Early Adopter Mistake - Running on Empty

[Valdemar]

Not yet, I think the settlement just got finalized a couple days ago.

 

[fooljoe]

I've never heard of this either.

 

[TimLee]

Discussed extensively in Amended Settlement Klee vs Nissan.

See http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=18905.

The modest compensation for those that do not qualify for capacity warranty but were still substantially damaged came about in the mediation that the Judge's objection caused to happen.

It is still another pathetic Class Action settlement.

But that is what happens when the two plaintiffs only care about quick battery replacement and the Class Action attorneys fail to represent the whole class.

The attorneys should be disbarred.

 

[Leafer77]

Quick update: I was informed that there won't be a decision yet, because additional car testing is required. I'm supposed to receive a call about scheduling an appointment for further vehicle testing. It'll be interesting to see what kind of tests are performed.

 

[Valdemar]

...additional car testing is required.

Oh-oh, hopefully it is not another name for the infamous gradual battery capacity loss data reset. Make sure your capacity bar display is well-documented prior to this testing.

 

[Leafer77]

...additional car testing is required.

Oh-oh, hopefully it is not another name for the infamous gradual battery capacity loss data reset. Make sure your capacity bar display is well-documented prior to this testing.

The impression that I got was that it's not a Nissan engineer who will be performing the testing, but I guess we'll see.

 

[Leafer77]

I didn't receive a call to setup the vehicle inspection appointment last week. I'm going to call and check on the status of the decision or if they still plan on performing the vehicle inspection.

 

[Leafer77]

I contacted the BBB since I didn't get a call for the vehicle inspection. According to them, I should be getting a call this week.

In other news, my Carpool co-worker who has almost the same commute that I do just lost his 4th bar. He's at 50,000 miles and will be going to the dealership this week. I asked him to post his data for the spreadsheet. The only difference between him and I, is that he drives the car at 75mph vs. me at 65mph and parked his car outside.

I'm thinking the culprit is the faster discharge of the battery , due to the increase in speed, which results in higher battery temperature and the the additional amount of charge cycles.

 

[Valdemar]

Likely parking outside has more effect than driving at 75mph. Then I think all packs have variance, 2 packs in identical condition will likely show different degradation over time, you may have a "better" pack than he does, unfortunately better doesn't mean better for your wallet, or mine for that matter.

 

[keydiver]

In other news, my Carpool co-worker who has almost the same commute that I do just lost his 4th bar. He's at 50,000 miles and will be going to the dealership this week. I asked him to post his data for the spreadsheet. The only difference between him and I, is that he drives the car at 75mph vs. me at 65mph and parked his car outside.

I had a very similar experience. JupiterLeaf lives near me, but drove a 70 mph commute every day, whereas I work from home. We took delivery within a couple days of each other, but he lost his 4th bar back in January at 33,000 miles, whereas I now have 37,000 miles and just lost my 3rd bar a month ago. I theorize that the 70 mph driving + his almost 100% discharge every day is what degraded his battery much faster than mine, since I rarely drive over 55 mph, and do shallower charges twice a day.

 

[thankyouOB]

it is 60,000 miles in how many years to qualify for the free battery?

--
yes, I see it is five now.




i have a 2011 with 45k and down 2 bars and expecting to lose a third this summer.

 

[Stanton]

it is 60,000 miles in how many years to qualify for the free battery?
please, remind me.
i have a 2011 with 45k and down 2 bars and expecting to lose a third this summer.

The capacity warranty (for 2011/2012) is 5 yrs/60k miles (whichever comes first). Without an exact number of Ahr's or manufacture date, my first impression is you will NOT make 4 bars before your warranty runs out. By this point, you should already be down 3 bars, plus the summer is nearly over (hot or not). For example, I only have a couple of Ahr's left before I drop my 4th bar, so the only question for me is: this summer or next summer (and I'm taking advantage of 100+ temps right now to make it this summer).

 

[Leafer77]

I had my 3rd party inspection completed. The technician concluded that there is a problem and he stated, "Suspect an Internal Battery Failure."

The technician noted that the battery range was 45 when he started and immediately dropped 20 miles, after 10 miles of driving. No A/C was used and light to moderate acceleration.

This corroborates my claims about the range being much lower, even more so than the range charts posted by the community for my vehicle.

I can add comments to this report for the Arbitrator, but I'm wondering what more can I say?

 

[edatoakrun]

I had my 3rd party inspection completed. The technician concluded that there is a problem and he stated, "Suspect an Internal Battery Failure."

The technician noted that the battery range was 45 when he started and immediately dropped 20 miles, after 10 miles of driving. No A/C was used and light to moderate acceleration.

This corroborates my claims about the range being much lower, even more so than the range charts posted by the community for my vehicle.

I can add comments to this report for the Arbitrator, but I'm wondering what more can I say?

Well, if you want to win, I'd suggest you do not point out to the arbitrator that (as you have reported) The technician relied on changes in the GOM over ~10 miles of driving to reach their expert opinion, which IMO, would tend to indicate that he/she is an idiot.

 

[Leafer77]

I had my 3rd party inspection completed. The technician concluded that there is a problem and he stated, "Suspect an Internal Battery Failure."

The technician noted that the battery range was 45 when he started and immediately dropped 20 miles, after 10 miles of driving. No A/C was used and light to moderate acceleration.

This corroborates my claims about the range being much lower, even more so than the range charts posted by the community for my vehicle.

I can add comments to this report for the Arbitrator, but I'm wondering what more can I say?

Well, if you want to win, I'd suggest you do not point out to the arbitrator that (as you have reported) The technician relied on changes in the GOM over ~10 miles of driving to reach their expert opinion, which IMO, would tend to indicate that he/she is an idiot.

The GOM was just one variable, but there was also Charge and Capacity Bar's that the technician accounted for, which I didn't mention above. I was just using those statements to make a point.

I'm wondering if or what I should add to the report? For instance, should I say that I agree with the conclusion from the Technician and leave it at that or should elaborate on any of the findings or reiterate my prior statements?

 

[leafkabob]

I had my 3rd party inspection completed. The technician concluded that there is a problem and he stated, "Suspect an Internal Battery Failure."

The technician noted that the battery range was 45 when he started and immediately dropped 20 miles, after 10 miles of driving. No A/C was used and light to moderate acceleration.

This corroborates my claims about the range being much lower, even more so than the range charts posted by the community for my vehicle.

I can add comments to this report for the Arbitrator, but I'm wondering what more can I say?

Well, if you want to win, I'd suggest you do not point out to the arbitrator that (as you have reported) The technician relied on changes in the GOM over ~10 miles of driving to reach their expert opinion, which IMO, would tend to indicate that he/she is an idiot.

The GOM was just one variable, but there was also Charge and Capacity Bar's that the technician accounted for, which I didn't mention above. I was just using those statements to make a point.

I'm wondering if or what I should add to the report? For instance, should I say that I agree with the conclusion from the Technician and leave it at that or should elaborate on any of the findings or reiterate my prior statements?

I would of course not get into any discussion of the method used by the technician to reach his conclusion. If it was me, I would write a paragraph or two summarizing the conclusion of the technician, and emphasizing that the technician was an independent tech, not hired by you, who concluded that the car has a problem which he suspects is an internal battery failure. I would also emphasize at every opportunity that the car's utility has decreased to the point that the car is basically worthless. Don't rely on the BBB to connect the dots. You should try to do that for them every chance you get.

 

[Leafer77]

Thanks for the advice. I submitted my comments, so we'll see what happens next week.

 

[electricfuture]

I am guessing that Leafer77 won his case but had to agree to tell no one? :|

 

[Leafer77]

Sorry for the delay in posting any updates, but I purposely hesitated to send any news about my Arbitration, since I didn't know if Nissan would honor the decision and whether there are any rules against me communicating the decision publicly.

I succeeded in winning my Arbitration case against Nissan. The BBB process took awhile but I appreciate the professionalism and service they provided to me throughout the process. This process began back in January 2015.

My NEW battery was installed on 9/17/2015 and I took possession of my vehicle on 9/18/2015. I now have ALL 12 Capacity Bars! I can't tell you how much relief this has given to my family.

Thank you to everyone who gave me feedback and suggestions throughout this process. I'd also like to thank the two forum member's who volunteered to be witnesses at my Arbitration hearing.

If you have a Nissan Leaf battery that is beyond 60,000 miles and exhibits severe battery degradation, then you may want to consider opening a case with Nissan to have them investigate, then go through the BBB Arbitration process if you cannot come to a mutual agreement.

Interesting to note, the replacement battery has a warranty that is good for only 12 months.

Car Details:

Silver Nissan Leaf 2011
Date car purchased: 5/31/2011
Manufactured Date: 4/11
Garaged at home and sometimes uncovered at work.

Final Battery Statistics:

Date first bar disappeared: 8/24/2012
Approximate Mile's when bar disappeared: 21,085
1 month of 100% charging via L2, thereafter 80% L2.
(5/31 - 2/1) Nightly charge, except weekends where it typically charged just once for the entire weekend.
(2/2 - Present) Charge twice a day 80% L2. Night and when I arrive to work.
4.5 KWH

Lost my second bar: 7/8/2013.
Approximate Mileage: 36,360
Still performing a L2 charge twice a day 80% L2. Night and when I arrive to work.
4.8 KWH

Lost my third bar: 6/13/2014.
Approximate Mileage: 52,109
Performing a L2 charge twice a day to %100. Once in at 1:10am and at work.
4.4 KWH

Lost my fourth bar around: 1/6/2015.
Approximate Mileage was around: 61,150
Performed an L2 charge twice a day to 100%. Once in at 1:10am and at work.
4.0 KWH

Lost my fifth bar around: 8/29/2015
Approximate Mileage was around: 70,934 miles
Performed an L2 charge twice a day to 100%. Once in at 1:10am and at work.
4.0 KWH

 

[Valdemar]

Thanks for the update. Would you say that the favorable decision from arbitration was mostly due to you not receiving and signing the capacity loss disclosure form at the time of purchase?