Nissan L1 EVSE third-party upgrade to both 120V and 240V

[mwalsh]

Well because of certain blog sites taking my experiment video and using it out of context (not to mention without permission), I've taken it down completely. If you still want to see it, shoot me a PM and I'll send you a private link to it.

 

[GeekEV]

I have a 50A 240V outlet in my garage for my stick welder. Does anybody know of anyone making an EVSE that will plug directly into that outlet so I can take the EVSE with me? :?: :idea:

Even an EVSE that is meant to be hard wired can have a plug put on it easily enough with parts from your local home depot. Just make sure you use a heavy enough gauge wire, and suitably insulated for outdoor use if you intend to take it with you. Also use appropriate strain relief and make sure everything is nice and tight. Strictly speaking such an EVSE is meant to be permanently attached to the wall, but...

 

[Ingineer]

I have a 50A 240V outlet in my garage for my stick welder. Does anybody know of anyone making an EVSE that will plug directly into that outlet so I can take the EVSE with me? :?: :idea:

Even an EVSE that is meant to be hard wired can have a plug put on it easily enough with parts from your local home depot. Just make sure you use a heavy enough gauge wire, and suitably insulated for outdoor use if you intend to take it with you. Also use appropriate strain relief and make sure everything is nice and tight. Strictly speaking such an EVSE is meant to be permanently attached to the wall, but...

Also: if you do make a portable EVSE out of an existing non-portable unit, make sure it's protected from the weather. Keep in mind the GFCI protection will not cover you on any of the 240V plugs you add!!!

The other thing I should warn about doing this; most of these wall-mount EVSE's are not really all that rugged, do if one gets dropped or something, it could fail and that's an expensive proposition!

 

[GeekEV]

Also: if you do make a portable EVSE out of an existing non-portable unit, make sure it's protected from the weather. Keep in mind the GFCI protection will not cover you on any of the 240V plugs you add!!!

The other thing I should warn about doing this; most of these wall-mount EVSE's are not really all that rugged, do if one gets dropped or something, it could fail and that's an expensive proposition!

Expensive for sure, plus they're kinda big/heavy.

While my original comment was vague, I know the Nissan/AV EVSE is designed for outdoor use, since that's where they're mounted at the Nissan dealerships... And I was informed (by AV) that their EVSE has a built-in GFCI - that would still work even if plugged in, no?

Please note that mine was converted to a plug, simply for convenience and upgradability's sake. I, personally, have no intention of actually taking it anywhere (too much trouble)...

 

[tbleakne]

What socket-adapter cables will be available?

The EVSE upgrade will include the installation of a standard L6-20P on the EVSE and a short adapter pigtail with and L6-20R and the standard 120V (5-15P) plug>>>>>>>>>

We will be offering a standard set of optional adapter configurations, but depending on the request, we can probably configure them how you prefer.

For safety, The EVSE performs a ground validation test upon powerup, so if the adapter or the target outlet miswired, the EVSE will indicate this with either a flashing Ready LED or the Fault LED.

-Phil

This solution would be perfect for my trips to visit out-of-town friends (I have AV cash&carry installed for day-to-day use), and I am willing to pay a full fair price for your conversion. I applaud your efforts while SPX seemingly sits on their hands month after month.

I will need a 10-30P adapter, which is common for dryer outlets (30 amps). My understanding is that the convention for this plug is to wire the center crooked pin to Neutral (white), not true ground. Is this right? Will the EVSE pass ground validation with this connection ?

I will also need a substantial length of "extension cord" for this hookup, perhaps 30'. If my understanding is correct, this cable would need L6-20R on one end and L6-20P on the other.

 

[Ingineer]

Expensive for sure, plus they're kinda big/heavy.

While my original comment was vague, I know the Nissan/AV EVSE is designed for outdoor use, since that's where they're mounted at the Nissan dealerships... And I was informed (by AV) that their EVSE has a built-in GFCI - that would still work even if plugged in, no?

Please note that mine was converted to a plug, simply for convenience and upgradability's sake. I, personally, have no intention of actually taking it anywhere (too much trouble)...

It is designed for outdoor use when wall mounted, so if it's in another position, or the wiring is above the EVSE, rather then below as it would be on the wall, water could follow the cable into the wiring entry hole and "BZZZZT!"! (Bye-Bye EVSE!)

It's also not designed to receive shock loads, and a drop could be the end of it.

The GFCI only protects the wiring PAST where it is in the circuit, so it would not cover any 240v cords going into the unit. This is why on the portable EVSE's the spec requires a very short cord.

 

[Ingineer]

This solution would be perfect for my trips to visit out-of-town friends (I have AV cash&carry installed for day-to-day use), and I am willing to pay a full fair price for your conversion. I applaud your efforts while SPX seemingly sits on their hands month after month.

I will need a 10-30P adapter, which is common for dryer outlets (30 amps). My understanding is that the convention for this plug is to wire the center crooked pin to Neutral (white), not true ground. Is this right? Will the EVSE pass ground validation with this connection ?

I will also need a substantial length of "extension cord" for this hookup, perhaps 30'. If my understanding is correct, this cable would need L6-20R on one end and L6-20P on the other.

What I recommend in this situation is to leave the adapter cable really short, but add new connectors on the cable after the EVSE. Then you can have a short convenient "E-hose" for ease of use or insert an extra length between these connectors and extend the length for those times you need it. This way all these connectors would be safe for use outdoors or in the event of a cable fault, as they would be past the EVSE control box. This also lets you keep the box inside and protected.

The other option is just to extend the "E-hose" to whatever distance you need, but the downside is a bulky cable even when you only need a short one, and more loss.

 

[LEAFer]

What would you suggest to use for "splicing" to increase the length of the existing e-hose ?
(For example: http://www.platt.com/product.aspx?zpid=286637 ??) Is there something less bulky, since 4 wires need to be spliced ?

 

[GeekEV]

It is designed for outdoor use when wall mounted, so if it's in another position, or the wiring is above the EVSE, rather then below as it would be on the wall, water could follow the cable into the wiring entry hole and "BZZZZT!"! (Bye-Bye EVSE!)

It's also not designed to receive shock loads, and a drop could be the end of it.

The GFCI only protects the wiring PAST where it is in the circuit, so it would not cover any 240v cords going into the unit. This is why on the portable EVSE's the spec requires a very short cord.

All excellent points. Thanks for the extra enlightenment on the GFCI issue, that makes sense.

 

[Electric4Me]

Doing EVSE upgrades for a small stipend isn't a very good business model, but since I've already figured out how, I figure I might as well help everyone out until there is a better alternative.

-Phil

And for that we thank you Sir!!

 

[Ingineer]

What would you suggest to use for "splicing" to increase the length of the existing e-hose ?
(For example: http://www.platt.com/product.aspx?zpid=286637 ??) Is there something less bulky, since 4 wires need to be spliced ?

I would not recommend a splice. I would connectorize it, this way you can choose the length as well.

I have devised a simple way to modify a standard twist-lock so that it becomes unique. (will no longer fit standard ones) That way you can easily make an extension and it's safe.

 

[LEAFer]

I have devised a simple way to modify a standard twist-lock so that it becomes unique.

For the e-hose ?! Pictures ? Details ?

 

[jamcl3]

There is a very simple reason why Nissan does not supply a portable 240 volt EVSE. The National Electrical Code (NEC) Article 625 forbids it. And SAE J1772 won't do anything that the NEC does not like.

Crazy as it seems, it is legal to plug an RV into a 50 amp 240 volt outlet in an RV park but it is not legal to plug in an EVSE to 240 volts in the US. Same goes for a window AC unit plugged into a 20 amp 240 volt outlet. That is currently approved for temporary connection. An EVSE is not.

Basically the only EVSE that you can plug in must operate at 120 volts, if it is 240 volts it has to be hard wired, according to the NEC.

Maybe it is not that crazy, since as others have pointed out, the old NEMA 14-50 connector is not very safe. Might be OK if you connect an electric stove with it once every 15 years or more, but it is not safe enough for daily connections and removals. You could say the same for the NEMA 6-20 on your window AC.

So good for them, trying to make the next generation of high voltage connections safer. But there will be many of us using what is available until J1772 EVSEs are ubiquitous. Here are my pictures:

http://minie458.blogspot.com/2010/09/pictures-from-our-1000-mile-trip.html

But be careful, this is a litigious society and our 240 volt outlets are not as safe as the recessed European outlets.

I wonder how Tesla is taking this on, since they do support NEMA 14-50 connections? The National Electrical Code has always been influenced by manufacturers, not just by insurance and fire departments. I expect Nissan and the others might be more willing to lobby the NEC to allow portable 240 volt EVSEs sometime in the future. They seem to have their hands full just now.

By the way, the best directory of 240 volt outlets in RV parks that I have found is Woodalls.com
If you choose Show More Search Options then you can pick the 50 amp option. And as others have said, suggest a dump station price if they don't know what to charge. But you are going to be there a long time with a Leaf. At least until someone comes up with a portable level 2 DC charger that can take in 50 amp 240 volts, the way a Tesla can with the built in charger.

 

[Randy]

Basically the only EVSE that you can plug in must operate at 120 volts, if it is 240 volts it has to be hard wired, according to the NEC.

Hmm....All the ECOtality Blinks being installed (like the one in my garage) have a 12 inch pigtail that plugs into a 50 amp 240v receptacle...

 

[dyhopper]

Basically the only EVSE that you can plug in must operate at 120 volts, if it is 240 volts it has to be hard wired, according to the NEC.

Hmm....All the ECOtality Blinks being installed (like the one in my garage) have a 12 inch pigtail that plugs into a 50 amp 240v receptacle...

They cut off the plug and hard-wired mine.

 

[Smidge204]

Basically the only EVSE that you can plug in must operate at 120 volts, if it is 240 volts it has to be hard wired, according to the NEC.

I disagree with this, as the NEC is open to interpretation.

Specifically, one can interpret the wording to mean that you are allowed to have a 240v plug-in EVSE if it was specifically designed to be. Excerpt from 2011 NEC, Pages 544 and 545 (red underlining mine):

625.18 requires the connector and cable be de-energized when disconnected from the vehicle (eg pilot signal). 625.19 requires the connector and cable be de-energized when the cable is strained (eg pull-out disconnection). By referencing 625.29 they are basically saying it has to be inside - which is probably why you can't plug your 240V EVSE into an exterior outlet.

But if it's in your garage, the NEC appears to allow the unit to be plug-installed. In the immortal words of a vendor I worked with; "I interpret the code in a way that's beneficial to me."

Article 625 in full here
=Smidge=

 

[Ingineer]

Smidge is correct, the code allows for a 240V EVSE with a plug.

Regardless of whether you find a 240V plug outside, at an RV park, etc, it's usually still only 120V above ground so the danger of a shock is not significantly higher. They put "portable" hot-tubs outside all the time with the only caveat that the 240v outlet must be protected by a GFCI. However, finding these "in the wild" are rare.

As long as you use prudence in your operation of a 240V EVSE, it should never be a problem. I'd like to think an EV owner would understand the risks and dangers, and act in a prudent manner when handling any type of power connection, EVSE or not!

 

[tps]

But be careful, this is a litigious society and our 240 volt outlets are not as safe as the recessed European outlets.

And so that's my question... Why not use the European pin-and-sleeve type connectors for our EVSE input connections. (With an appropriate NEMA adapter set for not-at-home use.) I never cared that much for Hubbell's twist-lock stuff anyway; overpriced and too easy to bend the pins.

 

[garygid]

NEC 625.13 specificly DOES allow 240v EVSEs to be used plugin IF they meet 3 "safety/usage" provisions.

However, it appears that the NEC does not allow use of the much safer European-style plugs and sockets.

However, boats and RVs seem to be able to plug in to 240v, as well as 120v.

 

[tps]

However, it appears that the NEC does not allow use of the much safer European-style plugs and sockets.

Could you quote where your reading that so we can understand it? I'm thinking of IEC 60309 connectors. Thanks.