Nissan LEAF Update from Andy Palmer

[TonyWilliams]

I just wish I would have screamed louder, sooner, but I had dumb faith that Nissan would do the right thing.... I'm just disgusted.

I definitely saw that one coming, and I commented on it then. A rock in the hand....

 

[surfingslovak]

As someone else suggested before, they are using this warranty announcement as a firebreak against further action, and they were right. I think he had asked other owners to wait, too, so I guess we were all fooled by this wonderful news. I just wish I would have screamed louder, sooner, but I had dumb faith that Nissan would do the right thing.

Does this mean that you are unable to complete the buyback process at this point, even if that was something you preferred over the capacity warranty?

 

[jspearman]

As someone else suggested before, they are using this warranty announcement as a firebreak against further action, and they were right. I think he had asked other owners to wait, too, so I guess we were all fooled by this wonderful news. I just wish I would have screamed louder, sooner, but I had dumb faith that Nissan would do the right thing.

Does this mean that you are unable to complete the buyback process at this point, even if that was something you preferred over the capacity warranty?

I know the other person the arbitrator was talking to, and I'm curious to see what he tells them, but I'll let them speak for themselves. Tony was definitely right, and the door is now closed. I think legal action is the only way anything else will happen at this point.

My wife is very visible in her position, and everyone knows she drives an electric car. We will definitely be telling our story as a cautionary tale for anyone thinking about buying a Nissan, especially a Leaf. At this point I just want to get rid of the car and the bad mojo that it's brought into our life.

 

[KJD]

As someone else suggested before, they are using this warranty announcement as a firebreak against further action, and they were right. I think he had asked other owners to wait, too, so I guess we were all fooled by this wonderful news. I just wish I would have screamed louder, sooner, but I had dumb faith that Nissan would do the right thing.

Does this mean that you are unable to complete the buyback process at this point, even if that was something you preferred over the capacity warranty?

I know the other person the arbitrator was talking to, and I'm curious to see what he tells them, but I'll let them speak for themselves. Tony was definitely right, and the door is now closed. I think legal action is the only way anything else will happen at this point.

My wife is very visible in her position, and everyone knows she drives an electric car. We will definitely be telling our story as a cautionary tale for anyone thinking about buying a Nissan, especially a Leaf. At this point I just want to get rid of the car and the bad mojo that it's brought into our life.

Are you going to attend the Jan 8th meeting to talk about this problem ?

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=11136" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[surfingslovak]

I know the other person the arbitrator was talking to, and I'm curious to see what he tells them, but I'll let them speak for themselves. Tony was definitely right, and the door is now closed. I think legal action is the only way anything else will happen at this point.

I'm sorry to heart that. Did the arbitrator insinuate that you would have a choice of a buyback or the new remedy? Would you have a record of that conversation?

 

[palmermd]

Well since you are already in these discussions and there is not even a final warranty document published yet, it seems you should be able to continue down the original path. Then again, Nissan and Logic on this topic are not usually put together.

 

[jspearman]

Are you going to attend the Jan 8th meeting to talk about this problem ?

I'm not sure how much good it will do, but yes, I plan on attending. I would like to know if they are serious about this warranty.

What I see that they've done with this warranty is to reduce the number of cars they need to potentially cover by about 95%, since most people will never get close to 8 bars in that time frame. Probably another 50-60% of those people will never reach the threshold since they won't drive it enough to reach 8 bars. So now they are left with a small pool of cars that will trickle in over time and they can easily deny claims without creating the big storm we saw this past summer. They will cover some, certainly, but I don't feel they are making any more of a commitment now than since this mess began.

I'm writing the script now of a video I'm going to shoot and post on YouTube about how far my 10-bar car will take you under normal driving. I'm not looking forward to an 8-bar car, or even the promised 9-bar car. As I've said before, they never should have sold this car in Phoenix.

The arbitration guy said something really bizarre, and I would like to know more about this, but I was too mad to ask at the time. He said they wouldn't be installing new batteries into the affected cars, and they couldn't guarantee more than 9 bars because they would be losing capacity while being stored. Are they taking batteries off the line in Smyrna that don't quite meet quality control for new cars and then setting them aside for this purpose? I wish I would've asked more questions, but I was super mad after realizing I had been duped by Nissan.

 

[jspearman]

I know the other person the arbitrator was talking to, and I'm curious to see what he tells them, but I'll let them speak for themselves. Tony was definitely right, and the door is now closed. I think legal action is the only way anything else will happen at this point.

I'm sorry to heart that. Did the arbitrator insinuate that you would have a choice of a buyback or the new remedy? Would you have a record of that conversation?

He asked me what bank held the loan for the car, so yes, he certainly insinuated that we could pursue a buyback if the announcement wasn't satisfactory. If I hated the rest of the car I wouldn't be so patient, but I've now driven the Focus, which is the only other EV available here, and I simply don't like it nearly as much. Can't wait 6 months for a Tesla, can't afford the Tesla I really want, and I can't buy a RAV4EV here.

If I had known that the big announcement was only a legal cover for Nissan, not some kind of real solution, then I wouldn't have waited. I feel stupid, and I feel cheated.

 

[surfingslovak]

He asked me what bank held the loan for the car, so yes, he certainly insinuated that we could pursue a buyback if the announcement wasn't satisfactory.

I would recommend bringing this up at the meeting tomorrow. Also, I believe that if you had a record or a witness of what the arbitrator said, it would strengthen your case. Would your preference be a 2-year lease instead of outright ownership, much like spooka ended up with?

 

[leafkabob]

I just logged on a few minutes ago and saw Jspearman's post about his buyback being refused. As you know, I was promised a buyback in November, but agreed to wait a month to see if Nissan was going to offer a warranty. The month was extended by a week when they asked me to wait until 12/28/12.

I agreed to wait until 12/28, but I asked for, and received assurance, that I could still pursue the buyback if I wasn't satisfied with the warranty solution. Without that assurance I would not have agreed to wait.

At any rate, two minutes after I logged on here (and before I could get this post written) I got a call from the company that I will be turning the car back to. I now have an appointment for this Thursday to turn it back in and get my money back (less a mileage offset). So in my case, at least, it looks like they are going to honor their committment.

JSpearman, this is very disheartening. I completely agree with your analysis of 5% or less of owners ever being capable of taking advantage of the capacity warranty. I also agree that your options are either litigation or negative publicity.

 

[ronwright38]

I did not know about the 12 Capacity Bar's when i took lease of my 2011 SL .
when i read about the problem here in Arizona I saw Bar's they where talking
About and when I check mine after April 4 2012 is when i got it , and Before
it was sitting in the Dealer Showroom for six months and that's why i think
i never had the 12 Capacity Bar's .only 12 Bar's after Charging and I noticed
the capacity Bar's did not line up only 11 Bar's. How do i get this fixed as they put me
in a 39 Month Lease and i still have 30 Month's to go. My mileage is 14,600 miles.
I do not no if i could make it to the end of the Lease, I need the capacity to get
enough mile so I can get home to charge it.

 

[ronwright38]

How do you get in the Class action as I think i got a lemon??

 

[jspearman]

At any rate, two minutes after I logged on here (and before I could get this post written) I got a call from the company that I will be turning the car back to. I now have an appointment for this Thursday to turn it back in and get my money back (less a mileage offset). So in my case, at least, it looks like they are going to honor their committment.

I'm very happy to hear they are following through for you. I was specifically wondering about your case. Funny that they called you right after I posted! Good luck!

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

if I were you, I would get a replacement pack under warranty, then if you really hate the LEAF, sell it before any degradation sets in. I am guessing you have a few months?

not the greatest situation but it would still be a low mileage car with essentially a new battery pack and yes, I am in the camp who believes that the replacement pack will have most if not all the capacity of any other new LEAF.

 

[jspearman]

if I were you, I would get a replacement pack under warranty, then if you really hate the LEAF, sell it before any degradation sets in. I am guessing you have a few months?

not the greatest situation but it would still be a low mileage car with essentially a new battery pack and yes, I am in the camp who believes that the replacement pack will have most if not all the capacity of any other new LEAF.

The arbitrator was very adamant that the replacement packs would not be whole. I'm not sure where these packs will come from, since there aren't exactly hundreds of thousands of used Leafs on the road, but maybe they have cells taken out of a new pack to make it 9 or 10 bars? I just don't know.

My wife is sick of the situation and has now taken over. She wants to take legal action, so if any of you have talked to a lawyer, then please PM me.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Obviously a situation where you would get a replacement with 10 capacity bars would change the game completely.
I cant believe that is Nissans intention

 

[LEAFer]

The arbitrator was very adamant that the replacement packs would not be whole.

He might have said that as a CYA technique ... he would not want to be caught in a situation of overpromising. What Nissan actually installs will likely vary in capacity, but I am also in the camp thinking that it will be relatively high (much better than 9 bars).

 

[TonyWilliams]

The arbitrator was very adamant that the replacement packs would not be whole.

He might have said that as a CYA technique ... he would not want to be caught in a situation of overpromising. What Nissan actually installs will likely vary in capacity, but I am also in the camp thinking that it will be relatively high (much better than 9 bars).

Yes, I agree with this. You are most likely to get a new battery if you have a lease, and less likely if you own the car and it is close to the limit.

Very few lease cars will go below 66.24% capacity in the 39 months of a lease, even in Phoenix. If you are close to the mileage / age limits or either the warranty or lease, it will be easy for them to kick the ball down the road.

 

[TonyWilliams]

after Charging and I noticed
the capacity Bar's did not line up only 11 Bar's. How do i get this fixed as they put me
in a 39 Month Lease and i still have 30 Month's to go. My mileage is 14,600 miles.

They are not going to even CONSIDER fixing your car until you've lost 4 of those capacity bars. That's about 66.24% or less capacity of the battery.

It's very likely you'll make it to 39 months of your lease without going below that threshold, and even if you do, they can probably stonewall you until you do time out the lease.

 

[LEAFfan]

after Charging and I noticed
the capacity Bar's did not line up only 11 Bar's. How do i get this fixed as they put me
in a 39 Month Lease and i still have 30 Month's to go. My mileage is 14,600 miles.

They are not going to even CONSIDER fixing your car until you've lost 4 of those capacity bars. That's about 66.24% or less capacity of the battery.

It's very likely you'll make it to 39 months of your lease without going below that threshold, and even if you do, they can probably stonewall you until you do time out the lease.

Tony, his case is different. The dealer leased him a 2011 LEAF with a capacity bar already missing. He definitely deserves another car, one with a good battery, no degradation.