Resale valuation impact of "Buyback/Lemon" status

[Aussie]

Hi all,

I'm new here. I am hoping to legitimise my membership with a purchase of a Leaf in the next few weeks! It will be our second car, so we still have the ICE SUV for longer trips / weekend trips etc.

I'm looking at a 2013 SV for sale at a local dealership. It is priced attractively, however has a "Buyback / Lemon" history on the carfax. After a morning of digging (including multiple calls to both the Nissan EV hotline and the dealership that bought the vehicle back). The dealership confirmed that it was bought back after failing to engage power mode. The dealership replaced both the Power Distribution Module and HV Battery in August 2015 and tested it for 2 days with no issues. It was then sold at auction (to my local dealership).

The vehicle comes with a 12 month warranty from the buyback date (August).

To me this would be a significant plus if I were expecting to own the vehicle for 5+ years, however there is a reasonable likelihood that I will have to sell in 2 (if we decide to move back to Australia).

Questions for the forum.

• How would you value a vehicle that had this status, and how do you think it would affect its market value?
  
  Do you think it would have had the Lizard battery installed? Is there any way to check?

This EV newb appreciates any advice he can get!

Aussie

 

[LeftieBiker]

You need to confirm both that it has the 2015 battery and that the drive issue has been resolved. If the warranty allows the same kind of buy-back within, say, 30 days then it might be a good deal.

 

[otbiker]

Unfortunately, there's no way to confirm its been fixed for good. Two days of "testing" means nothing to me. I have an experience with a buyback...

Replacing the PDM makes sense. I wonder if they replaced the high voltage battery or the 12 volt battery. Replacing the high voltage pack would be a very expensive "what if"

One thing to check / consider is, does your state "brand" the title as a lemon? If it does, the value of the vehicle is significantly decreased.

 

[Aussie]

Unfortunately, there's no way to confirm its been fixed for good. Two days of "testing" means nothing to me. I have an experience with a buyback...

Replacing the PDM makes sense. I wonder if they replaced the high voltage battery or the 12 volt battery. Replacing the high voltage pack would be a very expensive "what if"

One thing to check / consider is, does your state "brand" the title as a lemon? If it does, the value of the vehicle is significantly decreased.

It's our second car and I can always catch the train to work, so if they have to have another crack at fixing it then I can live with that. It is still covered under 10 months basic warranty.

HV battery vs 12V battery is a very good point and one I hadn't considered. I will call the dealership back to confirm.

The title is branded "Lemon", so I imagine resale would take quite a hit. Any guesses as to what % I would be looking at?

 

[Aussie]

You need to confirm both that it has the 2015 battery and that the drive issue has been resolved. If the warranty allows the same kind of buy-back within, say, 30 days then it might be a good deal.

It still has 10 months of basic warranty. There is no buy-back warranty for me (it's sold as a buyback/lemon title), but if issues come up then they will fix them.

 

[Aussie]

I have just verbally confirmed that it was the HV battery which was replaced by the dealership.

 

[csleaf]

What is the price they are asking? Does it have quick charge package?

 

[LeftieBiker]

First, you have to ask yourself if a low price and a new 2015 battery pack is worth the possible hassles involved. You seem to have answered that in the affirmative, but be sure. Then, offer them what *you* consider to be a great, but not unattainably low, price. It sounds like they will have trouble selling this car, so what they are asking for it should be more negotiable than usual.

 

[Reddy]

make sure that you get the 24 kwh battery replacement in writing. There is a large thread on MNL where a dealer "said" they replaced the battery, but really didn't. It took a lawsuit threat, but eventually came clean. Do a search and see if you can find it. Edit: Here is the thread:
http://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=19811&hilit=recording#p424005

 

[Aussie]

make sure that you get the 24 kwh battery replacement in writing. There is a large thread on MNL where a dealer "said" they replaced the battery, but really didn't. It took a lawsuit threat, but eventually came clean. Do a search and see if you can find it. Edit: Here is the thread:
http://mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=19811&hilit=recording#p424005

I can't get anything in writing unfortunately. It's just been my sleuthing. The local dealership (not a Nissan dealership) who is selling the car bought it at auction. Nissan San Francisco were the dealership who bought it back and implemented the repair prior to selling it at auction. Their service department confirmed twice over the phone that the EV battery and PDM were replaced, but couldn't / wouldn't send me anything in writing (something to do with privacy and me not being the owner at the time of repair). The battery meter shows all 12 capacity segments (although I understand that it is possible to reset this).

On the positive side Nissan SFO has no incentive to misrepresent the repair as they are not the ones selling the vehicle. So I am inclined to believe them.

 

[Aussie]

What is the price they are asking? Does it have quick charge package?

It does have QC. Asking price was 11.9 but we've agreed on 10.6. Paperwork not yet signed.

 

[csleaf]

It does have QC. Asking price was 11.9 but we've agreed on 10.6. Paperwork not yet signed.

That seems high if it has a branded title. But maybe a lemon buyback isn't as detrimental as a salvage title.

 

[Aussie]

I've got an idea to confirm the battery replacement. If I can get the serial off the battery and call the EV hotline they should be able to confirm the type of battery.

Anyone know if the battery serial number is readable whilst it is installed?

 

[caffeinekid]

It seems that there have been plenty of people reporting here who have bought 2013 SV for somewhere in the $9000s, and those were not blemished titles. While condition is relative, that seems like a reasonable resale price for anything other than the SL.

I have seen several lemon/buybacks on eBay listed from some seller in New Jersey, and he posts the repair paperwork as well. I believe they have typically been AC reliability and starting/loss of power issue-related.

 

[Aussie]

It seems that there have been plenty of people reporting here who have bought 2013 SV for somewhere in the $9000s, and those were not blemished titles. While condition is relative, that seems like a reasonable resale price for anything other than the SL.

I have seen several lemon/buybacks on eBay listed from some seller in New Jersey, and he posts the repair paperwork as well. I believe they have typically been AC reliability and starting/loss of power issue-related.

I haven't seen anything in that price range here in north Texas. Even the S model seem to be asking $11+. Perhaps worth looking at transport...

 

[Reddy]

In case nobody mentioned it, you should get the LeafSpy app and OBDII reader and check the battery. A new battery should be in the 54 Ahr range and a degraded 2013 might be in the 48-50 Ahr range.

 

[Aussie]

Ok, I've managed to get a copy of the Service - Comm history from a very helpful local Nissan dealership. See below for the relevant entry.



Service manager told me the HV battery had been replaced. I'm not sure as it's not listed under the parts replaced. I'm guessing R&I means Remove and Inspect. Anyone seen operation JQ01AA?

 

[davewill]

I wouldn't touch it with a ten-foot pole unless the price were REALLY low, like $6-8K low. There are good deals out there without the headache and worry. Pass on this.

 

[Aussie]

I wouldn't touch it with a ten-foot pole unless the price were REALLY low, like $6-8K low. There are good deals out there without the headache and worry. Pass on this.

Thanks Dave.

I'm struggling to find any well priced Leaf's down here in NorthTexas. People on the forum are mentioning '13 SV's in the $10's. Can anyone point me in the right direction to find these deals...I'm happy to travel or freight if required.

 

[csleaf]

Thanks Dave.

I'm struggling to find any well priced Leaf's down here in NorthTexas. People on the forum are mentioning '13 SV's in the $10's. Can anyone point me in the right direction to find these deals...I'm happy to travel or freight if required.

There are several '13s on eBay but the SV's look to be above $11k. But I think you'd really want to check the battery with LeafSpy before buying any. Hard to do via eBay.

If you can confirm the work done on the lemon Leaf maybe you can negotiate the price down under $9k. At auction that car had to have been discounted.