Nissan To Install 500 More Quick Charge Stations

[cwerdna]

Mossy Nissan in San Diego has about a half dozen Nissan stores here, so they will likely have several of the "free" chargers. There's only one other Nissan dealer in the whole county, and they physically LOCK their L2 and have in the past denied charging to folks who didnt buy their LEAF there.

Gah! This is what happens when local dealers have too much freedom from corporate headquarters. Tesla has been doing this right.

Nissan dealers in the US are not owned by Nissan. From what I understand, there are franchise laws laws that prohibit automakers from owning dealers. Tesla's been getting into hot water over their stores. Google for tesla franchise laws sued.

From http://www.examiner.com/article/car-dealers-massachusetts-and-new-york-sue-to-shut-down-tesla-motors-stores" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;:

According to the National Automobile Dealers Association, “48 states prohibit or restrict factory ownership of dealerships.” However, Tesla spokeswoman Shanna Hendriks claims that its Massachusetts facility only operates as showroom and staffers direct shoppers to its Web site to make a purchase.”

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

All car dealers are independent franchises and and literally do whatever they want to do but to keep in good standing with each manufacturer they hold a license to sell, they can be required to do things as the manufacturer sees fit.

as always, the dealership can decline to participate and stop selling the brand. In the case where Nissan is providing all the financial support, the dealership may have its hands tied or it could not. its all in Nissan's court right now as to how they plan to do this.

I think they have realized the lack of infrastructure has impacted sales and it was a mistake to have relied on 3rd party vendors to have covered that gap. whether it was Tesla or the EV community, i really could care less

 

[RegGuheert]

I also hope they are not part of the eVgo network. I do not like their business model and would not pay what they are asking; no interest in their monthly plans.

+1

Even though it apprears they will be putting quick chargers exactly where we would need them, I cannot get excited about this. The reason is that I will not purchase a monthly subscription to access chargers. Unless eVgo sees their way clear to offering a pay-per-use business model, our LEAF will just have to go without quick charging.

 

[DNAinaGoodWay]

+1

$39/mon for unlimited DC QC would only work if the circumstances fit just right, otherwise it would be a waste.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

I also hope they are not part of the eVgo network. I do not like their business model and would not pay what they are asking; no interest in their monthly plans.

+1

Even though it apprears they will be putting quick chargers exactly where we would need them, I cannot get excited about this. The reason is that I will not purchase a monthly subscription to access chargers. Unless eVgo sees their way clear to offering a pay-per-use business model, our LEAF will just have to go without quick charging.

Reg (it feels weird calling you that...) back to our Yokohama discussions, I think this is a perfect opp for Nissan to provide value DIRECTLY related to LEAF ownership and YES, this would involve another card but lets allow X free charging sessions per month as part of LEAF lease/purchase.

this provides the benefit of a LEAF ownership and prevents abuse of the "free" system and yes, pay per use is the only real pay system that will work. EVgo and BP's current failures should have illustrated that well enough by now I would think

 

[MaxPower]

I'm thrilled!! In Kansas City, Missouri, we have NONE. ZIP. ZERO. NADA. Capice?
BBQ? Yep! QC? Nope. :evil:
What can I say, I've been envious of all the QC talk on this forum. It's a QC desert here and my LEAF wants a quick sip! :twisted:
Thank you Nissan!!!!!

While it is really cool to get a free quick charge, I have decided that it is generally not worth the time to travel out of my way to the QC and sit around for 30 minutes (or longer if someone is already using it). I'd rather spend the time doing something useful or fun instead. My cost for electricity is minimal, about 10 cents per kWh, or $2 for 80 miles of travel. The main reason to use a QC is for extending a trip, or rapidly getting to 50% state of charge so the trickle charger can top me off overnight (I'm still waiting for Blink to give me an estimate for the subsidized L2 EVSE.)

The bottom line for me is, it is worth $2 to save 45 minutes of my life. Once the QC network starts charging $10 a session, it will probably weed out everyone except for trip extenders and people who cannot charge at home.

Of course, if there's a working QC within walking distance of my destination, and it costs me nothing, then I'll be happy to use it at every reasonable opportunity.

John

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

John, your scenario will be the norm. I have several in my neighborhood but charge prinmarily at home because it is more convenient but with limited range, long recharge times etc sometimes i need a quick charge for local driving and this provides that safety net

 

[walterbays]

Even though it apprears they will be putting quick chargers exactly where we would need them, I cannot get excited about this. The reason is that I will not purchase a monthly subscription to access chargers. Unless eVgo sees their way clear to offering a pay-per-use business model, our LEAF will just have to go without quick charging.

As I've read the news, under the settlement agreement with the state of California NRG will be forced to operate their eVgo stations here on a pay-per-use basis. Then I'd expect they'd notice that even with lower profit per customer they get so many more customers that they make more money with a pay-per-use option. Then I'd expect they'd apply that model nationwide. Though it would be nice if Nissan would short circuit that whole process by forcing them to offer pay-per-use nationwide from the outset.

 

[rumpole]

I can't wait to see the full list of where these are going. It seems the only specific location mentioned in Washington, DC. If Nissan is smart, they won't dump all of their chargers on the west coast. What about NYC? Weren't they going to have a fleet of eNV taxis?

According to plugshare, in the US, there are no L3 chargers, east of Pittsburgh on the entire east coast, the exception being the Tesla Superchargers, which are proprietary. Its virgin unexploited territory.

As for the Washington DC area, eVgo is setting up a network of 40 of the Nissan L3's, like their networks in Dallas and Houston. I've visited the site of the first one, near the Van Ness Metro station in DC. It's next to a Walgreens. There is a banner announcing it, but so far it's a rectangular hole in the ground. Now that eVgo has announced they're using the Nissan L3's, I see why it's rectangular.

Where the L3's are really needed is between cities, like between Baltimore and Philly, Philly and NYC and NYC and Boston.

 

[Publius]

I just wish they would install one QC within my driving range, but I'm not going to hold my breath. I live in the third largest city in NY, so you would think we would have at least one QC station, but I'm lucky if I can find a Level 2 outside of a dealer. I envy the infrastructure some of you have in your home town.

 

[edatoakrun]

Better (two years) late than never...

Posted: Sat Jan 15, 2011 8:54 am

...Eventually, fast charging must be a profitable market. It will not be until a sufficient number of EVs are on the road, just as LEAF sales will not be profitable until sales number in the hundreds of thousands-at least. Nissan has made the strategic decision to absorb current vehicle production losses as it's long range profit strategy. Waiting for other entities to provide the missing piece of the LEAF, the L3 chargers, may prove to be a strategic blunder. If Nissan would only select a number of dealers in critical locations for L3 installations, for example, I think future LEAF sales prospects would be greatly improved...

I Want my (fast) DC!
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2374&start=10" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[TonyWilliams]

The bottom line for me is, it is worth $2 to save 45 minutes of my life. Once the QC network starts charging $10 a session, it will probably weed out everyone except for trip extenders and people who cannot charge at home.

Of course, if there's a working QC within walking distance of my destination, and it costs me nothing, then I'll be happy to use it at every reasonable opportunity.

John

John,

Your example is EXACTLY why the free charger model is a failure. You only compare to what is cheapest (and not what might be convenient, unless it's cheap or free).

When people REALLY need a charge, the free ones will be plenty busy as long as the Nissan dealership wants to provide you with peak Time Of Use tariff, demand fee augmented, expensive electricity for your transportation needs.

I note you made no mention of wanting to buy a GT-R or LEAF from that dealership.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

I just wish they would install one QC within my driving range, but I'm not going to hold my breath. I live in the third largest city in NY, so you would think we would have at least one QC station, but I'm lucky if I can find a Level 2 outside of a dealer. I envy the infrastructure some of you have in your home town.

Interestingly, just down the Thruway in the 5th largest city (Syracuse), we have a decent L2 infrastructure - at the mall, at another major shopping center, and downtown (walking distance to the restaurant/bar district). Trouble is, they cost $2.40/hr so almost nobody is using them.

However, as stated elsewhere, these QC stations make far more sense between cities. They should be halfway between Buffalo/Rochester, and Rochester/Syracuse. Then L2 should be deployed within the cities.

I would personally love to see a QC in Auburn, NY and Cortland, NY. These would greatly extend my range. The trouble is, they are small towns in mostly rural counties. Nissan is not likely to deploy anything there because not many live there. But thousands could be passing through, and that's what QC is for.

I'm still eagerly awaiting that list. March 31st? It can't come soon enough!

 

[GreenPowerDP]

Here is a data point about the business model for pay-for-use Quick Charging.

I was reading about the new Fuji Electric quick charger on hybridcars.com (http://www.hybridcars.com/new-fuji-electric-quick-charger-to-be-available-in-february/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false

This paragraph caught my attention:

Two months after introducing a publicly available charging station at California’s Residence Inn San Juan Capistrano, station data shows a total distribution of nearly 2 Mwh of energy, averaging five users per day.

I was very surprised to see how much use that system was getting - people are paying the money.

Personally, I hate paying for L2, but I am much more open to paying for L3.

 

[KJD]

Two months after introducing a publicly available charging station at California’s Residence Inn San Juan Capistrano, station data shows a total distribution of nearly 2 Mwh of energy, averaging five users per day.
I was very surprised to see how much use that system was getting - people are paying the money.
Personally, I hate paying for L2, but I am much more open to paying for L3.

How much does it cost to use the L3 charge station ?

 

[GreenPowerDP]

How much does it cost to use the L3 charge station ?

Chargepoint.com had this info:



EVOASIS / EVOASIS SJC
33711 Camino Capistrano, San Juan Capistrano, California 92675, United States
Notes: Please check in at front desk for assistance
Port 1: (400/400V, 62A, CHAdeMO) Available
Reservations Disabled
From 19:15:00 To 10:45:00 $10.00 per hour
All Other Times $15.00 per hour

 

[TonyWilliams]

Here is a data point about the business model for pay-for-use Quick Charging.

I was reading about the new Fuji Electric quick charger on hybridcars.com (http://www.hybridcars.com/new-fuji-electric-quick-charger-to-be-available-in-february/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false

This paragraph caught my attention:

Two months after introducing a publicly available charging station at California’s Residence Inn San Juan Capistrano, station data shows a total distribution of nearly 2 Mwh of energy, averaging five users per day.

I was very surprised to see how much use that system was getting - people are paying the money.

Most of that 2 MWh, well virtually all of it, is with the charger provided for free. Usage dropped significantly after fees were instituted.

 

[KJD]

How much does it cost to use the L3 charge station ?

Chargepoint.com had this info:
EVOASIS / EVOASIS SJC
33711 Camino Capistrano, San Juan Capistrano, California 92675, United States
Notes: Please check in at front desk for assistance
Port 1: (400/400V, 62A, CHAdeMO) Available
Reservations Disabled
From 19:15:00 To 10:45:00 $10.00 per hour
All Other Times $15.00 per hour

My guess is that 20 or 30 minutes would be all I would need most of the time. It sounds like that would cost $5.00 or less off peak and $7.50 or less during peak hours.

Sounds like a bargain to me.

 

[wsbca]

How much does it cost to use the L3 charge station ?

Chargepoint.com had this info:
EVOASIS / EVOASIS SJC
33711 Camino Capistrano, San Juan Capistrano, California 92675, United States
Notes: Please check in at front desk for assistance
Port 1: (400/400V, 62A, CHAdeMO) Available
Reservations Disabled
From 19:15:00 To 10:45:00 $10.00 per hour
All Other Times $15.00 per hour

My guess is that 20 or 30 minutes would be all I would need most of the time. It sounds like that would cost $5.00 or less off peak and $7.50 or less during peak hours.

Sounds like a bargain to me.

Do they in fact pro-rate to the minute?

 

[walterbays]

How much does it cost to use the L3 charge station ?

EVoasis gave fee schedule, typical prices, and usage stats at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=10875&p=249049#p249049

Although paying $8.50 for 12.5 kWh is almost ten times as expensive as overnight electricity at home, the availability of the EVoasis station allows me to drive the Leaf on trips that would otherwise require a gas car. Were I to "Just-Drive-The-Prius(tm)" my total gas cost would be 25% higher than my total electricity cost (home plus EVoasis) in the Leaf.