range extender

[Deleted member 3147]

The charging station will inform the vehicle the maximum current that the vehicle can draw from the charging station. The vehicle does NOT ask for maximum current in level 2 standard. In Level 3 charging, the vehicle will ask for constant current level. So just make sure the charging station or outlet can supply sufficient current for both chargers. We tested the kit and there is no issue with that.

Is there an easy way to disable your charger if the EVSE only supplies 16 amps? Better yet, do you monitor the pilot signal and disable your charger if the pilot indicates less than 21 amps?

 

[richard]

This opens up some really exciting possibilities.

Just as some dealers have dropped LEAF prices by $5K or so, one could use that savings to pick up a LEAF with a 28 or 32 kWh pack, closer to the size of a CODA's.

And Enginer also offers a DC/AC inverter option (http://www.enginer.us/view.php/news-sample-1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false. With that, we could have a LEAFUPS to power the house during an outage, or the ability to power an EVSE (roadside assistance for a stranded EV).

Very cool. Keep the details coming, please..

 

[ztanos]

this gives me hope for the future. GM CEO recently talked about a new battery in the testing stage which might be out in 3 years. It boost the battery to 400+kwh/g while the current leaf is somewhere around 100kwh/g.

Our aux pack can use any advanced batteries as they come out. You don't need to replace the OEM traction pack.

Let me clear this up a little. What's being asked is this:

First: Tony wants to know if you have a work around to charge your extender on J1772 while the main traction battery is on QC.
Second: N952JL is asking if you would consider making replacement traction batteries when technology gets better. I wouldn't want to keep the same traction battery in the car if your range extender has advanced to the point where it's better than my original battery.

 

[chenyj]

Let me clear this up a little. What's being asked is this:

First: Tony wants to know if you have a work around to charge your extender on J1772 while the main traction battery is on QC.
Second: N952JL is asking if you would consider making replacement traction batteries when technology gets better. I wouldn't want to keep the same traction battery in the car if your range extender has advanced to the point where it's better than my original battery.

1) Yes, if you wan to charge the aux pack while the main pack is on QC, you can simple purchase a J1772 adapter from us.
2) It is up to the owner. Replacing the traction pack would cost significantly, not only on the battery itself. It also requires a new BMS, on-board charger and charging control, etc.

 

[ztanos]

Let me clear this up a little. What's being asked is this:

First: Tony wants to know if you have a work around to charge your extender on J1772 while the main traction battery is on QC.
Second: N952JL is asking if you would consider making replacement traction batteries when technology gets better. I wouldn't want to keep the same traction battery in the car if your range extender has advanced to the point where it's better than my original battery.

1) Yes, if you wan to charge the aux pack while the main pack is on QC, you can simple purchase a J1772 adapter from us.
2) It is up to the owner. Replacing the traction pack would cost significantly, not only on the battery itself. It also requires a new BMS, on-board charger and charging control, etc.

1) So it can charge at the same time? You are saying two different things.
2) He's saying that it would be a good opportunity for a 3rd party to step in at that point. I was curious if you had any plans to pursue that route in the future.

 

[chenyj]

Let me clear this up a little. What's being asked is this:

First: Tony wants to know if you have a work around to charge your extender on J1772 while the main traction battery is on QC.
Second: N952JL is asking if you would consider making replacement traction batteries when technology gets better. I wouldn't want to keep the same traction battery in the car if your range extender has advanced to the point where it's better than my original battery.

1) Yes, if you wan to charge the aux pack while the main pack is on QC, you can simple purchase a J1772 adapter from us.
2) It is up to the owner. Replacing the traction pack would cost significantly, not only on the battery itself. It also requires a new BMS, on-board charger and charging control, etc.

1) So it can charge at the same time? You are saying two different things.
2) He's saying that it would be a good opportunity for a 3rd party to step in at that point. I was curious if you had any plans to pursue that route in the future.

1) With a separate J1772 adapter connected to our Enginer charger, the auxiliary pack can be charged with level 2 port while the main pack is in QC.
2) It depends on the battery development and the market demand. I expect that it would be a few years out when the original traction batteries are weakening. Then it really makes economical sense to do so.

 

[GeekEV]

Our 48V pack has a separate charging that takes 240V from the existing J1772 port. When you charge the Leaf, you will charge the Enginer aux pack as well.

You seem to be missing the point of the question, which is that some LEAFs have a CHAdeMO DC Quick Charge port. When that port is used to charge, will the Enginer pack also be charged? That is to say, is your pack literally connected to the J1772 port lines before the native charger, or is it pulling off the raw DC feed after the native charger? In which case both batteries would be charged off either the J1772 or CHAdeMO DC Quick Charge ports. Your posts would seem to indicate NO since you keep saying J1772.

EDIT: It looks like you've already answered this while I was typing my reply. In which case I have a new question, could you build such a convert into the kit natively so nothing special is required from the end-user's perspective?

 

[chenyj]

Our 48V pack has a separate charging that takes 240V from the existing J1772 port. When you charge the Leaf, you will charge the Enginer aux pack as well.

You seem to be missing the point of the question, which is that some LEAFs have a CHAdeMO DC Quick Charge port. When that port is used to charge, will the Enginer pack also be charged? That is to say, is your pack literally connected to the J1772 port lines before the native charger, or is it pulling off the raw DC feed after the native charger? In which case both batteries would be charged off either the J1772 or CHAdeMO DC Quick Charge ports. Your posts would seem to indicate NO since you keep saying J1772.

EDIT: It looks like you've already answered this while I was typing my reply. In which case I have a new question, could you build such a convert into the kit natively so nothing special is required from the end-user's perspective?

Our auxiliary pack can not be charged via the CHAdeMO DC Quick Charge port as it is. Doing that is technically possible but it depends on the demand and the number of DC QC stations are available to justify the investment to develop such feature.

 

[charlestonleafer]

Will leaf owners qualify for the 30% tax credit!!??!!??

 

[mckemie]

Since Enginer has solved the main problems, it seems a small step to make a trailer with a significant size battery. Just install the wiring in the Leaf and then a connector to the trailer. The trailer could be 40kwh for about 1000 pounds or 80kwh for about 2000 pounds. It might need to be charged through a separate AC connection. The wiring and connector would have to be pretty robust.

A slick (aerodynamically) trailer would mean not a lot of additional drag. Range might go above 200 miles (40kwh) or about 350 miles (80kwh).

 

[chenyj]

Will leaf owners qualify for the 30% tax credit!!??!!??

The Enginer kit comes with complimentary solar panel and inverter for backup power source. This SOLAR powered system is qualified for 30% Federal tax credit according to the IRS rules.

 

[chenyj]

Since Enginer has solved the main problems, it seems a small step to make a trailer with a significant size battery. Just install the wiring in the Leaf and then a connector to the trailer. The trailer could be 40kwh for about 1000 pounds or 80kwh for about 2000 pounds. It might need to be charged through a separate AC connection. The wiring and connector would have to be pretty robust.

A slick (aerodynamically) trailer would mean not a lot of additional drag. Range might go above 200 miles (40kwh) or about 350 miles (80kwh).

Absolutely, multiple DC/DC converters can be used in parallel to increase the throughput if larger pack is deployed. We have used three 8KWH kits in parallel in a Gen 1 Prius in the Green Glen Prix this year and won the best fuel economy title against Chevy Volt, Plug-in Prius and other converted Prius during the 104 miles race. That is the same size as Nissan Leaf's pack.

 

[RegGuheert]

Yes, that is correct. The total current will be 21A @ 240V or 22A @ 120V

I wonder how you would ever manage to charge at 22A @ 120V. Most portable EVSEs will limit the current to 80% of the plug rating, which means 12A.

So, what happens when I plug into 120V for a convenience charge and the EVSE sets the limit at 12A? Do the two chargers share the current, or does the AUX battery simply not charge?

 

[chenyj]

Yes, that is correct. The total current will be 21A @ 240V or 22A @ 120V

I wonder how you would ever manage to charge at 22A @ 120V. Most portable EVSEs will limit the current to 80% of the plug rating, which means 12A.

So, what happens when I plug into 120V for a convenience charge and the EVSE sets the limit at 12A? Do the two chargers share the current, or does the AUX battery simply not charge?

You can easily turn off the aux pack circuit and just charge the traction battery if you have limited current source. Once the traction pack is full, you can charge the aux pack.

 

[richard]

Something is wrong with these numbers... If the 24Kwh pack in the Leaf is good for 73 EPA miles, and assuming that only 21 Kwh is actually usable, adding an additional 8Kwh is only going to add about 27 miles, not 40... If more than 21Kwh is usable, the improvement will be even less.

We use the same way Nissan estimates "an estimated range of up to 100 miles[*] on a full charge." method. As everyone knows, the actual range mostly depends on driving speed. 21 usable Kwh / 100 miles = 210 wh / mile.

That's the old LA4 driving cycle which is very optimistic. The EPA now uses a much more conservative "5-cycle" method (http://www.solarjourneyusa.com/EVdistanceAnalysis4.php)

Based on the new EPA efficiency numbers for the LEAF, the following rates should be used:
City: 320 wh/mi
Highway: 370 wh/mi
Combined: 340 wh/mi

With 4 kWh of usable auxiliary power, this should take the LEAF from an EPA range of 73 mi to:
City: 86 mi
Highway: 84 mi
Combined: 85 mi

8 kWh of aux battery should take the LEAF to an EPA range of:
City: 98 mi
Highway: 95 mi
Combined: 97 mi

 

[TonyWilliams]

Based on the new EPA efficiency numbers for the LEAF, the following rates should be used:
City: 320 wh/mi
Highway: 370 wh/mi
Combined: 340 wh/mi

With 4 kWh of usable auxiliary power, this should take the LEAF from an EPA range of 73 mi to:
City: 86 mi
Highway: 84 mi
Combined: 85 mi

8 kWh of aux battery should take the LEAF to an EPA range of:
City: 98 mi
Highway: 95 mi
Combined: 97 mi

You're not factoring in losses by one battery charging another.

 

[RegGuheert]

Yes, that is correct. The total current will be 21A @ 240V or 22A @ 120V

I wonder how you would ever manage to charge at 22A @ 120V. Most portable EVSEs will limit the current to 80% of the plug rating, which means 12A.

So, what happens when I plug into 120V for a convenience charge and the EVSE sets the limit at 12A? Do the two chargers share the current, or does the AUX battery simply not charge?

You can easily turn off the aux pack circuit and just charge the traction battery if you have limited current source. Once the traction pack is full, you can charge the aux pack.

Thanks! Sounds reasonable.

 

[TonyWilliams]

Turning off the aux battery will work well for driving 80 miles to that first DC charger, and after DC charging, you have full capacity to go 80 miles plus the aux battery range.

 

[richard]

You're not factoring in losses by one battery charging another.

True, Tony. Do you have an estimate?

 

[TonyWilliams]

You're not factoring in losses by one battery charging another.

True, Tony. Do you have an estimate?

We have plenty of battery experts (I'm not one) who hopefully will opine.