Some people will never get it...

[cwerdna]

Here is something I've seen work. Mention how healthy it is not to be going to the gas station and inhaling all the fumes.

Kinda on a tangent... if you have Netflix streaming, there's a show called My Strange Addiction. There's an ep (season 2, ep 4) featuring a woman who's addicted to sniffing gasoline. She has former water bottles of gasoline all over the place so she can have a whiff when she wants. As you could imagine she has memory problems and I'm pretty sure she has brain damage from it.

There's another where a woman's addicted to drinking gasoline! IIRC, she sniffs some and has at least a few teaspoons a day... It's season 3, ep 7.

 

[johnrhansen]

Last winter in the snow was enough to get me hooked on the leaf.

 

[TomT]

Why? It is really a very average snow car...

Last winter in the snow was enough to get me hooked on the leaf.

 

[johnrhansen]

Because my last rig was a 2wd toyota pickup.

 

[davidcary]

Why? It is really a very average snow car...

Last winter in the snow was enough to get me hooked on the leaf.

Compared to what? TC on an EV is always better. A low COG really helps I think. A wouldn't call it "very average".

 

[DNAinaGoodWay]

An EV is very good at driving slow and steady, and that's helpful in snow, ice, and slush.

But that's not what I first thought of when I read, "hooked on the leaf".

 

[DNAinaGoodWay]

. . . and she said she wasn't impressed with a car that could only drive 300 miles on a charge. "We'd have to charge it all the time!" she said. "What if we have to drive farther than that?"

Don't you hate it when you can only get 300 miles from a full charge?

I don't suppose the Super Chargers in Toronto, Cornwall, or even Toledo would sway her.

 

[TomT]

Ah, OK. Next to that almost anything else is great in snow! :lol:

Because my last rig was a 2wd toyota pickup.

 

[GRA]

Because my last rig was a 2wd toyota pickup.

Ah, OK. Next to that almost anything else is great in snow! :lol

That's what sandbags are for

 

[GRA]

On those infrequent occasions when I need to fill a gas tank when returning from a long trip, I use our "neighborhood" gas station and never wait. I don't mind paying an extra $0.20/gallon just to be in a nicer environment that's as convenient as can be. I'm pretty sure I spend more time plugging/unplugging the LEAF and messing with charging timers than if I just filled the Prius with gas a couple of times per month instead. It's well worth charging the LEAF, and I don't like smelling gasoline fumes, but I can sort of understand the mass-market objections to plugging in. Therefore, I have to agree with GRA that inductive charging is a worthwhile innovation even though it's less efficient. The key is to overcome potential EV owners' initial hesitation. Once that's accomplished, the superiority of the EV driving experience is often enough to keep owners hooked.

For those who are interested, via ievs.com:

"WiTricity To Host Introductory Webinar On Highly Resonant Wireless Power Transfer Technology"

http://insideevs.com/witricity-host-introductory-webinar-highly-resonant-wireless-power-transfer-technology/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[Nubo]

I assume you make more than minimum wage, so wasting 20 minutes of your time waiting at Costco to save a few cents/gallon hardly seems like a good exchange.

On those infrequent occasions when I need to fill a gas tank when returning from a long trip, I use our "neighborhood" gas station and never wait. I don't mind paying an extra $0.20/gallon just to be in a nicer environment that's as convenient as can be. I'm pretty sure I spend more time plugging/unplugging the LEAF and messing with charging timers than if I just filled the Prius with gas a couple of times per month instead. It's well worth charging the LEAF, and I don't like smelling gasoline fumes, but I can sort of understand the mass-market objections to plugging in.

I guess everyone's setup is different. For our LEAF, the EVSE is right next to the garage door. I park, get out of the car, walk towards the garage door, grab the charging plug off its hook, turn and click it in. There's no walking and it's a one-hand job since you can flip the cover with the end of the j-plug. No more than 5 seconds of my time, and in the privacy and comfort of my own garage. No inclement weather, no waiting, no fumes, no traffic noises whizzing past. No advertisements blaring at me (the captive audience). No recalcitrant pumps or card-readers. No displays that are unreadable from vandalism or boneheaded employees scrubbing them with steel wool. No broken receipt printers, no entering of zip codes, no "card declined see attendant". No $60 admission to this pageant.

Likewise, my total time involved in procuring gasoline was almost never the proverbial 5-minute pit-stop that so many folks imagine. There was always time diverting from my route, extra stop lights, stop signs, sometimes getting off the freeway and back on, etc… There was sometimes a wait. I can tell you that on those mornings where I suddenly realized I HAD to get gas, it never seemed to make me *just* 5 minutes late.

To me, there simply isn't a comparison. It doesn't even make sense to try to sum up the total time of my 5-second plug and unplug activities to compare "total time per year". Personal time just doesn't work like that; it's not a mathematic puzzle. A few seconds on the way in the door is simply a totally different world than going out of my way to stand in the cold rain at a dreary filling station and shovel money into the coffers of Exxon or BP. There is no equating these 2 different paradigms. And the "convenience" of getting a full tank every (x)00 miles quite simply does not compare to starting EACH DAY with a full tank and having the "fuel" magically deposited into your "tank" by angels while you sleep.

 

[johnrhansen]

Because my last rig was a 2wd toyota pickup.

Ah, OK. Next to that almost anything else is great in snow! :lol

That's what sandbags are for

Yes, I had those. And snow tires. Once I used them it worked alright. But the leaf is still better without either of those.

 

[abasile]

I guess everyone's setup is different. For our LEAF, the EVSE is right next to the garage door. I park, get out of the car, walk towards the garage door, grab the charging plug off its hook, turn and click it in. There's no walking and it's a one-hand job since you can flip the cover with the end of the j-plug. No more than 5 seconds of my time, and in the privacy and comfort of my own garage. No inclement weather, no waiting, no fumes, no traffic noises whizzing past. No advertisements blaring at me (the captive audience). No recalcitrant pumps or card-readers. No displays that are unreadable from vandalism or boneheaded employees scrubbing them with steel wool. No broken receipt printers, no entering of zip codes, no "card declined see attendant". No $60 admission to this pageant.

Likewise, my total time involved in procuring gasoline was almost never the proverbial 5-minute pit-stop that so many folks imagine. There was always time diverting from my route, extra stop lights, stop signs, sometimes getting off the freeway and back on, etc… There was sometimes a wait. I can tell you that on those mornings where I suddenly realized I HAD to get gas, it never seemed to make me *just* 5 minutes late.

To me, there simply isn't a comparison. It doesn't even make sense to try to sum up the total time of my 5-second plug and unplug activities to compare "total time per year". Personal time just doesn't work like that; it's not a mathematic puzzle. A few seconds on the way in the door is simply a totally different world than going out of my way to stand in the cold rain at a dreary filling station and shovel money into the coffers of Exxon or BP. There is no equating these 2 different paradigms. And the "convenience" of getting a full tank every (x)00 miles quite simply does not compare to starting EACH DAY with a full tank and having the "fuel" magically deposited into your "tank" by angels while you sleep.

Don't get me wrong - it gives me far more pleasure to plug in. However, as my "neighborhood" gas station is very well maintained and is in a beautiful, safe, uncrowded, semi-rural area, buying gas actually is very easy and fast, and a gas car can be driven hundreds of miles before one even has to think about range or stopping for fuel. By comparison, plugging in daily is seen by much of the general public as a hassle because it's one more thing to have to think about. Here, we know that plugging in is truly quite painless and that it's a nice feeling to wake up to a "full" battery each day. But a great many are not so easy to convince on this point. Features like inductive charging, more range per charge, and faster charging might not be "essential" for most use cases, but they provide psychological benefits to would-be EV drivers.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Don't know if its just a local thing or what but Costco here has recently expanded their station hours opening much earlier in the morning. I just went there this morning. no waiting at all. there were actually 4 pumps to choose from. Now, I "could" select a station closer but I am not going to pick any station just because its supposedly a "better" use of my time.

I live on a street surrounded by the Woodland Creek Wetland Preserve so the nearest option going in either direction is either 2.8 miles to the 7-Eleven on Marvin Road which is has a very large parking lot (set for probably a half dozen tenants but currently only 7-Eleven is there)

or the MUCH less desirable option of the Arco on Sleater-Kinney and Martin Way 2 miles away. This is a very busy intersection and the station is frequently busy but open 24/7 so I would go there during off hours (easy in my job) so a wait would be minimal. This station has a 10 cent per gallon (or more) credit card penalty. There is MUCH more traffic and traffic controls going this way over 7-Eleven currently. A left turn from stop, two a traffic light, 2 school zones, etc. 7-Eleven only has two traffic circles

OR I could just go to Costco which passes by 7-Eleven and does get into the congestion on the South side of I-5 a bit but there is a convenient left to make that goes behind Costco thru their shipping and receiving area directly to the gas station. This saves at least 5 minutes during the congestion of the day.

This morning there was very little congestion and the wait at the two traffic lights was less than normal as well. But the total 8.4 mile round trip still took 27 minutes. Now, people will tell me (several times in fact!) that I am wasting my time and there is no doubt in my mind that they could follow me around and point out several other wastes of my time.

To me, time management is a game of minimizing the damage. the same amount of time in various points of my life holds a much different value than others. Comparing a random 27 minutes of my time to the most valuable time set in my day is a game I choose not to play. But its the most convenient excuse for people who choose not to think about what I have to say and prefer a standard knee jerk response. Because of this; I get gas when its convenient for me to do it and NEVER at anytime else since I got my LEAF, period.

Now for the most part, everyone who relies on gasoline as their primary source of movement, gets gas when it has to be done forcing them to take more valuable time from their lives to do so. The gas I got this morning I do not plan to use a drop of it until Friday but I am NOT going to get up even 5 minutes earlier to get it when I am already getting up at 3:45 AM. By incorporating anything with my morning gasoline trip, I have essentially "monetized" my time this morning and this is what I would normally do but did not in order to get a realistic roundtrip time.

So back to my statement in paragraph one. The two gas stations I mention I have or had a personal relationship with the franchisees. I work for an auditing company that has 7-Eleven as a client so I have audited the Marvin Road location several times. They also own two more locations in Tacoma. Very nice people but they have almost no relationship with the entity that sells gas so my buying gas there does not help them at all. They are paid a monthly service fee but the gasoline part of the business is wholly owned by the oil company. Since there is no "card penalty" most of the transactions are done by credit card so they are only responsible for the cash transactions. What I do do and I say this at the risk of the rath of the "Good Parent" God and that is take my Son there nearly every weekend to get a Slurpee because they do make money on every one they sell.

The Arco Station is a different story. I used to know the owners there about 20 years ago, but they have long since been forced out of the business and now live in CA. Originally their daughter told me they moved to CA because her grandparents were sick and that was true but it was only later I found out they moved because Arco changed the way they paid out to franchisees and saddled the franchisees with a bigger portion of the cost of keeping stations up to code. WA State has one the most restrictive requirements for storage and containment anywhere in the country and he was basically forced out. It was finding this out that really made me understand why Arco stations were failing. Within a 20 mile radius there are currently 5 stations that are shuttered. All these stations were very high volume and cheap! so the location was good and wondered why they have sat empty for so long. But the one at Sleater-Kinney survives and pretty sure its a corporate store. I have not been in there for going on 6-7 years but when driving my Prius, if paying cash you had to go inside pay more than you expected to buy, then fill up then go back inside to get your change or just pay by CC. Since my driving the Prius was to show how cheap it could be, willingly paying more for something was simply not an option.

Now, this post is long and for a reason. It has become clear to me that this issue is very much a surface one and we all have reasons for doing what we do. Like Abasile who visits his local station. He likely does it because he has formed a relationship with the people who work there. Waaay back in the day I had a house on acres in the countryside. The only gas station for about 6-7 miles was the one on the "major" (the only one actually) intersection a few miles from my house. It was also a convenience store and the primary residences in the areas were farms. Every morning, I would stop in for coffee on my way to work. There was always at least 4-6 guys standing around talking with Ben the owner. It was a sad day when Ben finally sold the place and retired. But I happened to stop in there about a year ago and there were 4-6 guys standing around talking with the new owners; a family of Korean persuasion. Somethings never change.

Finally (ya, almost done) to really illustrate how invaluable my "gasoline retrieval" time truly is. I work on the road and my company pays for that time to commute. so ya, they actually DO PAY ME to stop and get gas, so it benefits me to "spend" (HA!!) that extra time getting gas... but it is simply not to be. I have not billed my company for the time to get gas since I got my LEAF...

ah no wonder I am stuck in middle class!

 

[gbarry42]

My EVSE also does not try to sell me a car wash each time I want to use it.

Plugging in may be something I actually have to do, and maybe you could evaluate the time spent, but you should watch me make a cup of coffee! Now, there's some time investment. Suddenly, plugging in the car seems insignificant.

As to the original post, it seems maybe she did not drive the car. That could make all the difference. And live with an EV in your garage for a week, suddenly you realize a lot of things you would never have thought of. Maybe she saw the price tag. A lot of objections are excuses, and aren't addressing the real concern.

 

[thankyouOB]

Don't get me wrong - it gives me far more pleasure to plug in. However, as my "neighborhood" gas station is very well maintained and is in a beautiful, safe, uncrowded, semi-rural area, buying gas actually is very easy and fast, and a gas car can be driven hundreds of miles before one even has to think about range or stopping for fuel. By comparison, plugging in daily is seen by much of the general public as a hassle because it's one more thing to have to think about. Here, we know that plugging in is truly quite painless and that it's a nice feeling to wake up to a "full" battery each day. But a great many are not so easy to convince on this point. Features like inductive charging, more range per charge, and faster charging might not be "essential" for most use cases, but they provide psychological benefits to would-be EV drivers.

i think it is more complicated than that; they all have phones and most have laptops, so they understand the need, pathways and how to recharge.
if someone is so - let's just say - odd, that he/she cannot conceive of a Tesla as the second car to a MB because range, then perhaps she/he is just too odd to own a Tesla or any EV.
good riddance and i hope the dont forget how to swallow food.

 

[abasile]

I think there's something to be said for taking stated objections at face value rather than attempting to judge the underlying intent.

I know some very well-meaning people who like the idea of driving electric but honestly don't think they could handle the extra "hassle" and planning. Generally they have other challenges in life that they regard as higher priorities. It is for these people that it is worth making it as easy as possible to drive electric, even though their perceived needs might seem ridiculous to many of us.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

I think there's something to be said for taking stated objections at face value rather than attempting to judge the underlying intent.

I know some very well-meaning people who like the idea of driving electric but honestly don't think they could handle the extra "hassle" and planning. Generally they have other challenges in life that they regard as higher priorities. It is for these people that it is worth making it as easy as possible to drive electric, even though their perceived needs might seem ridiculous to many of us.

this is something I have sensed as well. Its hard for me to understand as EVing has transcended beyond a mode of transportation for me into a hobby. I hesitate to mention this anywhere but here but I always feel a small sense of giddiness growing as we near the end of every month because then I know I can plug my monthly driving stats into my spreadsheet and see how much I saved this month. it truly is not work!

 

[DNAinaGoodWay]

I think there's something to be said for taking stated objections at face value rather than attempting to judge the underlying intent.

I know some very well-meaning people who like the idea of driving electric but honestly don't think they could handle the extra "hassle" and planning. Generally they have other challenges in life that they regard as higher priorities. It is for these people that it is worth making it as easy as possible to drive electric, even though their perceived needs might seem ridiculous to many of us.

A very reasonable thought, but, assuming the price point of the Telsa is not the issue for a couple with two MBs, there is no other EV available that will have less of a hassle factor. With the husband's 40 mile RT commute, he can go for days without charging, and they'd still have an MB for trips where there are no SCs. It would be different if they were talking about a LEAF, but here I think she just really doesn't get it, and so, he won't get it.

 

[Nubo]

I think there's something to be said for taking stated objections at face value rather than attempting to judge the underlying intent.

I know some very well-meaning people who like the idea of driving electric but honestly don't think they could handle the extra "hassle" and planning. Generally they have other challenges in life that they regard as higher priorities. It is for these people that it is worth making it as easy as possible to drive electric, even though their perceived needs might seem ridiculous to many of us.

this is something I have sensed as well. Its hard for me to understand as EVing has transcended beyond a mode of transportation for me into a hobby. I hesitate to mention this anywhere but here but I always feel a small sense of giddiness growing as we near the end of every month because then I know I can plug my monthly driving stats into my spreadsheet and see how much I saved this month. it truly is not work!

Agreed. The emotional aspect is the major part of it. For me, plugging in is liberating for multiple reasons, while pumping gasoline is a drag, for converse reasons. So the seconds that tick by are definitely the lesser issue. For someone not used to plugging in, I can see that it would be viewed as an unfamiliar and distasteful chore that's "s'posed'ta be good for you". And maybe all the worse because of it. All I can offer to them is "Try it. You'll like it"!