Toyota Mirai Fuel Cell
- Thread starter RegGuheert
- Start date
Help Support My Nissan Leaf Forum:
Please provide some technical data and avoid anecdotal evidence expressed by owners on EV websites.[/quote]
Anecdotal evidence expressed by owner of a Mirai on his website,
http://www.corism.com/blog/34/2773.html
range of Mirai drops to 350km on return trip to Hokane tourist area. this contrast in the owners experience in driving on level ground.
note the units are in km not miles,
another blog (university hydrogen car maker/driver)
http://ssj3gohan.tweakblogs.net/blog/11470/why-fuel-cell-cars-dont-work-part-1
actual fuel cell efficiency curves http://www.filedropper.com/hypmhd8-200-01techspec
so yeah, the range reduction is real, it relates to a use that doesn't degrade range on EVs, its in-addition to other reasons for real world range reduction for fuel cells (degradation, adverse atmospheric conditions, etc)
Anecdotal evidence expressed by owner of a Mirai on his website,
http://www.corism.com/blog/34/2773.html
range of Mirai drops to 350km on return trip to Hokane tourist area. this contrast in the owners experience in driving on level ground.
note the units are in km not miles,
another blog (university hydrogen car maker/driver)
http://ssj3gohan.tweakblogs.net/blog/11470/why-fuel-cell-cars-dont-work-part-1
actual fuel cell efficiency curves http://www.filedropper.com/hypmhd8-200-01techspec
so yeah, the range reduction is real, it relates to a use that doesn't degrade range on EVs, its in-addition to other reasons for real world range reduction for fuel cells (degradation, adverse atmospheric conditions, etc)
ydnas7 said:
Your links are poor, e.g. one is in Japanese.
Are you implying that as the power demand (KW/HP) increases, e.g. climbing a grade, to maintain a constant
speed, that the efficiency of a FCEV decreases more than for a BEV, thus affecting range more for a FCEV?
GRA
Well-known member
Via GCC:
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2015/08/20150811-mirai.html
TonyWilliams
Well-known member
GRA said:
I'll bet Toyota makes more insurance claims for written off vehicles in a year than this! Wow, I had no idea that they weren't really going to try in Europe.
At 1000 cars per week, Tesla will produce the entire volume equivalent of Europe H2 cars in less than a day.
One day out of a year.
DNAinaGoodWay
Well-known member
TonyWilliams said:
I thought they were assembling each one by hand. Must take a little longer.
DNAinaGoodWay said:
I am a little puzzled by the constant focus on the low volume production in the short term. That is a fact. These cars are pure experiment. So is the idea that because it is not possible to make Mirais in volume on day one we should never try? I mean Tesla managed to make 2500 Roadsters by using someone elses shell in 5 years. Does that mean they should not have even tried and just quit?
DNAinaGoodWay
Well-known member
I'd rather have one hand built. Wouldn't want some machine glitch giving my car a fatal defect.
GRA
Well-known member
Can a mod _please_ move all the "why FCEVs don't make sense and never will" posts over to the H2/FCEV thread?
Then stop adding non-Mirai specific to it. :roll:GRA said:
Thread locked until further notice.
EDIT: I just spent 40 minutes reading through this thread and moving a LOT of posts which are either 100% FCEV/H2 based or at the very least the ratio of FCEV/H2 content to Mirai content was easiliy biased towards FCEV/H2 content to the H2/FCEV thread.
Absolutely zero of the posts since my last general warning have remained on topic.
Zero.
As I see it, we have a a couple choices:
1. Let the topic drift where it may.
2. Merge the Mirai and H2 / FCEV threads together.
3. Continue on as usual - and live with the poor signal to noise ratio and periodic thread clean ups.
Thoughts?
drees said:
FWIW I don't think there will be a great deal of new MIRAI related information flowing out at a great rate due to slow roll out. So if people stuck to the topic the thread may see little activity anyway. And with no disincentive and a lack of basic ability to stay on topic (because honestly there is very little content added here that addresses the Mirai specifically) maybe the most practical approach is 2?
GRA
Well-known member
Doing my best, but I'm aware that I'm often one of the worst for topic drift, or sometimes you feel you just have to reply to off-topic posts.drees said:
I count three choicesdrees said:
I much prefer #3, extra work though it may be for the mods. We have a Tucson FCEV thread, which (so far at least) mostly seems to stay on-topic (complaints about early H2 station problems aside, which drift to the general), and given some strict policing initially this one can be nudged back in the same direction. As epirali points out, given the slow roll-out this topic is bound to have a small number of posts for a while, and that's fine. I only initiate posts here to report Mirai-specific news, keeping the general stuff for that topic.GRA
Well-known member
Getting back on track, I posted this in the H2 thread when I first saw it back in April, although it should have been posted here too as it's Mirai-specific. So, without further ado, via GCC:
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2015/04/20150429-mirai.html#more
Little activity is a bonus - then you might actually see Mirai specific content if you are looking for it. Not much input and I pretty much agree with GRA and #3 for the time being so we'll leave things as they are.epirali said:
Thank you everyone for keeping this thread on topic.
Being curious about the Mirai, I signed up online expressing interest in one by going through the questionnaire.
I get all the way through despite it appearing that there will only be one fueling station 10 miles away from home (and not along my commute) at least a year from now and the nearest dealer being 60 miles away.
I start receiving daily calls last Friday and they are leaving messages asking me to call back. I finally get the chance to answer one and talk to a nice woman, but I don't get any real additional information from her, really just seems to want my permission to forward my information to the dealer who will then contact me, so I agree - maybe they have more information.
Next I receive an email from the dealer asking me for a $500 deposit and includes a 2 page document saying how H2 fueling requires special training, loss of range will occur over the life of the vehicle (but don't say how much to expect).
Hrm.
Whatever curiosity I had in the vehicle has now been effectively killed.
I get all the way through despite it appearing that there will only be one fueling station 10 miles away from home (and not along my commute) at least a year from now and the nearest dealer being 60 miles away.
I start receiving daily calls last Friday and they are leaving messages asking me to call back. I finally get the chance to answer one and talk to a nice woman, but I don't get any real additional information from her, really just seems to want my permission to forward my information to the dealer who will then contact me, so I agree - maybe they have more information.
Next I receive an email from the dealer asking me for a $500 deposit and includes a 2 page document saying how H2 fueling requires special training, loss of range will occur over the life of the vehicle (but don't say how much to expect).
Hrm.
Whatever curiosity I had in the vehicle has now been effectively killed.
drees said:
Thanks for the post, do you plan to continue the "path" for research and if you do could you please provide updates? I am very curious, and being in MD I can not even sign up. I am somewhat tempted to get one for my sister in LA just to "put my money where my mouth is" as it were.