March 2013 Nissan battery pack replacement survey.

[Stoaty]

I went with $5,000 to be happy, $3500 a bargain, not too interested at $7000. However, this is all theoretical, because I expect my Leaf to meet my needs just fine for a lot longer than 5 years (fingers crossed).

 

[thankyouOB]

what is the subject line and what does it say on the from line?
please

From: "Nissan North America, Inc." <[email protected]>
Sender: "Nissan North America, Inc." <[email protected]>
Reply-To: "Nissan North America, Inc." <[email protected]>
...
Subject: Your Feedback is Valued! Nissan LEAF Battery Survey

In the bottom of the email, there is a link "To opt-out of the Nissan LEAF Research Panel" and another "To opt-out of all Nissan communications". Perhaps some that didn't receive it opted out of that or something else?

I've definitely received other legit Leaf surveys from Nissan before (that others and I have discussed), have been to Leaf test drive events and paid the $99 deposit 2x (and been refunded both times, in the end).

thanks. i am still waiting and looking.
i have not opted out of nissan survey, so it may still arrive.

i save about 2k a year in gasoline but i wouldnt want to pay for four years of gasoline to buy a battery. i would want a greater savings.
does that make sense to others?

 

[mwalsh]

i save about 2k a year in gasoline but i wouldnt want to pay for four years of gasoline to buy a battery. i would want a greater savings.
does that make sense to others?

Yes. But saving money was not my primary goal. Getting off gasoline was my primary goal. Saving money while doing it is a bonus, but not a necessity.

 

[Becky50]

I just located my survey in my junk folder. At one time, I believe I opted out of receiving email from Nissan. Thanks to the forum, I found and will take this survey on replacement battery cost.
Becky

 

[thankyouOB]

i save about 2k a year in gasoline but i wouldnt want to pay for four years of gasoline to buy a battery. i would want a greater savings.
does that make sense to others?

Yes. But saving money was not my primary goal. Getting off gasoline was my primary goal. Saving money while doing it is a bonus, but not a necessity.

totally, agree with that.

 

[KeiJidosha]

...Funny that no mention was made of trade-in value for our existing packs, no?

I replied based on keeping the old cells. I expected a core charge question somewhere in the survey too, but it was never asked. I'd expect ~25% credit for turning in the old cells.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

no email for me and guess that is a good thing because i think the prices quoted here are outrageous.

what i am looking at is price with exchange to run from $2000 to $4000 max depending on the level of degradation and age. I see no reason to pay more than that when I am giving up a battery that has 70-75% capacity. it has a lot of value remaining.
add $300-400 labor and that should be all of it

 

[thankyouOB]

Regardless of the survey, which i dont have, the Nissan pricing must address these issues:
value of old pack on trade-in
cost of installation
cost of replacement pack
whether replacement pack is new, used or reconditioned.

also, Nissan must NOT leave us at the mercy of dealership pricing on this.
the pricing should be fixed.
from insurance coverage of battery removal for painting, we know that removal, storage and reinstall can range to some ridiculous numbers. I cant find the record for my repair but i recall 3k.

from previous thread that discussed what Chelsea should ask Nissan about battery replacement costs:
--what does a new battery cost installed?
--what does a refurbished battery cost installed?
--how does Nissan compute the value/credit for a used battery; are all used batteries equal in value if turned in?

--Finally, and most importantly, will these costs be standardized by Nissan or are we at the mercy of the dealership?

Note: Two folks on this forum (myself one of them) reported a very wide disparity for battery removal and replacement during an accident repair.
one was charged ~$3400 and the other ~$1200--different dealers working with different collision shops. the more expensive one was working with a corporate owned shop and dealership under the same national banner.

_________________

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

ok, FINALLY got the survey (was buried in the "unimportant" mail)

Assume it were possible to extend capacity loss coverage through an extended service contract.

The extended service contract would give you an additional 2 years coverage over current (total period of 7 years) at a cost of $30 a month to be paid during years 6 and 7 and cover you if capacity loss dropped below 8 bars of capacity (out of 12) and or 60%.

In this case, how interested would you be in extending your capacity loss coverage?

my answer 8. i selected the cost. at $720 for two years, more than most extended service contracts but this gives you real value should you need it.

Based on your previous responses you typically charge your Nissan LEAF to 100% and acquire approximately 74 miles range.


What is the minimum driving range that you require to meet your daily driving needs?

Example: If you require the Nissan LEAF provide 40 miles range minimum to meet your daily driving needs, please slide the bar to 40.

previously before I got my LEAF, i said 50 miles but that was before i found out how much more i would want to drive it (not a EV newbie but still caught me a bit off guard) so changed to 60

You mentioned previously that when the battery capacity is no longer covered by warranty and if you experienced capacity loss leaving you with 60 miles that you would be interested in replacing the Lithium Ion battery with a new 24kWh battery giving you approximately the same range that your Nissan LEAF had when it was new.

If Nissan offered you the opportunity to rent a battery replacement by making monthly payments for as long as you own your Nissan LEAF, instead of a one time payment, with $0 down at signing guaranteeing you at least 70% battery capacity for as long as your own your LEAF, how interested would you be in taking advantage of this offer?

7/10 tough question and wish there were comment options here. I would only rent if I could be guaranteed 80%. 70% is too low for my current situation. i would consider 25% but no lower

At what monthly payment (for as long as you own your Nissan LEAF with $0 down at signing), would you be willing to rent a new 24kWh Lithium Ion Battery?

Note: Based on this offer, if the Nissan LEAF battery capacity fell below 70%, Nissan would replace your battery at no additional charge.

Please slide the bar to indicate your ideal monthly payment.

I said $30 as ideal, no more than $50 but once again, 70% is just too low.

either way, great survey. really gives one an impression of what Nissan is looking at.

 

[planet4ever]

A bunch of you are going to hate me for this, but I have minimal interest in buying a replacement battery, and zero interest in renting one or paying for it on an installment plan. But I was forced to answer more than a dozen questions on variations of those options. I wished that I had said I would only lease, so I could have skipped all that. I ended up giving stupid answers, moving the bar just far enough to get it off zero, hoping they would get the point and throw out my answers. At least I got three chances later to say I would rather take their $2k on a new vehicle than replace the battery.

Ray

 

[adric22]

I haven't received the survey yet. I hope I do, I'd like to read the questions and offer my opinion.

I probably won't be in the market for a replacement battery either. I plan to buy out my lease at the end (which is coming up in about 13 months) but my commute is so short that I would have to have some very serious degradation before it would affect the usability of the car for me. And I think before I spent a huge amount on a new battery, I might consider getting a new EV, particularly one that charges faster or has a quick charge port (mine is L2 only). And since I still have 100% capacity after 2 years, I would imagine my leaf will be pretty darned old by the time the battery needs replacing.

But - I do think it is important to have a reasonable priced replacement for those with longer commutes. And I hope they are able to offer a trade-in value for your old battery to help offset the cost of a new one. As long as they can find a useful aftermarket for selling old Leaf batteries, this should be possible.

 

[kubel]

I'm hoping for $4500 for a replacement pack. Any more than that, and I'll stick with leasing. I really want to BUY an electric car and keep it for 10+ years, since I think they would last a long time, but with battery packs behind a huge unknown, I can't risk it. So I'm stuck with a lease.

 

[mwalsh]

Regardless of the survey, which i dont have, the Nissan pricing must address these issues:
value of old pack on trade-in
cost of installation
cost of replacement pack
whether replacement pack is new, used or reconditioned.

also, Nissan must NOT leave us at the mercy of dealership pricing on this.
the pricing should be fixed.
from insurance coverage of battery removal for painting, we know that removal, storage and reinstall can range to some ridiculous numbers. I cant find the record for my repair but i recall 3k.

from previous thread that discussed what Chelsea should ask Nissan about battery replacement costs:
--what does a new battery cost installed?
--what does a refurbished battery cost installed?
--how does Nissan compute the value/credit for a used battery; are all used batteries equal in value if turned in?

--Finally, and most importantly, will these costs be standardized by Nissan or are we at the mercy of the dealership?

Note: Two folks on this forum (myself one of them) reported a very wide disparity for battery removal and replacement during an accident repair.
one was charged ~$3400 and the other ~$1200--different dealers working with different collision shops. the more expensive one was working with a corporate owned shop and dealership under the same national banner.

_________________

We had an hours number from the service manual on battery removal that, unless I'm not recalling it properly, was only a couple to three hours. And that might have even been for R&R. So three to six hours of labor should not in any way equal more than $1000, even for the most expensive dealership out there.

 

[adric22]

I'm hoping for $4500 for a replacement pack. Any more than that, and I'll stick with leasing. I really want to BUY an electric car and keep it for 10+ years, since I think they would last a long time, but with battery packs behind a huge unknown, I can't risk it. So I'm stuck with a lease.

If they were using a standard sized battery cell (like Tesla) you'd stand a chance of being able to refurbish it yourself, or 3rd party companies popping up to do it.. but with a proprietary cell, we're screwed if Nissan doesn't provide a replacement.

 

[Stoaty]

And since I still have 100% capacity after 2 years, I would imagine my leaf will be pretty darned old by the time the battery needs replacing.

Impossible. You may still have 12 capacity bars, meaning you have over 85% capacity, but you have definitely lost capacity... unless perhaps you kept the Leaf in dry ice and never drove it.

 

[nrgrevolution]

adric 22

You may be misinformed on loss of battery capacity ( many are, and it's understandable ) see the following pictures.

http://livingleaf.info/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Battery-capacity-level-gauge.bmp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/wiki/images/thumb/8/8d/Scott_3_bars_s.jpg/400px-Scott_3_bars_s.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; This one shows 3 capacity bars gone ( the little ones to the right )

Surely hope you have all 12, but I sincerely doubt it.

 

[garygTx]

I just completed the survey. I'm leasing, but said I would buy out my lease to see the replacement battery questions. They had some interesting options, including renting a new pack. I hope this does mean they will have lots of options when they do announce the new warrenty.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

I'm hoping for $4500 for a replacement pack. Any more than that, and I'll stick with leasing. I really want to BUY an electric car and keep it for 10+ years, since I think they would last a long time, but with battery packs behind a huge unknown, I can't risk it. So I'm stuck with a lease.

you breathed too many gas fumes. it is just too funny that the automobile industry has not grasped the fact that battery technology will be changing so fast that people will only own their EVs 3-5 years due to their vehicle simply becoming technically obsolete at breakneck pace.

remember when changing your computer every 2 years was the norm? now its like every 4-5 years if that often (i am typing on a 2005 computer I built)

EVs will be the same way. auto manufacturers balked at EVs due to very low service maintenance income but what they lose in that they will regain double by a much faster turnover and they really dont have to do the work. there are millions of hands working on the better energy storage solution both big (grid storage) medium (for the car) and small (cellphones, tablets) and any major innovation in those areas will be a breakout event.

trust me, no matter what your battery does, you wont keep your LEAF for 10 years especially when 5 years from now, we will have 200 mile EVs for $20,000

 

[JeremyW]

I just filled out the survey. While I’m not exactly thinking about buying out my lease due to the unfavorable terms, I still entertain the idea from time to time. For this survey I assumed that I’d buy out the lease. I still might, if for some odd reason gas goes to $10/gal (and the value of used leafs skyrockets) and I can put in a Brusa charger like Phil has for cheap.

I’m somewhat different I guess in that my commute is about 6 miles now and was about a mile when I was up in Folsom. However because this is my only car, I really want spare range so I can get to family and friends. I assumed in my answering that I’d need about 60 miles of max range. Here’s hoping that the CHAdeMO infrastructure develops in California ( :lol: ) such that I can get away with not getting a replacement battery for some time.

I really like the rental option. I want to buy my leaf (or maybe a MY 13/14), and rent the battery. The leaf is a really good car. There is a lot they did right. Renting the battery somewhat isolates me from what they did wrong.

 

[LEAFer]

I said "lease", so did not see the additional questions. However, in response to several metioning the trade-in value: IMHO ... for the purposes of the survey only -- to simplify it -- I believe they "baked in" the trade-in value and assumed you will turn it in. With this simplification any $ discussion is intended to refer to your out-of-pocket cost.