Shocked by Nissan Leaf

[MikeD]

topaz420: My simplistic understanding of the purpose of an "equipment ground" on a electrical device is that it 1) be connected to all of the external metal parts of that device. And 2) the separate equipment ground wire in the receptacle should lead back eventually to a grounded electrode at your main breaker box. If this is properly done then normally a user touching any of those external metal parts can't get shocked from one of those metal parts being electrically energized, because the circuit breaker should have detected a short circuit condition and quickly tripped (since the equipment ground wire should have very low resistance).

My guess is that your EVSE outlet is not the only one on its circuit (like is highly recommended because it avoids the scenario I'm about to describe, among other things). If I'm correct, because of this I am guessing that you also have a "broken ground" (i.e. the circuit's ground wire doesn't lead back to a grounded electrode like it should) and that another device on that same circuit is defectively energizing its equipment ground (and the equipment ground of all other devices downstream like your EVSE's outlet).

Now I may be completely wrong about your situation, but what I outline above can occur, I believe, so it is worth discussing if it helps people understand a bit more how things can go wrong if your wiring isn't following code.

 

[palmermd]

I'm trying to figure out how you got 120v on the thumb-switch. That switch shown here as S3 has 5v from the car on it to detect if the plug is inserted and if it is latched. There has to be something more than just a ground issue to get power onto the metal latch and thumb-switch.

edit: after writing this and then looking again, it looks like the 5v signal is grounded. I'm not sure if that is the AC power ground or an isolated ground for the 5v, but if it is the power inlet ground and the ground wire has a potential applied on it, then it is possible to put that power onto the thumb-switch. Seems odd that the switch is physically connected to the conductor. Usually there is some sort of plastic isolation between the button and the contact with the conductors.

I'm curious as to what you discover with the electricians when they take a look at your house wiring, and what Nissan finds with the EVSE testing.

 

[topaz420]

edit: after writing this and then looking again, it looks like the 5v signal is grounded. I'm not sure if that is the AC power ground or an isolated ground for the 5v, but if it is the power inlet ground and the ground wire has a potential applied on it, then it is possible to put that power onto the thumb-switch. Seems odd that the switch is physically connected to the conductor. Usually there is some sort of plastic isolation between the button and the contact with the conductors.

I don't know if this helps solve the mystery, but I don't recall feeling the current until I plugged it into the car -- although that could just be because of the way I hold the connector (my thumb doesn't normally touch the silver button until I plug it into the car)

 

[LeftieBiker]

I've been shocked with 240V back when I used to live in France (in your case it was *only* 120V).

A little digression: 120 volts is actually considered *more* dangerous than 240, because it is more likely to stop the heart.

 

[chris1howell]

Should I have myself checked out by a doctor for this to make sure I didn't damage myself in some way? Shouldn't Nissan pay for that? (I don't have medical insurance)

I've always had health-related anxiety so this incident is really freaking me out
l

I am sorry but this sounds fishy to me. The shiny "metal" latch is made of plastic and even though it is shinny (fake chrome) it is NOT conductive. I just tested it... The shock described is also typical of a DC shock not AC... The highest DC voltage is 12v is the pilot, not enough to do as the OP describes even if the latch was conductive (and it isn't).

 

[smkettner]

I am not buying the cool-aid either. Needs to be verified by a non electrophobe.

 

[topaz420]

Should I have myself checked out by a doctor for this to make sure I didn't damage myself in some way? Shouldn't Nissan pay for that? (I don't have medical insurance)

I've always had health-related anxiety so this incident is really freaking me out
l

I am sorry but this sounds fishy to me. The shiny "metal" latch is made of plastic and even though it is shinny (fake chrome) it is NOT conductive. I just tested it... The shock described is also typical of a DC shock not AC... The highest DC voltage is 12v is the pilot, not enough to do as the OP describes even if the latch was conductive (and it isn't).

Fishy how, as in I'm imagining or making this up? Although I don't make hundreds of posts, I've been a member of this community for years, I absolutely love my Leaf and would get another one in a minute

I assumed it was the 'metal' latch because of its appearance, but somehow, something let the current get to me.

If you have any ideas of what it could be I'd be glad to hear them

 

[topaz420]

I am not buying the cool-aid either. Needs to be verified by a non electrophobe.

I'm not an 'electrophobe', I'm someone who doesn't emotionally deal well with actual health issues - that doesn't mean I have ever imagined or invented them.

 

[chris1howell]

Absolutly have the car and charge cord checked out. If they find nothing maybe even an electrician to check the outlet. The handle is not likely to be able to shock but maybe something is wrong with the car.

 

[palmermd]

The shiny "metal" latch is made of plastic and even though it is shinny (fake chrome) it is NOT conductive. I just tested it...

The original yazaki plug says that the latch is metal. I believe that the nissan brick came with the original yazaki plug.

http://charge.yazaki-group.com/english/pdf/AC_INFRA%20ASSEMBLY.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[chris1howell]

The shiny "metal" latch is made of plastic and even though it is shinny (fake chrome) it is NOT conductive. I just tested it...

The original yazaki plug says that the latch is metal. I believe that the nissan brick came with the original yazaki plug.

http://charge.yazaki-group.com/english/pdf/AC_INFRA%20ASSEMBLY.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You are right... I just went out and rechecked 2011 leaf adaptor with yazaki handle. I cleaned my probes both the button and latch are conductive.

 

[MikeD]

So did the conductivity of the external nozzle parts end, say in 2013 with the narrower control box? Has anyone verified this?
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Another thing that might be discussed in connection with this OP is that in order to feel a shock from an electrical source, your body must complete a circuit, i.e. usually not only be touching an electrically energized (aka "hot") conductive part but also a grounded source. One's environment is safer if you can remove both of those sources from incidental contact or reduce the likelihood of contact. If you have a damp floor or driveway, it helps to wear rubber soled shoes (preferably that haven't worn through and have a hole!).

I believe this is why all of the EVSEs that I have seen a photo of introduced since 2011 appear to not have metal parts (or at least prominent metal parts) that allow incidental user contact. My understanding is that "codes" would require them to be connected to their equipment ground -- see paragraph before why this is undesirable.

Now allowing running metal conduit (which allows incidental contact) on a wall to an EVSE appears to be a compromise, because NEC requires that conduit to be connected to ground. Presumably because a vehicle could run into/damage the conduit that conduit cannot be nonconducting PVC because it doesn't protect the wiring sufficiently. (BTW I don't know why one couldn't protect the user from incidental contact by enclosing the conduit in a nonconducting transparent vinyl tubing).

BTW, this is why direct wired EVSEs are safer than those using a plug. Besides allowing incidental contact access to a "hot" source when plugging/unplugging, the receptacle itself is often allows even greater incidental contact with a ground since a surface mounted box is required to be metal (and grounded), again to protect the wiring.

 

[johnrhansen]

You can have ground fault protection without an equipment ground. the way this protection works is that the system senses the current in (hot) and the current out (neutral) and if the difference in current at any moment is greater than 5 ma (the threshold to when you feel a shock) it trips the current off.

In all my years of wiring, i've never seen a hot ground reverse. You'd have to be beyond stupid to wire a receptacle this way

 

[palmermd]

... I am guessing that you also have a "broken ground" (i.e. the circuit's ground wire doesn't lead back to a grounded electrode like it should) and that another device on that same circuit is defectively energizing its equipment ground (and the equipment ground of all other devices downstream like your EVSE's outlet).

You can have ground fault protection without an equipment ground. the way this protection works is that the system senses the current in (hot) and the current out (neutral) and if the difference in current at any moment is greater than 5 ma (the threshold to when you feel a shock) it trips the current off.

In all my years of wiring, i've never seen a hot ground reverse. You'd have to be beyond stupid to wire a receptacle this way

So his theory is that the garage outlet is not protected by a GFCI, and that there are two additional things wrong with the circuit. Ground is not connected to anything, and another piece of equipment is allowing some voltage to be applied to the ground wire. On top of that the metal button and latch on the EVSE handle is not isolated from the low voltage signal wiring that it is switching; and the low voltage signals are referencing the same ground as the incoming power. While this is a very complicated theory, it is not out of the question, which is why, at this point it is important for an electrician to take a look at the wiring of the outlet in question so we can get some real answers instead of speculating.

 

[Stoaty]

I am not buying the cool-aid either. Needs to be verified by a non electrophobe.

Hey guys don't be jumping on the OP here. Something significant happened to him. Why not await further data (electrician findings, Nissan test of EVSE) before reaching any conclusions?

 

[topaz420]

The outlet was specifically installed several years ago on a "high-amp" circuit (don't know the specifics) as was required at the time to power a home refilling station for a CNG vehicle. I think we even had to pull a permit to install it? Don't know if that changes anything

Thanks everyone for your input - the electrician is coming on Monday

 

[davewill]

The outlet was specifically installed several years ago on a "high-amp" circuit (don't know the specifics) as was required at the time to power a home refilling station for a CNG vehicle. I think we even had to pull a permit to install it? Don't know if that changes anything

Thanks everyone for your input - the electrician is coming on Monday

Assuming you didn't have to use an adapter to plug in the EVSE, it's probably 5-20 outlet (120v 20a circuit) and probably dedicated...and no, that doesn't change anything except that it's probably not a wear and tear problem, being fairly new. On the plus side, since it's likely the only outlet on the circuit, this could be easily converted to a 240v outlet for faster charging, but you probably aren't too much into that right now.

 

[mkjayakumar]

When is the lawyer coming?

 

[Ingineer]

The Gen 1 Nissan (Panasonic made) EVSE used on the 2011-2012 LEAF has a J1772 handle made by Yazaki. The handle does have a cast metal alloy release button/lever, however while the metal is indeed conductive, it is not electrically connected to anything. All the electrically hot parts inside the handle are double insulated, (to external points) and there is no direct conduction path to them, even assuming the handle is full of dirty water. A low enough resistance path from any electrically hot conductor to deliver an electric shock would require the handle to be damaged, (user abuse) and it would also have to have a substantial amount of dirty water present.

This handle design is one of the best ever made, and I've routinely seen them survive drive-over events as well as all kinds of abuse without any damage that could deliver an electric shock.

In addition, the electrically hot parts in the handle that are protected from the user by double insulation are also behind a GFCI (Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter) which would detect any shock that well before it could be dangerous to a person (though still felt) and shut off the AC power in the handle.

On top of all this there would have to be a complete circuit established from the handle through the "victim" and returning to ground or some other point referenced to the AC power system to which the EVSE is connected.

In short, I don't believe there is any danger, even with a damaged and/or wet handle.

We've had quite a few customers whose dogs have chewed through the cable, and even while their LEAF was charging, there has been zero canine injuries or fatalities. The GFCI always interrupts the power before anything bad can happen.

-Phil

 

[Flashman]

Can a Mod change the title of this thread please?
"Electrocuted" is a horrible misnomer for this topic.
Nobody died and it leave's a bad mark on folks coming to this forum to get accurate information.
Next thing you know, this thread will be in the news... Nissan Leaf kills owner!!