What annoys you most about driving an ICE car?

[Woosie]

Since our other car is a hybrid Highlander, driving it is not really different than the Leaf, except in two very important ways: (1) I forget to use the key to open the door, instead punching the door handle for the auto open button, and (2) I love the ease of having hands-free conversations that can be easily heard, due to the Leaf's exceptional lack of noise.

I'm very happy with the Leaf but will not purchase one until it gets better range.

 

[RonDawg]

For me it's not so much pumping the gas but seeing the $$ go up that bugs me.

One of the great benefits of driving electrically is not having to worry that some geopolitical or meteorological event is going to cause the price of fuel to suddenly spike. Electric rates can (and do) go up but it's not nearly as volatile, and depending where you are cannot be done without public hearings or some other form of government oversight.

 

[eloder]

Just playing devil's advocate. I love my little Leaf, probably add a Tesla and another Leaf to the fleet soon. But I think the majority of the comments made here about ICE vehicles stem from having driven really crappy ICE vehicles. Cars that studder and shake when turning or become grabby or turbo lag, all that sort of thing is specific to that vehicle. In the cars that we own, the ICE vehicles perform flawlessly, but they are also excellent vehicles. So comparing an excellent ICE vehicle to a pure BEV to a substandard ICE car will not work.

And to those that say the gas station is a major plus, some people like the smell of gasoline! That might be a stretch though...

True, but for very high quality gas cars you typically have to spend a lot more money.

For example, I can lease an electric smart car for $139 a month, and it can handily outperform just about every car I can afford under 50 mph.

Once you get into the upper echelons with a Tesla P85D... well, you kind of need to drop several hundred thousand to find an ICE sports car with similar performance--and those sports cars won't have room for 5+2 and tons of cargo space.

 

[mbender]

+1, and I think the contrast is only going to get more stark, due to the near inevitability of gas prices increasing and battery prices decreasing.

I maintain that eventually we will look back at gas cars similarly to how we might now look back at CRT monitors and TVs. Yeah, they work and would still work (if you could even buy one), but why would anyone buy one?! Heavy, voluminous, lower quality and more expensive resource hogs... why would anyone want that?

It might take a little more time (than what, 10 years?) because of cars' higher price and entrenched interests, but I think we all know it's going to happen. No?

 

[lkkms2]

It is amazing how noisy and rattling my ICE vehicles seem after driving my EV. Yes, almost to the point that you think something is broken/malfunctioning.

The cold starts where you get the most pollution and wear and tear on the ICE vehicles.

The exhaust smells as you drive behind or next to other ICE vehicles seems much more noticeable.

Thinking about the dollars being sent overseas since we still import around 40 percent of the oil used in the U.S.

Thinking about the dollars that could be staying in the local economy, helping the local economy, but are being sent overseas.

The "time" spent going into the car dealers to get the oil changed, and they still "overfill" it when you have specifically had the attendant write a note on the paperwork to be careful not to do so.

Better stop now - getting carried away!

 

[adric22]

I had to drive my parent's some place the other day in their Honda CR-V. It's a relatively new car. But it was awful. It was especially bad sitting at stop lights because of the idle vibration. But also when taking off, I kept thinking there was something wrong with the transmission because it seemed like I just couldn't get any take-off power unless I pushed the pedal so far down that it caused it to downshift and then it was so terribly noisy.

The Leaf certainly has the fastest throttle response of any car that I've driven. Even my Volt takes longer to respond, even though it technically has a faster 0-60 than the Leaf.

 

[forummm]

The fact that it burns gas, is noisy, dirty, and smelly. I wish everyone around me drove electric for those same reasons. Even counting pollutants from power plants, electric cars are cleaner overall. But the added benefit of moving pollution away from vehicle cabin air intake is great for health.

 

[minispeed]

For me it's not so much pumping the gas but seeing the $$ go up that bugs me.

One of the great benefits of driving electrically is not having to worry that some geopolitical or meteorological event is going to cause the price of fuel to suddenly spike. Electric rates can (and do) go up but it's not nearly as volatile, and depending where you are cannot be done without public hearings or some other form of government oversight.

Yes but the trade off is power outages and maybe waking up in the morning without enough juice to make it to work.

 

[alanlarson]

The static and poor reception on the radio in AM mode in the Jetta. VW antenna modules have an apparently-well-known problem with moisture ruining them in just a bit longer than the car warranty.

I hope the Leaf doesn't have the same problem in 2 -3 years.

 

[eloder]

For me it's not so much pumping the gas but seeing the $$ go up that bugs me.

One of the great benefits of driving electrically is not having to worry that some geopolitical or meteorological event is going to cause the price of fuel to suddenly spike. Electric rates can (and do) go up but it's not nearly as volatile, and depending where you are cannot be done without public hearings or some other form of government oversight.

Yes but the trade off is power outages and maybe waking up in the morning without enough juice to make it to work.

The same thing can happen to gas cars. No power to stations, no gas.

You can buy solar panels and a battery, and still fuel up your car in a power outage.

 

[mbender]

The static and poor reception on the radio in AM mode in the Jetta. VW antenna modules have an apparently-well-known problem with moisture ruining them in just a bit longer than the car warranty.

I hope the Leaf doesn't have the same problem in 2 -3 years.

Well, that's hardly a selling point that will make it to the PowerPoint, if you know what I mean. ;-) Besides have you ever tried to listen to AM while quick charging? OMGLOL!

Yes but the trade off is power outages and maybe waking up in the morning without enough juice to make it to work.

I have a hard time believing that anyone here worries about power outages "stranding them at home". If any electric utility in a "first-world country" can't keep up with this slow-motion increase in demand, that would be pretty sad. I wonder if any entity is keeping track of increased power outages due solely to EV charging. And if there is, I'd bet it you could count the number of such outages (in one year, in the U.S.) on one hand.

 

[2k1Toaster]

True, but for very high quality gas cars you typically have to spend a lot more money.

For example, I can lease an electric smart car for $139 a month, and it can handily outperform just about every car I can afford under 50 mph.

Once you get into the upper echelons with a Tesla P85D... well, you kind of need to drop several hundred thousand to find an ICE sports car with similar performance--and those sports cars won't have room for 5+2 and tons of cargo space.

I don't think you need "very high quality" gas cars to compete with lots of the crap that people have owned in this thread. It is the same thing as the mac vs. pc debates. When you buy a $400 PC, don't expect it to work the same as a $2000 PC, which is all a mac is. I have $4K PC's and they outperform a mac in every possible way, but it was twice as expensive as one and an order of magnitude more expensive than the crap most people buy at WalMart.

The fact is these are not things that annoy people when driving an ICE car. It is things that annoy people when driving a crappy ICE car. That's a fair comparison to make, but make that comparison. The Leaf is not the best car out there, nor is it even the best EV out there. But even a low-end EV like the Leaf is miles above a low-end ICE as this thread points out. But a high-end ICE beats the Leaf in most ways and addresses almost everything mentioned in this thread.

I've been out in California this week driving a rental, and while it is an OK car it is very irritating to have gear shifts, noise, rattles, that sort of thing. Not present in my Leaf (BEV), or Prius (HEV), or RX450h (HEV).

 

[minispeed]

Yes but the trade off is power outages and maybe waking up in the morning without enough juice to make it to work.

I have a hard time believing that anyone here worries about power outages "stranding them at home". If any electric utility in a "first-world country" can't keep up with this slow-motion increase in demand, that would be pretty sad. I wonder if any entity is keeping track of increased power outages due solely to EV charging. And if there is, I'd bet it you could count the number of such outages (in one year, in the U.S.) on one hand.

The context of my quote was in response to major events causing the price of gas to spike and costing you more money. Those are less rare than a power outage is and in most power outages your ICE car would have enough fuel to at least make it to an area with power to get gas. My point was that with an EV you're insulated from the price fluctuations of gas but IF something bad happens, especially in the middle of the night while your sleeping and maybe counting on a timer to start a charge, then that affects you. You'll pay for it in time not money and that can be worse for some people. I would also expect most power outages to happen from things like lightning taking out transformers and trees falling on lines. Those can easily leave a few blocks without power for 12 hours. I did not mean to imply that the EV would be the cause of the power outage.

 

[eloder]

The context of my quote was in response to major events causing the price of gas to spike and costing you more money. Those are less rare than a power outage is and in most power outages your ICE car would have enough fuel to at least make it to an area with power to get gas. My point was that with an EV you're insulated from the price fluctuations of gas but IF something bad happens, especially in the middle of the night while your sleeping and maybe counting on a timer to start a charge, then that affects you. You'll pay for it in time not money and that can be worse for some people. I would also expect most power outages to happen from things like lightning taking out transformers and trees falling on lines. Those can easily leave a few blocks without power for 12 hours. I did not mean to imply that the EV would be the cause of the power outage.

You don't need a major event for gas to spike. Gas in my area will regularly increase 20% in cost overnight.

That doesn't change the point, though, that you can put solar cells on your home and still charge an EV. No matter what you do, you can't safely/legally keep around substantial amounts of gas for a similar situation. Those concerns also disappear completely as the next gen of EV comes around or for current Tesla owners. In fact, long-range EVs which can charge every single night, would be far less vulnerable to power outtages as you may find your nearest gas station affected by a power outtage when at 20% of a tank, whereas an EV starts daily at 100%.

 

[RonDawg]

The context of my quote was in response to major events causing the price of gas to spike and costing you more money. Those are less rare than a power outage is and in most power outages your ICE car would have enough fuel to at least make it to an area with power to get gas.

I don't know about in your area, but in my area gasoline has spiked (meaning over 20 cent/gallon increase within a week or less) far more often than the power has gone out. It's been years since the power went out for more than two hours (usually do to demand overload on very hot days), and the last time it was out overnight was due to a fire breaking out a block away which caused the building to collapse onto the power lines. Even during the 1994 Northridge Earthquake I didn't lose power.

Even if I didn't have an ICEV as a backup, I'll take my chances.

 

[NeilBlanchard]

What annoys me, now that the weather is getting a bit warmer, is the smell of the exhaust of all the cars around me.

Today, at various points driving our Leaf and e-Golf, I saw 3 other Leafs, a Tesla, 2 Volts, and a Fit EV - all in one day! It is great to have more EV's on the road, but still not enough to escape smelly exhaust.

 

[kubel]

Dislike:

Throttle lag.
Lack of linear power.
Harshness of transmission.
Vibration from motor.
Fumes.
Refueling.
-Cost.
-Time.
-Discomfort, particularly due to babysitting the pump in extreme cold.
-Having to go some place other than home to fill up, usually in an unsafe area.
Noise.
Maintenance.


Like:

Power.
Fun, not that an EV is no fun, it's just a different fun.
Roar of the V8. Sometimes I miss it.
Freedom of range.
Heat. Lots and lots of heat.

I can get all these "likes" in an EV, but not for $5,000. Gas cars, particularly Ford Panthers, are cheap fun.

 

[2k1Toaster]

Dislike:
Throttle lag.
Lack of linear power.
Harshness of transmission.
Vibration from motor.
Fumes.

None are problems on the RX450h.

Refueling.
-Cost.
-Time.
-Discomfort, particularly due to babysitting the pump in extreme cold.
-Having to go some place other than home to fill up, usually in an unsafe area.

Cost is pretty low nowadays. Probably will be for at least a year or two. Really not much time, a couple minutes every week? Never had discomfort at the pump. Maybe you are in a state where the pump lock switch is removed so you have to be there the entire time. Here you click it and you're done. If it is super cold, you spend the rest of the time cleaning the dirt off the windows and then it's done. The petrol station here on the way home at the bottom of "the hill".

Noise.

RX450h is quieter than the Leaf.

Maintenance.

Yup. This is really the only one.

I don't think people are going to get more EV rollout by stretching the truths to people. In general, the only benefit to an EV to an ICE car to an average person is that there is essentially no maintenance. Going to gas stations and stuff like that is so ingrained in habits, that just saying it is a con will be written off because they have never experienced life without it. And frankly the car market is driven by those with nicer vehicles. Those then eventually wind up for sale every few years as used. But if they weren't bought at a high price of being new, they wouldn't be there to be bought used later. So trying to compare noise, power, and things like that needs to be done with a higher end model than a Versa or something. If you gave people the choice of a Leaf or an RX450h, I can almost guarantee that almost everyone would take the RX450h. Remember, money is the last factor in these sorts of things so price doesn't matter.

 

[GetOffYourGas]

Dislike:
Throttle lag.
Lack of linear power.
Harshness of transmission.
Vibration from motor.
Fumes.

None are problems on the RX450h.

Fumes are ALWAYS a problem. You may not notice them with your RX450h, but the car is emitting them nonetheless. The title of the thread is "what annoys you about driving an ICE car", not "what can we use to convince others BEVs are superior".

The most annoying thing to me about an ICE car is burning gasoline, and all the unavoidable things that go with it. That means that I'm emitting toxic and climate-changing gasses. It also means that I am buying a largely imported fuel, which supports not-so-friendly nations. It also means that I am literally burning up a non-renewable resource, and handing my children an emptier bag. I'd prefer to hand my children a better world than I inherited, not a worse one.

 

[EdmondLeaf]

Just playing devil's advocate. I love my little Leaf, probably add a Tesla and another Leaf to the fleet soon. But I think the majority of the comments made here about ICE vehicles stem from having driven really crappy ICE vehicles. Cars that studder and shake when turning or become grabby or turbo lag, all that sort of thing is specific to that vehicle. In the cars that we own, the ICE vehicles perform flawlessly, but they are also excellent vehicles. So comparing an excellent ICE vehicle to a pure BEV to a substandard ICE car will not work.

And to those that say the gas station is a major plus, some people like the smell of gasoline! That might be a stretch though...

I think is about time to say EV is just another car, very efficient one, and great to have more transportation choices. ICE is not dead and won't be dead for quite a while. ICE is great for long distance travel, I do not need to stop for long time to recharge/refuel. ICE and EV for me just serve different purpose as of now. Even with Tesla recharging to full, takes about 2 h, for some maybe needed to stop and rest every 200 miles, but that will not work for me. Just different application.