If I left you a nasty note today...

[yoyofella]

This problem will get worse: Same thing happened at SFO recently. That night, I decided to ICE it. Luckily I did. I was at SFO for 3 hrs and the same 2 Leafs parked in the EV spots were still there when I returned to the parking lot. One was parked, NOT even plugged in. The other offending Leaf was plugged in and fully charged. No placards, nothing.

Lots of Leafs on the roads and lots of uneducated EV drivers these days.... :-(

That might have been my blue Leaf, though I disagree with the notion that I'm an "uneducated EV driver". I frequently take day trips from SFO (fly out in the morning, fly back in evening) and I usually park in one of the 6 EV spots on Garage A or G designated as the day-parking. Typically I'll arrive with 2~3 bars remaining, and will take about 5 hours to fully charge the car. I specifically chose those parking spots because it's a more "intermediate" parking spot. If I must move the car after it's done charging, then it basically means day trippers like me cannot use those spots to charge. By the way, this is by no means a "free parking", we are paying $20/day to park in that garage. For multi-day trips I plan on using the long term parking charging spots.

Thankfully SFO set up 15 other charging spots in their short term parking area so I have no doubt other more short-term drivers should have no problem finding a spot to charge. Though I agree with what others have said: they need to map at least 2 parking spots per charging station to make plug-sharing feasible.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

Maybe the signage there should be Electric vehicle charging only, instead of Electric vehicle only

That's how the signs up here in Seattle read at every L2 station I've been to. "Electric Vehicle Parking While Charging Only" or similar phrasing.

I don't think it should be "while charging only", it's simply going to discourage people from using the spaces unless they can come out and move their car exactly when it's done charging. For the mass market, life is not going to be about the car, it's got to be convenient and within reason. I'm curious to see how this whole discussion changes once L3 is in place. I suspect L2 will be more opportunity charging... if you really need a charge and can't depend on chance, then L3 will be there.

 

[smkettner]

I disagree with two spots per charger as I don't think the general public will be able to do the warm fuzzy plug share thing. I would propose for every 30 amp charger, replace it with four 7.5 amp or even six 5 amp chargers in the longer term parking. A few 30 amp units with a designated 2 to 4 hour time limit for those that need more power while they wait.

 

[hill]

A Volt never has to charge. A leaf parked for extra time in a space is no worse than a Volt parking there at all.

I have to respectfully disagree. Although I don't personally own a Volt, if I did I would want to run it on electric power whenever possible and only use the gas engine when there is simply no other choice. So as far as I'm concerned it is an EV with a 35 mile range, and a gas engine for emergencies or road-trips only. They have every right to use a public charger.

While I would agree that when the car (volt) is charged, it should be moved just like a Leaf if there are other people needing to use the spot.

oh yea . . . that'll happen. Put another way, I could afford a Volt if I a $10 fore each time I've had to work around one ICE'ing a charger, but not even using it. (yea yea, sometimes Lear'rs too). I'm kinda glad the Volt ended up being so expensive - it'll mean that many less times I get ICE'd.

 

[planet4ever]

I strongly disagree with you, hill. There will never be a day when everyone wants to own the same kind of vehicle. My wish, for the future of the earth, is that everyone use whatever vehicle they own in the way that best conserves our limited resources and preserves the health of the planet.

That means I fervently urge Volt owners to use electricity rather than gasoline whenever possible.

Ray

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

A Volt never has to charge. A leaf parked for extra time in a space is no worse than a Volt parking there at all.

no that is not right. the Volt has to charge 2½ times more often than a Leaf. my Zenn only got 20-30 miles on a charge. would you say i did not need to charge because of its range? it had no gas backup but that is not the point now is it?

there is an emerging problem that needs to be addressed. ICE'ing can be fixed easy enough by simply making EV charging stations exclusive and less attractive. i dont need to be up front. i would gladly park in the last row if guaranteed a spot to plug in when needed (that is a lot to say in rainy WA!)

also, the other thing is plugging in to get a boost. its not always possible or convenient to go out and move your car in 2-3 hours after your charge is done.

so having single charger servicing up to 4 spaces in paramount. this sets up a "queue" of sorts for all day parkers. in a work setting, it would be applicable to coordinate a sharing of the plug and granted, in many cases not an easy thing to do.

it is becoming obvious that charging stations need to proliferate for this to work and must be done effectively. right now, the problem is limited availability and its good to see private retailers starting to come on board. we need to see a lot more of this including mandating EV parking the same way handicap parking is mandated now.

 

[hodad66]

Honestly, besides not wanting the light interior, this phenomenon
of "needing" a charge was one of the issues that made my decision
to go for the Volt. In three years I'll see how the infrastructure /
battery tech have evolved.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Honestly, besides not wanting the light interior, this phenomenon
of "needing" a charge was one of the issues that made my decision
to go for the Volt. In three years I'll see how the infrastructure /
battery tech have evolved.

the "need" is getting off the oil import disaster

 

[hodad66]

Honestly, besides not wanting the light interior, this phenomenon
of "needing" a charge was one of the issues that made my decision
to go for the Volt. In three years I'll see how the infrastructure /
battery tech have evolved.

the "need" is getting off the oil import disaster

believe what you will..... I'm doing my part! :mrgreen:

being pissed off over parking spots is the last thing I want
to include in my daily routine.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

believe what you will..... I'm doing my part! :mrgreen:

being pissed off over parking spots is the last thing I want
to include in my daily routine.

LOL!! trust me, if not fighting over parking spots we would just find something else!!

i think there is simply a big to do about nothing. there is no perfect system so we can analyze the needs, propose improvements, implement them, reanalyze.

that is life. the desire to live a stress free, conflict free life is umm, ok i guess

 

[hodad66]

fine with me...... :mrgreen:

let's see people get upset about religion, politics,
money, pollution, any number of things.

I live close to everything I need... some commute.
Why commute when it wastes time, money, fuel.....

We all make our choices... I guess two of mine don't
rate on your scale. Oh well, as if it mattered!

 

[Packet]

I have to ask... why on earth are we spending time trying to castigate Volt owners, who have already jumped on board the EV train even if they have a gas engine to increase the range? Folks probably have their reasons for wanting one. Maybe once a month they have to drive 130 miles to visit in-laws, or periodically their job requires them to drive from Seattle to Portland to check in on a remote site or something. Maybe they just want the freedom to be able to drive 200 miles to go on a camping trip if they want.

Regardless, wouldn't we do better to spend that time and energy trying to convince people still driving pure ICE cars of the merits of EVs, range-extended or otherwise?

 

[hodad66]

Imagine that........... :mrgreen:

 

[DavidV]

This problem will get worse: Same thing happened at SFO recently. That night, I decided to ICE it. Luckily I did. I was at SFO for 3 hrs and the same 2 Leafs parked in the EV spots were still there when I returned to the parking lot. One was parked, NOT even plugged in. The other offending Leaf was plugged in and fully charged. No placards, nothing.

Lots of Leafs on the roads and lots of uneducated EV drivers these days.... :-(

That might have been my blue Leaf, though I disagree with the notion that I'm an "uneducated EV driver". I frequently take day trips from SFO (fly out in the morning, fly back in evening) and I usually park in one of the 6 EV spots on Garage A or G designated as the day-parking. Typically I'll arrive with 2~3 bars remaining, and will take about 5 hours to fully charge the car. I specifically chose those parking spots because it's a more "intermediate" parking spot. If I must move the car after it's done charging, then it basically means day trippers like me cannot use those spots to charge. By the way, this is by no means a "free parking", we are paying $20/day to park in that garage. For multi-day trips I plan on using the long term parking charging spots.

Thankfully SFO set up 15 other charging spots in their short term parking area so I have no doubt other more short-term drivers should have no problem finding a spot to charge. Though I agree with what others have said: they need to map at least 2 parking spots per charging station to make plug-sharing feasible.

It might have been my silver Leaf too. Even worse, I sometimes fly out for 2-3 days at a time. As I live some distance from the airport, I generally don't have enough range upon arriving to get home without recharging at SFO. So, what is the etiquette under the circumstances?

-- DavidV

 

[DaveEV]

It might have been my silver Leaf too. Even worse, I sometimes fly out for 2-3 days at a time. As I live some distance from the airport, I generally don't have enough range upon arriving to get home without recharging at SFO. So, what is the etiquette under the circumstances?

If you need the charge, then you should charge! Definitely suggest leaving a note on the dash saying feel free to unplug after X-hour so someone in an adjacent spot may charge if needed.

 

[DavidV]

It might have been my silver Leaf too. Even worse, I sometimes fly out for 2-3 days at a time. As I live some distance from the airport, I generally don't have enough range upon arriving to get home without recharging at SFO. So, what is the etiquette under the circumstances?

If you need the charge, then you should charge! Definitely suggest leaving a note on the dash saying feel free to unplug after X-hour so someone in an adjacent spot may charge if needed.

Thanks. One thought that I had was that rather than putting chargers up against a wall as is the current practice, it might make more sense to mount the chargers in between rows of spaces so that instead of two cars being within a cord's length of the charger, four cars could all be within reach.

If my car has three bars showing, I have no qualms about someone unplugging it in my absence, but being able to move the car out of the space is another matter. By having more cars be able to reach the charger, this could (it would seem) facilitate a lot more turnover at places like airports where people frequently can't return to move their cara when full.

-- DavidV

 

[johnr]

One thought that I had was that rather than putting chargers up against a wall as is the current practice, it might make more sense to mount the chargers in between rows of spaces so that instead of two cars being within a cord's length of the charger, four cars could all be within reach.

If my car has three bars showing, I have no qualms about someone unplugging it in my absence, but being able to move the car out of the space is another matter.

Excellent idea, David!

 

[walterbays]

One thought that I had was that rather than putting chargers up against a wall as is the current practice, it might make more sense to mount the chargers in between rows of spaces so that instead of two cars being within a cord's length of the charger, four cars could all be within reach.

If my car has three bars showing, I have no qualms about someone unplugging it in my absence, but being able to move the car out of the space is another matter.

Excellent idea, David!

Yes, but for this to work we have to get AB475 repealed first. http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5288

 

[DarkStar]

Yes, but for this to work we have to get AB475 repealed first. http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5288

However, AB475 only applies if the spot is "signed" for it. The owner of the spot can still sign it anyway they want without AB475 applying.