Fast charging to 100%

[Desertstraw]

This issue may be resolved in earlier threads but I cannot find it. I spoke with Leaf Customer Service yesterday and was told that the car rejects any fast charging above 80%. Others in posts and one person from a company that installs fast charger insist that this is false information and you can get 100%. Has anybody in an unambiguous way charged to 100% or near it, not theory actual experience?

 

[Randy]

In my experience, it depends on the brand of DC Fast Charging station.

You cannot charge much over 80% or so on a Blink DC FC, but an Eaton unit (such as the one at Mitsubishi headquarters) will slow down, but will go all the way up to 100%. It slows down so much that I disconnected early, but it goes much father than Blink does....

 

[GregH]

This issue may be resolved in earlier threads but I cannot find it. I spoke with Leaf Customer Service yesterday and was told that the car rejects any fast charging above 80%. Others in posts and one person from a company that installs fast charger insist that this is false information and you can get 100%. Has anybody in an unambiguous way charged to 100% or near it, not theory actual experience?

The car might stop at 80% but you can restart and go higher. The Blink units say "40%, 60% or 80%" as options but if you pick 80% you really only get about 73%. The Eaton and Nissan chargers seen to be capable of going to full (or very near full) although those last 10 minutes might as well be spent on a normal L2 charger as the charge speed slows down a lot over 90%

 

[EVDRIVER]

Good way to shorten your battery life, under normal pack temps the temp knee goes up extremely fast around 80%, I would not charge past that point and it will often stop before depending on pack temps.

 

[DarkStar]

According to the Nissan Leaf service manual, if you begin quick charging below 50% SOC, the vehicle will stop charging once it reaches 80% SOC. If you start above 50% SOC, the vehicle will not stop charging unless there is an issue or the DCQC stops the charging process.

I've tested this at Eaton, ECOtality, Takasago, and Kanematsu units and it functions the same on all of them.

 

[EVDRIVER]

According to the Nissan Leaf service manual, if you begin quick charging below 50% SOC, the vehicle will stop charging once it reaches 80% SOC. If you start above 50% SOC, the vehicle will not stop charging unless there is an issue or the DCQC stops the charging process.

I've tested this at Eaton, ECOtality, Takasago, and Kanematsu units and it functions the same on all of them.

The pack BMS will override both these parameters, mine stopped at 70X the other time. But that was on a POS Blink QC. The 50 " plasma and junk design likely caused it to shut down.

 

[Desertstraw]

Good way to shorten your battery life, under normal pack temps the temp knee goes up extremely fast around 80%, I would not charge past that point and it will often stop before depending on pack temps.

A good reason to lease not buy. Based on test runs, I regard 65 miles as the realistic range of the Leaf. You can push it up a bit higher but it isn't worth it. At 80%, the range becomes 52 miles. This 13 mile difference is equivalent to almost 2 hours on an L2 charger. As a real example of how it matters, I want to drive from Phoenix to Tucson. Between the fast charger at Picacho Peak and my destination there is 42 miles. To make the return trip would require four hours of L2 charging at 80% and two hours at 100%.

 

[Pipcecil]

The AV units that eVgo uses mirror what the LEAF manual states. If you arrive below 50%, the charging will stop at ~80% (for some reason the AV display says 90%, but QCing many times, it is, indeed 80%). If you get to the QC above 50% or above it will automattically charge to 100% unless you stop it earlier.

In addition if your session ends early (i.e. you arrive with less than 50% in the pack), you can unplug and then relog in and replug back in to get the last 20%. I have done this a couple of times before.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

This issue may be resolved in earlier threads but I cannot find it. I spoke with Leaf Customer Service yesterday and was told that the car rejects any fast charging above 80%. Others in posts and one person from a company that installs fast charger insist that this is false information and you can get 100%. Has anybody in an unambiguous way charged to 100% or near it, not theory actual experience?

AV will allow you "their" 100% which actually turned out to be 92% of "capacity" which is 93.6% (LEAFs "100% charge) which works out to be 86% of the 24 kwh battery.

keep in mind, I have only done this once and it was during Summer. I strongly suspect the temperatures will move those numbers around.

other than that; fast charging rates drop very fast after the first half dozen Kwh's or so. heat buildup is cumulative especially in short periods of time and dissipates slowly. not a good idea to charge past 80% unless you absolutely have to. now with the nearly non existent fast charge network, it might not be possible for you but if you can, best thing is 15 minutes at stations position 20-30 miles apart. This is possible thru out parts of the PNW. guessing by your user name you are not in this area.

 

[camasleaf]

As I posted in another tread, the new Blink software that I saw at Walmart Wood-Village in Portland OR, charged from 73% to the full 12 bars. I do not believe it was quite the "100%" but really close. I drove at least 3-4 miles city driving with one big hill before I lost the first bar. Temperature did not changed from 5 bars.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

As I posted in another tread, the new Blink software that I saw at Walmart Wood-Village in Portland OR, charged from 73% to the full 12 bars. I do not believe it was quite the "100%" but really close. I drove at least 3-4 miles city driving with one big hill before I lost the first bar. Temperature did not changed from 5 bars.

that is close. i lose my first bar on a home full charge in 4-7 miles of city driving

 

[TEG]

In my experience, it depends on the brand of DC Fast Charging station.

You cannot charge much over 80% or so on a Blink DC FC, but an Eaton unit (such as the one at Mitsubishi headquarters) will slow down, but will go all the way up to 100%. It slows down so much that I disconnected early, but it goes much father than Blink does....

The Blink DC/QCs that I have used default to "80%", but there is an advanced/override button that lets you also pick 90% or 100%. As other have said, the on-screen % isn't exactly what the car thinks (for instance, Blink 80% is more like 75% to the LEAF). I have seen some people select 100% on the Blink, and watched as it slowed way way down on the way to 100%. For instance, the time to get from 99% to 100% was over 10 minutes... Some people don't know or maybe not care that they are baking their (leased?) battery, and seem intent on getting to the full 100% even if they have to wait a long time for it.

 

[nosuchthing]

Solid state battery is coming from Toyota in...

2020 :lol:

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

ok, dont ask me why I did this but rationalized that I had some paperwork and some files to download and cant just turn it on and let it run, have to baby sit them so I decided to do a 100% charge at the Tumwater AV tonight.

plugged in at 44% SOC. charged one hour (no one showed up so not blocking anyone) and 5 minutes. hit 80% on the car in 33 minutes. 90% in 49 minutes and finally it stopped. machine said 98%, car was at 94%! which was better than last year. temp was 52 per car dash.

paper work, file download, etc took 18 minutes. found out half the paperwork had to be printed (somewhat unusual) with hard copies to HQ and client...

only really makes it harder for me to understand why people want to get a full charge at a QC...

 

[Desertstraw]

ok, dont ask me why I did this but rationalized that I had some paperwork and some files to download and cant just turn it on and let it run, have to baby sit them so I decided to do a 100% charge at the Tumwater AV tonight.

plugged in at 44% SOC. charged one hour (no one showed up so not blocking anyone) and 5 minutes. hit 80% on the car in 33 minutes. 90% in 49 minutes and finally it stopped. machine said 98%, car was at 94%! which was better than last year. temp was 52 per car dash.

paper work, file download, etc took 18 minutes. found out half the paperwork had to be printed (somewhat unusual) with hard copies to HQ and client...

only really makes it harder for me to understand why people want to get a full charge at a QC...

You have raised more questions than you have resolved. Assuming that your numbers are correct, fast charging at above 80% is no faster than L2 charging. If this is true then why all the warnings about how harmful charging above 80% with a fast charger is to your battery? As for the harm that charging to 100% rather than 80% does, I have had my Leaf for 1 3/4 years, always charge to 100%, and still have 12 bars in this hot, Arizona climate.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Fast charging does generate more heat than regular charging but i did start and end with 5TBs. I also did start with a relatively high SOC.

 

[Desertstraw]

Fast charging does generate more heat than regular charging but i did start and end with 5TBs. I also did start with a relatively high SOC.

I do not doubt that fast charging creates more heat. But based on your test after 80% fast chargers don't fast charge, they charge at the same rate as L2.

 

[TimLee]

Fast charging does generate more heat than regular charging but i did start and end with 5TBs. I also did start with a relatively high SOC.

I do not doubt that fast charging creates more heat. But based on your test after 80% fast chargers don't fast charge, they charge at the same rate as L2.

No.
With a 2011 or 2012 LEAF that only has a 3.3 kW on board charger, the DCFC from 10/12 bars nominal 80% to 12/12 bars 100% is faster than using L2 EVSE.
Will probably take 20 to 25 minutes on DCFC.
On L2 EVSE, if LEAF has very little battery degradation could take an hour.
On my 2011 LEAF, which probably has 11% battery degradation, probably 40 minutes on L2.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Tom and Cathy tested the AV DCFC and i think they determined that the charge rate slowed to L2 rates at about 88% or so. Dont remember the exact figure but wasin the 80's.
On the display, the hundreths number changed every 2-3 seconds... Pretty slow

 

[GregH]

I do not doubt that fast charging creates more heat. But based on your test after 80% fast chargers don't fast charge, they charge at the same rate as L2.

16 minutes to get from 80% to 90% doesn't sound THAT bad.. On my 3.3kW L2 it takes about 40 minutes. I'd still go with the QC at least up to 90% if given the option (If I needed the range, say for a long trip). How do you get the advanced option for more than 80% on a Blink?