Nissan to announce official Battery Replacement Program soon

[91040]

Sorry, but as my wife can attest, I read this forum extensively. Nissan never mentioned that there would be a salvage value on the batteries for those who bought.

Secondly, the battery does not require excessive miles to degrade. Heat and time are sufficient, even in LA.

I wanted to directly address this weird logic.

- You are assuming they aren't "offering anything for the battery". It is obvious that they meant to take the salvage value of the battery off of the new battery when calculating the monthly lease rate.

- "offers the same battery lease price to a person who leases the car and does not own it or the battery" : There are several possibilities here. Since the full program was never published we don't know the exact details. Let us take one scenario of returning the old battery to lease the new one. In this case, I don't particularly understand why someone who is leasing the car would want to exchange the battery - since it is still under warranty. In case it has severely degraded because of the miles put on (far in excess of the usual mileage) - the leaser would pay the price in terms of mileage. As for as Nissan is concerned they are getting back a degraded battery that has the same salvage value, whether leased or owned. So I don't see why the lease on the new battery would be any different.

So, stop the silly hyperbole and let us all discuss thus like adults.

 

[klapauzius]

So, stop the silly hyperbole and let us all discuss thus like adults.

I think there is not really much to discuss:

Anything short of offering a replacement battery for sale is unsatisfactory.

It would become a legal issue too, since it wasn't disclosed when the car was sold that a part that is known and expected to wear out would not be offered as replacement by the manufacturer.

This is why I still think Nissan will offer a replacement battery for sale.

This weird communication about the lease program last year might have been unfortunate on their part. Until they definitely say otherwise, I will give them the early-adopter credit (this all being new and cutting edge technology) i.e. it might take some time, even for a big company like Nissan, to figure out all the details.

But I think now, i.e. 3.5 years after selling the first leafs in the US, might be about the right time to state, what would be fairly obvious for any other car maker, that ALL parts of the LEAF will be available for sale as replacements.

 

[JPWhite]

Yes, the reactions and feedback have made a huge difference. Those expressed here and on an ongoing basis by the LAB, but also the group at the AZ dinner with the Nissan team last August (TickTock, Turbo2ltr, TomT, jhm614, shrink, PHXsmiley, jstack6 and Jerry Asher). It has all helped. I know that's vague, and it's not my intent to add to the frustration- only to reassure a little while we wait (which I still don't expect to last beyond the end of the month).

If Nissan plans to release this by the end of June, they would probably wait until Friday at the end of the business day. This will allow everyone to think about it over the weekend and not stress out their customer support people.

I see from your sig that you lost your 4th bar recently.

Did you claim against the capacity warranty? Sorry if that's covered elsewhere, just curious.

JP

 

[myleaf]

Yes, the reactions and feedback have made a huge difference. Those expressed here and on an ongoing basis by the LAB, but also the group at the AZ dinner with the Nissan team last August (TickTock, Turbo2ltr, TomT, jhm614, shrink, PHXsmiley, jstack6 and Jerry Asher). It has all helped. I know that's vague, and it's not my intent to add to the frustration- only to reassure a little while we wait (which I still don't expect to last beyond the end of the month).

If Nissan plans to release this by the end of June, they would probably wait until Friday at the end of the business day. This will allow everyone to think about it over the weekend and not stress out their customer support people.

I see from your sig that you lost your 4th bar recently.

Did you claim against the capacity warranty? Sorry if that's covered elsewhere, just curious.

JP

Yes my battery was recently replaced under the capacity warranty. Some details are in the Battery Replacement Thread

 

[TimLee]

Yes, the reactions and feedback have made a huge difference. Those expressed here and on an ongoing basis by the LAB, but also the group at the AZ dinner with the Nissan team last August (TickTock, Turbo2ltr, TomT, jhm614, shrink, PHXsmiley, jstack6 and Jerry Asher). It has all helped. I know that's vague, and it's not my intent to add to the frustration- only to reassure a little while we wait (which I still don't expect to last beyond the end of the month).

If Nissan plans to release this by the end of June, they would probably wait until Friday at the end of the business day. This will allow everyone to think about it over the weekend and not stress out their customer support people.

I think the postulated timing is correct.
But I think people will do a lot more than think about it over the weekend, there will be extensive commentary.
I appreciate the efforts of the LAB and those that met with Nissan and hope that the second anniversary program will be better.
I don't see how it could possibly be worse.
As I said before,

Most likely something like the battery lease rates on page 22 of the UK brochure.
http://www.nissan.co.uk/content/dam/services/gb/brochure/Nissan+Leaf+Brochure.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
But hard to do accurate conversions from £ with value added tax to US price pre-tax and to guess what valuation will be given for the traded in battery. Let alone what difference there would be for an owner versus a leasor. For the leasor NMAC owns the battery and entering into the program is really just a change of the lease contract.

I don't think Nissan will offer a purchase option at this point.
As a LEAF purchaser I feel the sentiment of the SYB name. Never would have thought someone would sell me something and only way to keep it running was to switch to a battery lease.
I still consider that unethical.
But a large % of what occurs in business today is unethical.

From Nissan perspective of cost only they do not see the purchaser and leasor any different so that is why they will price switching to a battery lease starting with a new battery the same whether you own the battery or not. Their cost is putting in a new battery and their cost is the same for both.

 

[evnow]

Sorry, but as my wife can attest, I read this forum extensively. Nissan never mentioned that there would be a salvage value on the batteries for those who bought.

I didn't say they mentioned it. But it doesn't take a financial wizard to realize what they are doing here.

Secondly, the battery does not require excessive miles to degrade. Heat and time are sufficient, even in LA.

Yes, but that requires a lot of time, so probably outside the lease period. Irrespective of that - if someone is paying the normal car lease + battery lease (??!) I don't see why anyone should be upset.

As I said - lease or buy in this case makes no diff. We are all paying in one way or the other - depending on the risks we are taking (yes, buying is a higher risk than leasing - that is why leasing costs a bit more).

 

[myleaf]

If Nissan does not want to sell replacement batteries and only offers a lease program, the guaranteed capacity criteria should be increased to something like a true 80%.
The current 9 bar capacity guarantee which is < 70% would not be acceptable to me. Last year, waiting for the 9th bar to drop, required careful planning of our trips.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

OT I know, but is anyone really doing anything with depleted LEAF modules, or is it still just so much talk?

 

[mwalsh]

The current 9 bar capacity guarantee which is < 70% would not be acceptable to me. Last year, waiting for the 9th bar to drop, required careful planning of our trips.

Likewise. In fact, I've taken to leaving the LEAF home and take the Volt instead, even if it's a trip within the 1-way capability of the LEAF but is questionable for opportunity charging on either speed or availability.

There is no way I'd want to lease a battery pack to keep THAT kind of status quo.

 

[klapauzius]

Most likely something like the battery lease rates on page 22 of the UK brochure.
http://www.nissan.co.uk/content/dam/services/gb/brochure/Nissan+Leaf+Brochure.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
But hard to do accurate conversions from £ with value added tax to US price pre-tax and to guess what valuation will be given for the traded in battery. L

For a UK resident that would be the equivalent of ~ $170 per month for a 24 months lease and less than 12,000 miles per year.
I assume this works for them since gasoline prices in the UK are higher?

The only thing worse than a $100/month ONLY rental program is a $170/month only rental program.

 

[JPWhite]

I've been doing some sleuthing.

I tiptoed behind the Nissan HQ in Franklin TN to see what I could see and snatched this photo.

Nissan have even put a billboard up announcing that it's 'coming soon'!!!

It was rather difficult to make out from this distance, but I swear I saw a pile of old LEAF batteries stacked up with kindling under them. I suspect that the 'powers to be' are in conference right now and when they finally iron out the details of the battery replacement program, they will set fire to the spent pile Arizona batteries papal style. I can see the HQ building from my office building, I'll be first to post here when I see the smoke from the pyre indicating the announcement is about to be made.....

 

[TomT]

Perhaps, but electric prices are also higher in the UK. About 30 cents a Khr on average...

http://blog.comparemysolar.co.uk/electricity-price-per-kwh-2013-comparison-of-e-on-edf-npower-british-gas-scottish-and-sse/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[mwalsh]

For a UK resident that would be the equivalent of ~ $170 per month for a 24 months lease and less than 12,000 miles per year. I assume this works for them since gasoline prices in the UK are higher?

The only thing worse than a $100/month ONLY rental program is a $170/month only rental program.

We generally pay in $ what folks in the UK pay in £ for the same commodity. Example: your Big Mac here would cost ~$5, in the UK it is likely to be closer to £5.

Of course, there are exceptions to this in both directions, with gasoline and housing (in many locations) being two that spring immediately to mind as being more expensive. 16:9 widescreen TVs, on the other hand, gained acceptance a lot faster in the UK than they did here and bargain sets were $700-800 while we were still paying $1200-1600 for the cheapest models. Mobile phones and services are a lot more competitive there too due to a highly deregulated marketplace.

However, salaries are crazily low over there, and I'd probably get paid 1/2 to 2/3rds of my current salary for the same job there as I do here. I honestly don't know how many people scratch a basic living in expensive cities like London, never mind spend on extravagances like going out for a meal or the movies (and yet they manage to do so!)

 

[RegGuheert]

It was rather difficult to make out from this distance, but I swear I saw a pile of old LEAF batteries stacked up with kindling under them. I suspect that the 'powers to be' are in conference right now and when they finally iron out the details of the battery replacement program, they will set fire to the spent pile Arizona batteries papal style. I can see the HQ building from my office building, I'll be first to post here when I see the smoke from the pyre indicating the announcement is about to be made.....

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Thanks for being so vigilant of the signs of a coming announcement!

 

[evnow]

Anything short of offering a replacement battery for sale is unsatisfactory.

I don't think we are talking about that.

I can understand whey some would say they want to buy the battery and not lease it. But, just because you are not getting your choice is no reason to block others from getting their choice i.e. to say they shouldn't offer a lease program unless they offer buy also is "unethical".

 

[klapauzius]

Anything short of offering a replacement battery for sale is unsatisfactory.

I don't think we are talking about that.

I can understand whey some would say they want to buy the battery and not lease it. But, just because you are not getting your choice is no reason to block others from getting their choice i.e. to say they shouldn't offer a lease program unless they offer buy also is "unethical".

Why would a battery for sale block Nissan from also offering a battery lease?
The problem so far has been that ONLY the lease has been offered. And doing that is unethical and probably illegal too.

 

[TimLee]

But, just because you are not getting your choice is no reason to block others from getting their choice i.e. to say they shouldn't offer a lease program unless they offer buy also is "unethical".

I don't have any problem with Nissan offering a battery lease program.
Since that appears all they are willing to do now they should never have sold the battery with the car in the first place.
To sell a product and then refuse to sell replacements is unethical.

 

[mwalsh]

To sell a product and then refuse to sell replacements is unethical.

+1. If I'd have known I'd never be able to buy a new pack, I may not have purchased over leasing in the first place.

 

[evnow]

Why would a battery for sale block Nissan from also offering a battery lease?
The problem so far has been that ONLY the lease has been offered. And doing that is unethical and probably illegal too.

Let us look at a total different situation. A landlord offering the house for lease - and not offering it for sale. Is that "unethical" ?

People seem to through around the words "stealing", "enethical" and "illegal" casually.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Why would a battery for sale block Nissan from also offering a battery lease?
The problem so far has been that ONLY the lease has been offered. And doing that is unethical and probably illegal too.

Let us look at a total different situation. A landlord offering the house for lease - and not offering it for sale. Is that "unethical" ?

People seem to through around the words "stealing", "enethical" and "illegal" casually.

Yeah, but you know that going in.
Cars that are sold really need to have replacement parts available. At least any car you plan on selling to me.