Capacity Loss on 2011-2012 LEAFs

[SilverLeaf]

Also lost a third capacity bar, yesterday (September 30, 2014). Loss was at 18,698 miles and 41.5 months. Called Leaf Support and updated my case (also notified Mike on Wiki). They were very helpful in explaining what to do when I lose my 4th bar, as far as warranty procedure.

At this time it looks quite probable that I will lose that fourth bar around this time next year. That would be about six months BEFORE the warranty expires.

188 GIDS, 14.57 kWh, 89.66 SOC, 71.24 SOH, 51.31% HX, 47.20 AHr, 91.9 temp (LEAFstat v1.2)

 

[KickinLeaf]

Lost my first capacity bar this morning, noticed when I was backing out of my driveway. Could this be this first NY leaf with a bar gone? I'll probably be in the camp where I will miss the capacity warranty

Stats: AHr=55.71 SOH=84% Hx=70.65% 10 QCs milage 35,376 delivered 4/2012 manufactured 11/2011

-Jim

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/zt8t9zbzkddwmyz/AACb4PaSirrvtYDdHJFUBNXta?dl=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[pchilds]

Lost #12 12/03/13, 17550 miles, 28 months owned. AHr=55.45, SOH=84%
Lost #11 06/15/14, 21493 miles, 34 months owned. AHr=50.70, SOH=77%
Lost #10 10/08/14, 23020 miles, 38 months owned. AHr=47.44, SOH=72%

 

[tivollix]

I just lost my first bar too and I am up North. QC, Canada.
I would have hoped that the battery would have aged slower with our cold climate.

First bar lost on 9/16/2014: 55.45AH Hx 69.98 34285KM or 21,304Miles.

If the capacity loss is linear, I will miss the warranty replacement by 6 months but I currently take great care of the battery, car is charged just before being used and stored in the shade or in cool places.

You see my battery log in my signature with battery temperature and capacity over time.

Lost my first capacity bar this morning, noticed when I was backing out of my driveway. Could this be this first NY leaf with a bar gone? I'll probably be in the camp where I will miss the capacity warranty

Stats: AHr=55.71 SOH=84% Hx=70.65% 10 QCs milage 35,376 delivered 4/2012 manufactured 11/2011

-Jim

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/zt8t9zbzkddwmyz/AACb4PaSirrvtYDdHJFUBNXta?dl=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[RegGuheert]

Lost #12 12/03/13, 17550 miles, 28 months owned. AHr=55.45, SOH=84%
Lost #11 06/15/14, 21493 miles, 34 months owned. AHr=50.70, SOH=77%
Lost #10 10/08/14, 23020 miles, 38 months owned. AHr=47.44, SOH=72%

First 28 months - 16% total loss: Average capacity loss rate: 0.57%/month
Last 10 months - 12% total loss: Average capacity loss rate: 1.2%/month

The loss rate in the past 10 months appears to be twice that seen during the first 28 months. Of course some of this is likely due to the P3227 update, but I wonder if that explains the entire increase in slope.

I'm a bit surprised the first bar in our LEAF has not disappeared yet. It is just above 55Ah right now and has been below 55.5Ah for about two months.

 

[ranss12]

I just lost my first bar too and I am up North. QC, Canada.
I would have hoped that the battery would have aged slower with our cold climate.
First bar lost on 9/16/2014: 55.45AH Hx 69.98 34285KM or 21,304Miles.

I am also surprised at your capacity loss (given your location), and found your charts very interesting. I live in upstate New York, which is presumably warmer than Quebec, and have 46,000+ miles on my 2012 LEAF. I still have all 12 bars, although my Ah is hovering in the 56.1 range and has been for about 6 weeks. I'd like to get to at least 50,000 miles before I lose #12 and figure I have a good chance now that the battery temps are consistently in the 60-70F range and will only go down in the next 3 or 4 months. I drive about 1500 miles per month, so should get to 50,000 sometime around the end of the year. I think I might have the most miles of any LEAF in NYS.

 

[pchilds]

Lost #12 12/03/13, 17550 miles, 28 months owned. AHr=55.45, SOH=84%
Lost #11 06/15/14, 21493 miles, 34 months owned. AHr=50.70, SOH=77%
Lost #10 10/08/14, 23020 miles, 38 months owned. AHr=47.44, SOH=72%

First 28 months - 16% total loss: Average capacity loss rate: 0.57%/month
Last 10 months - 12% total loss: Average capacity loss rate: 1.2%/month

The loss rate in the past 10 months appears to be twice that seen during the first 28 months. Of course some of this is likely due to the P3227 update, but I wonder if that explains the entire increase in slope.

I'm a bit surprised the first bar in our LEAF has not disappeared yet. It is just above 55Ah right now and has been below 55.5Ah for about two months.

I didn't use the LEAF from Jun to Oct of 2013, this delayed the loss of the first bar, I was down 12% at one year before P3227. I will probably lose my 4th bar before next summer starts. I have 5 stars across the board on all battery checks, have been mostly charging to 100% since losing the first bar.

 

[camasleaf]

Lost the first bar today 45500 miles. I still does not feel good. I need to start working on the range extender.

 

[DaveEV]

I didn't use the LEAF from Jun to Oct of 2013, this delayed the loss of the first bar, I was down 12% at one year before P3227. I will probably lose my 4th bar before next summer starts. I have 5 stars across the board on all battery checks, have been mostly charging to 100% since losing the first bar.

It sure seems that charging to 100% really accelerated your rate of capacity loss.

I lost my first bar sooner than you, but I still have almost 52 Ah (still hanging on to 11 bars) despite having over 32.5k miles. I suspect that when I start charging to 100% it will really accelerate capacity loss as especially on weekends it's difficult to predict exactly how much I'll drive so the pack could end up sitting at 100% for quite a while. With super off-peak TOU rates ending at 5 AM, that also tends to get extra time spent at 100%, too, every day.

How long does your car typically sit at 100% before driving?

 

[mkjayakumar]

It sure seems that charging to 100% really accelerated your rate of capacity loss.

This is a myth we need to stop spreading it more.

There is no anecdotal evidence to suggest that charging to 100% accelerates degradation, in fact I only see the opposite. Also given that Nissan has removed the 80% option, we don't have a choice. Everytime I plug in it charges to 100%

 

[nlagnew]

I lost my first bar a week ago:
car purchased Nov 8, 2011, built in August 2011. Five weeks short of 3rd birthday!
lost 12th bar: Oct 2, 2014
28410 miles
196 gids at 80% charge (I think 233 gids at 100%, but I didn't write it down to bring to computer )
55.62 Ah
70.42% Hx
84% SOH

Mostly it's been charged to 80%, never QC'd (only got one near me in the past 2 months). No garage, but my driveway is mostly in shade except for about 2 hours a day.

I still really like my car. I had hoped to get to 3 years without losing a bar, but oh, well. My poor little display looks funny and lopsided (I now realize how much I had used the 12 bars on the right to make a quick count of the SoC bars!).

 

[dhanson865]

I removed jpwhite from the 0 bars lost section and cleaned up some bad profile entries for the 0 bar loser entries but that section is at odds to the purpose of the page.

In the 1-5 bars lost sections the past entries are permanent and state when a bar was lost. In the 0 bars lost section it is temporary as the car will lose a bar eventually.

The section seems more like people in denial yelling into the wind. Should we delete those last 7 entries getting rid of the section entirely or just rename the section?

Current name is No loss of battery capacity bar(s) we could change it to Uncategorized historical data or somesuch.

 

[mwalsh]

^ I guess my 3rd bar loss didn't get into the Wiki - 7/25/14 @ 44,564 miles.

Used to be able to make the additions myself, don't seem to be able to do that anymore.

 

[TomT]

Yep, my third bar loss didn't make it either...

^ I guess my 3rd bar loss didn't get into the Wiki - 7/25/14 @ 44,564 miles.
Used to be able to make the additions myself, don't seem to be able to do that anymore.

 

[dhanson865]

I used to add 2 and 3 bar losses when I was bored at work (used to work nights and had to be there at times when there was no work to do) but now I work an earlier shift and the proxy blocks the wiki site but not the forum. So I can't update it from work and when I'm home I usually have other distractions.

I went through today and added ticktocks 4 and 5 bar losses, and brettcgb's 3 and 4 bar losses but it takes a significant post like ticktocks 5 bar loss to get me to spend free time on it.

we really need others to pick up the torch and help with the updates.

 

[yujungchang]

Lost the first bar, see signature for details. 50% L1 on the 1st year and mostly L2 on the 2nd year. QC are done in the 2nd year. 4.1 Mile/KW on dash. Drove slow(55~65 mph in general), 25 miles round trip daily, 50% highway/local and includes 1000+ ft elevation change. Parked under the shades most the time.

 

[seans]

Here is another data point. My LEAF lost its 1st capacity bar today.
Car was purchased 4/4/2012, built 2/2012, 17700 miles. 100% charging is rarely used, quick charge used once. Average charge per day is ~10kW. 98% city driving. Car is garaged except for work hours. Philadelphia, PA. LBW <15, VLBW <5, Turtle 0.

-Sean

 

[DaveEV]

Lost the 11th bar this morning.

51.56 Ah
220/181 GIDs
33700 miles
3 years, 5 months

12th bar went after 2 years, 3 months and 22,300 miles.

 

[blimpy]

Are we all now pretty clear that losing 1 bar in the 20 -30K range is pretty normal for most users in moderate climates, who don't overheat/overcharge ?

I'm studying the accumulated experiences, and the science as posted in the wiki, hoping to use that accumulated wisdom and leafspy to chose the best car I can get in the $12ishK range.

All these posts are EXTREMELY Helpful in making a mental statistical model I can use on the fly in used car lots .
Thanks..keep it up !

 

[blimpy]

I'm assuming I will end up operating my used leaf' in the predicted the 5-10 year capacity region.
say 50 % capacity. Will that mean much lower charge efficiency ( same power in-less power out ) ??? :?: :?: :?:

What do you guys with 50-75K miles see in this respect ?