surely you don't walk into the path of a vehicle without looking both ways? Furthermore, today's engines run so quiet that you will hear the tire/wind noise way before the engine. But, you have to watch out at Wal-Mart for those "people from Wal-Mart" as they tend to attract trouble. So, your statement is a mute-point. The VSP issue is a political issue, not a logical one.
garygid
Well-known member
Isn't it ON up to 18 mph?
sckayak
Member
garygid said:
My bad... per the 2012 service manual... off at 19mph when accelerating, on at 16mph when decelerating. Forget to check my facts. The dark matter between my ears ain't what it used to be!
GRA
Well-known member
The VSP is there to warn "visually-impaired and other pedestrians". How precisely is the former group supposed to 'look around'?sckayak said:
And to reply to abasile, while the small number of EVs currently on the road may not be a problem, what happens when the numbers increase and it does become a significant problem?
