Will you hold off for rumored 2014 LEAF?

[Gonewild]

When I hear someone who's actually bought a LEAF long distance tell me it's easy, maybe I'll be more inclined to believe them. But I did check into it at one point...

It was easy.

Bought from Fontana Nissan and had it shipped all the way from California to Florida. Last time I checked, they are still offering $2,000 off to forum members on all orphans through the end of December. Even including shipping costs, that was still $900 off MSRP for me, and given local dealers in Florida charge about a $600 "dealer service fee", it was more like $1,500 less than I could have bought locally. The car was dirty when it arrived, but once cleaned up, it was flawless.

The only restriction is that it's a cash deal. No leases.

I'll be selling my Prius to CarMax this weekend for a couple thousand dollars more than the local dealer was going to offer me as a trade-in.

Overall, a win-win on both sides of the transaction.

Many of us bought from Rairdon's in Wa and had them shipped to AZ. Dealer paid all but $150 of the shipping cost.

 

[evnow]

Rumors are rumors, but the 2014 will not have a better battery/range, etc...just the known logistics of Nissan's development argues strongly against that.

I think there might be some improvement in range (EPA, not the "100" miles). I think the evolutionary battery improvements will make it to Leaf on a yearly (or once in 2 years) - without increasing the # of cells. Ofcourse it also depends on competitive position - but the competition still looks non-existent at this point.

But I agree Nissan will keep Infiniti's range larger than Leafs.

 

[TEG]

...I read somewhere that battery production in Europe will be delayed until they have the NMC cells ready, in 2015.. no idea whats going on with the Smyrna plant. Time to send in your ninja Llamas to find out.

I heard that Smyrna will start production of 2013/2014 packs even before they are ready to make cars there.
So, it sounds like USA may start exporting some packs for a while.

 

[Leafboy]

Did you lease? What about a trade-in? Did he give you a good deal? How was it by the time you included shipping and whatever else?

No, bought mine outright. The dealer was very informed about out of state sales. All paper work was completed online except for a couple of signatures they needed. The only thing strange about it, in AZ you are required to title it in AZ first to prove that it was sold to an out of state address. I got shiping quotes that were in the range of the shipper that the dealer used to ship cars, so I let them handle the shipping also. The car left AZ and was in Atl in two days in an enclosed hauler. Delivered directly to my home. Still saved about $2K over getting a 2012 locally. Pinnacle Nissan, Scottsdale, AZ, salesman Walter Dolan.

 

[iluvmacs]

When I hear someone who's actually bought a LEAF long distance tell me it's easy, maybe I'll be more inclined to believe them. But I did check into it at one point...

It was easy.

Bought from Fontana Nissan and had it shipped all the way from California to Florida. Last time I checked, they are still offering $2,000 off to forum members on all orphans through the end of December. Even including shipping costs, that was still $900 off MSRP for me, and given local dealers in Florida charge about a $600 "dealer service fee", it was more like $1,500 less than I could have bought locally. The car was dirty when it arrived, but once cleaned up, it was flawless.

The only restriction is that it's a cash deal. No leases.

I'll be selling my Prius to CarMax this weekend for a couple thousand dollars more than the local dealer was going to offer me as a trade-in.

Overall, a win-win on both sides of the transaction.

I am in the midst of buying an orphaned 2012 SL from Fontana. Has in fact been pretty easy, albeit slightly unnerving to send out almost $40K for a car I haven't seen yet! I'm in Wisconsin, so who knows when they'd be available here "normally", and like you say, I'm still saving from what a local (at-MSRP) deal would be eventually...

And unlike you, I'm keeping my Prius

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

got to do my first QC today... there is no need for a 6.6 charger if we are getting all the QC's they say we are around here! quick charging is a beautiful thing!!! this car is amazing, just the way it is... the quick charge didn't even raise the battery temperature. truly miraculous to watch it go from 2 bars to 8 bars in 25 minutes!!!

 

[LEAFfan]

the quick charge didn't even raise the battery temperature. truly miraculous to watch it go from 2 bars to 8 bars in 25 minutes!!!

Why only 8 bars? Did you use a 'Blink' QC? If you did, you need to hit '90%' to get nine bars and close to 80% SOC. I've charged from one-two bars to nine in 24 minutes with the setting at '90%'. It only raised my temp gauge from five bars to six. When I had four bars remaining, it took close to 30 minutes.

 

[tps]

When I hear someone who's actually bought a LEAF long distance tell me it's easy, maybe I'll be more inclined to believe them. But I did check into it at one point...

It was easy.

Bought from Fontana Nissan and had it shipped all the way from California to Florida.

I am in the midst of buying an orphaned 2012 SL from Fontana.

Interesting, Danny at Fontana Nissan was one of those who I contacted a while back, and he specifically advised me NOT to buy a LEAF cross-country. Sounds as if maybe he's changed his story. Oh well, I'll be getting the LEAF I ordered from my local Nissan dealer next month, so I don't really need to worry about buying from Fontana at this point,

 

[CWO4Mann]

Speaking of QC Level 3 Chargers ... I just happened to be next to the Nissan HQ building and stopped to look at their public-use chargers. There are several L2 chargers and one L3. I had never used the L3 so decided to try it out. First it was necessary to "swipe a card". The machine had "AV" on it as the manufacturer. I tried my Blink card (all black RFID card) and it allowed me to begin charging. After I removed the charging handle and plugged it into the car, I heard a thunk sound and the dashboard blue lights flashed one, two three in a row, then all three flashes together and the unit stopped charging. The screen display on the L3 charger said "charging finished", but did not display a level of charge. I tried this action several times and each time the screen displayed "communicating with vehicle" then the message to plug in begin charging by pressing the green start button. Which I did. It immediately went through the same cycle showing "charging" and then a second or two later, "finished charging".

My car was at about 75, maybe 80% charge on the dash guessometer. When starting out this morning I had 103 miles range after the car in the garage all night as usual, plugged in.

Is this normal behavior? I am thinking maybe the car had to be below a certain charge level? The outside temperature was 33 degrees and windy. The battery temp meter was in the low blue normal range.

Appreciate any input to sooth my fevered brow.

Regards.,

Dave

 

[Leafboy]

I wouldn't put it on the 440V charger very often. It will reduce the battery life.

 

[KJD]

Rumors spreading that the MY 2014 LEAF will have a bit better battery and a lower price. If you were planning a 2012 or 2013 LEAF purchase, will this cause you to wait? If you were planning a 2012 or 2013 competitor purchase will this rumor cause you to wait?

You have got to be kidding right ?

Hell it was all I could do to wait for the 2012 model to get here. None of the dealers here in Utah have any cars for sale yet, so a couple of weeks ago I bought an orphan from Fontana Nissan in CA.

The salesman, Danny made things super easy, even shipped the car right to my driveway.

Nissan will make every new car year better than the last years model. That's how things work in the car biz. If they did not do this they would not be leading the pack right now.

KJD
120 miles on my new SL and loving every minute of it.

 

[evnow]

I wouldn't put it on the 440V charger very often. It will reduce the battery life.

No it won't - unless it is very hot. What matters is the battery temperature.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

keep in mind the 2014's should be lower priced because they will just about be out of the $7500 fed tax credit allotment. its like 200,000 then it tapers off and first cut is like 50%. now some will think Nissan wont be up to 200,000 by then, i am thinking they will. i see 100,000+ sold in 2013 maybe as much as 130,000 or so which is also the first full year the TN plant will be online as well.

 

[DarkStar]

Is this normal behavior? I am thinking maybe the car had to be below a certain charge level? The outside temperature was 33 degrees and windy. The battery temp meter was in the low blue normal range.

No, definitely not normal behavior unless there was some option on the AV unit to only select something like an 80% charge (and only if you were over that). I don't believe that timers are taken into account during a quick charge so that shouldn't cause any issues. My guess is that maybe it attempted to authorize your card but for some reason it couldn't (since it was a Blink card).

 

[saywatt]

Me too!!! I was so excited, I drove back to Issaquah in "D", as in no "Eco" with full heat after standing around out there for a couple of hours. :lol: Needless to say, when I got back up my hill, I'd spent most of the quick-juice—end range, 12.

got to do my first QC today... there is no need for a 6.6 charger if we are getting all the QC's they say we are around here! quick charging is a beautiful thing!!! this car is amazing, just the way it is... the quick charge didn't even raise the battery temperature. truly miraculous to watch it go from 2 bars to 8 bars in 25 minutes!!!

 

[TonyWilliams]

Speaking of QC Level 3 Chargers ... plugged it into the car, I heard a thunk sound and the dashboard blue lights flashed one, two three in a row, then all three flashes together and the unit stopped charging.

That's telling you that the timer is on, I think. We had an issue with the AV quick charger here, where you had to physically turn off the charge timer (not just override it). Then, they plugged it in to a different car to reset it, and then finally back in the original car.

Any of this stuff built with government handouts seems to be FULL of bugs and "features".

 

[CWO4Mann]

I wouldn't put it on the 440V charger very often. It will reduce the battery life.

Understand .. I did want to try it just this once to see if everything was working. Evidently either the Nissan HQ L3 is broken or my L3 capability inside the Leaf is broken. I'll be taking it up with the dealer if I encounter this again.

Dave

 

[gbarry42]

We had an issue with the AV quick charger here, where you had to physically turn off the charge timer (not just override it).

After all those antics, when I showed up, they were now in the "let's try an experiment" mode. So they asked me about my timers. My timer enables charging from 8pm to Noon. Since it was still morning, we attempted to charge just by plugging in. It began charging without any button-pushing on behalf of the car. I can't say I knew what the QC was doing, as it had a small display with a lot of numbers, and it was 10 feet up on the back of the truck. I did try to photograph it, but the camera shutter was faster than the display, so I didn't get much.

When the charge stopped, they told me it was at 89%. But I think it was 79%, since I had 9 bars. And more significantly, the charge ended at 11:55 AM, which is the actual time my timer terminates. It's an 80% timer, by the way. As an additional treat, we were over at the booth chatting up the Nissan folks, and my phone alerted me that the charging had stopped, same as it always does.

So, my sample-of-1 experiment suggests that QC can behave the same as L2 charging.

 

[evnow]

keep in mind the 2014's should be lower priced because they will just about be out of the $7500 fed tax credit allotment. its like 200,000 then it tapers off and first cut is like 50%. now some will think Nissan wont be up to 200,000 by then, i am thinking they will. i see 100,000+ sold in 2013 maybe as much as 130,000 or so which is also the first full year the TN plant will be online as well.

I doubt it.

Smyrna is supposed to start operations at the end of 2012 (making MY13 Leafs). My guess is, again there will be a slow rampup. I even wonder whether they may push the go live a few months and start with MY14.

In anycase, here is my guess.

MY11 : 8,000
MY12 : 10,000
MY 13 : 30,000

That still leaves over 150,000 cars before tax credit sunset will kickin. I think they will make about 50K cars for the domestic market for 3 more years befor the tax credit goes away.

MY 14 : 40,000
MY 15 : 50,000
MY 16 : 60,000

 

[tps]

keep in mind the 2014's should be lower priced because they will just about be out of the $7500 fed tax credit allotment. its like 200,000 then it tapers off and first cut is like 50%. now some will think Nissan wont be up to 200,000 by then, i am thinking they will. i see 100,000+ sold in 2013 maybe as much as 130,000 or so which is also the first full year the TN plant will be online as well.

I doubt it.

Smyrna is supposed to start operations at the end of 2012 (making MY13 Leafs). My guess is, again there will be a slow rampup. I even wonder whether they may push the go live a few months and start with MY14.

In anycase, here is my guess.

MY11 : 8,000
MY12 : 10,000
MY 13 : 30,000

That still leaves over 150,000 cars before tax credit sunset will kickin. I think they will make about 50K cars for the domestic market for 3 more years befor the tax credit goes away.

MY 14 : 40,000
MY 15 : 50,000
MY 16 : 60,000

I think the ramp-up will be faster than Evnow predicts, but not so fast that we are out of tax incentive before MY2014. It would be nice to see Oppama crank out 20K for the US market in MY2012, as they were planning to do in MY2011, and they might well have done a lot better in MY2011 if not for the tsunami. Looks as if it may be 60 days or less from order to delivery for me, if I believe the "month of January 2012" estimate. I hope that means production is ramping up, rather than demand is falling. To hit 20K they need to average 2K per month. But maybe their plan is to limit Oppama's production due to the exchange rate, and wait until Smyrna before ramping up. We'll have a clearer picture after a few months of sales number announcements from Nissan.

At least the rumor I heard last spring about the 36 states after Tier 2 having to wait for Smyrna has proven untrue. Sometimes it's hard to guess at what Nissan's current plan is; we can only know after-the-fact what they actually did.

Anyway, my view about car buying is that buying a new car is not about "bang-for-the-buck"; a good used car will always be a better deal. So I say "go for it" as soon as you can. Don't wait, hoping a better deal will come along. It might, but it might not. Which is why my LEAF order was complete within hours of when my chance to order opened.