Does (D)rive and (R)everse seem backwards to you?

[pasowino]

So, I was out on my boat this weekend and I kept putting the hammer forward expecting it to go backwards. I made that mistake at least three times. I don't get out on the boat often enough, but I never made that mistake before I owned a Leaf. :lol:

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

So, I was out on my boat this weekend and I kept putting the hammer forward expecting it to go backwards. I made that mistake at least three times. I don't get out on the boat often enough, but I never made that mistake before I owned a Leaf. :lol:

that would be scary. if you moved to opposite side of town would that cause "left turn/ right turn" issues when going to work?

actually i do the up/down wrong way thing all the time. fact is, it only takes a second to realize the mistake. its not critical and if it was, i would probably spend less time fiddling with the radio and energy screens if it was

 

[TomT]

Yes, me too. It is just intuitively backwards to me, maybe because I have driven sticks most of my life... I early-on got in the habit of confirming I am in the correct directional mode on the dash display before applying accelerator.

actually i do the up/down wrong way thing all the time. fact is, it only takes a second to realize the mistake. its not critical and if it was, i would probably spend less time fiddling with the radio and energy screens if it was

 

[Martytdi]

Is there any cars out there where you push the automatic shift forward for drive? No there is not that I have seen. All pull back for drive and forward for reverse. No one ever complained.

 

[AP1]

If you've been driving automatics all your life, you're used to it. I have not and it definitely feels backwards. Move it back to go forward is supposed to be "natural?" I don't think so, but I will eventually get used to it, I'm sure (may take a while)

 

[pasowino]

Is there any cars out there where you push the automatic shift forward for drive? No there is not that I have seen. All pull back for drive and forward for reverse. No one ever complained.

My automatic transmission requires that I pull it back (one click) to go backwards.

 

[tps]

Is there any cars out there where you push the automatic shift forward for drive? No there is not that I have seen. All pull back for drive and forward for reverse. No one ever complained.

My automatic transmission requires that I pull it back (one click) to go backwards.

Maybe from Park. I bet you have to push it forward to get from L to D...

When I had the Hertz rental LEAF, I checked the first couple times, but after that I had surmounted the learning curve and I didn't have to think about it that much.

 

[cwerdna]

I saw this today on Jalopnik and figured I'd post it here. It also refers to US Department of Transportation Standard No. 102 (http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/administration/fmcsr/fmcsrruletext.aspx?reg=571.102" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false.

http://jalopnik.com/5870701/why-prndl" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[ttweed]

I saw this today on Jalopnik and figured I'd post it here. It also refers to US Department of Transportation Standard No. 102 (http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regulations/administration/fmcsr/fmcsrruletext.aspx?reg=571.102" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false.

http://jalopnik.com/5870701/why-prndl" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That article's pretty funny! I especially like the first comment showing below it:
Pretty
Retarded
News
Day
Losers.

I have never had a problem adjusting to the shifter in the Leaf, myself. I have driven so many different types of vehicles over the years, both manual (w/ 3-speed column shifter, pulling in and down for first gear, then 3-, 4-, 5-, and 6-speed floor shifts, with 1st-gear alternating between pushing forward and pulling back), automatic (column and floor shifts, and also the dashboard-button system in an old '57 Plymouth Fury), as well as sequential transmissions in both motorcycles (foot shift and hand clutch) and cars (foot clutch and hand shifter, pushing forward for first from neutral and then back for each succeeding gear), that recognizing and adapting to each system instantly is a conscious and practiced action each time I get in the driver's seat. I have found myself on very rare occasions lapsing into an incorrect habit when changing from one car to another on the same day, but generally I adapt immediately and have never suffered any catastrophic consequences from a momentary lapse (knock on wood). The Leaf system has been far easier to deal with for me than moving from an H-shifter to a sequential, or even from an H-shift manual with first gear back to an H-shift with 1st gear forward.

YMMV,
TT
gratuitous pic for those too young to remember 1957:

 

[TonyWilliams]

Some of the farm equipment can be interesting. The John Deere R/820/830 had a hand lever, over center clutch (and more normal hand throttle). Gears shift patterns all over place.

We ran "buck rakes" which were converted pickups the you drove backwards (rear wheel steering shared with combines). This reversal meant you were shifting the same gear pattern backwards, and with your left hand instead of right.

My 1951 GMC 2 ton truck has a straight cut gear (no synchromesh) Fuller 5 speed that requires double clutching, plus 2 speed, electric shift rear end for 10 total gear shifts under load.

I do think the LEAF gear selector should be opposite, though.

 

[N1ghtrider]

Someone probably said this already, but I will bet that the shift pattern was made to mirror the old 3-speed manual shifter (either on the column or on the floor), where first gear was down and to the left and reverse was up and to the right.

 

[Nekota]

The gear shifting presents no issue for me. I do find myself leaving other cars shifter in the drive position now that the LEAF has been doing the auto park 'shift' for me and that parking mechanical design compared to the complexity of the parking brake convinced me to just use the park and avoid the parking brake. And when that backup camera is missing - what a difference that little thing has made.

 

[planet4ever]

It is interesting that the referenced standard says neutral must be between forward and reverse, but doesn't say which one should be on which side except for steering column mounted shift levers. I certainly remember driving some of those, but I think it's been quite a while. My guess is, though, that quite a few people would have screamed if the column-mounted order was PRNDL, top to bottom, and they switched to a car with a transmission tunnel mounted shifter that was LDNRP, front to back.

Given that every tunnel/console mounted automatic shifter I've ever used was PRNDL, front to back, presumably for that reason, It would have seemed very odd for the LEAF to have DNR instead of RND.

Ray

 

[bradleygibson]

I think they way overthought this.

When I'm backing up into a tight space, I'm not thinking about column mounted shifters or U.S. national shifting standards. I'm thinking "I want to go backward", so I push the stick backward, and promptly go forward.

I'm sure it is extra counterintuitive to me because I have never owned an automatic transmission car, but regardless of the reason, it's still backward for me.

#2 on my hack list for this car (after the "Accept" message).

It is interesting that the referenced standard says neutral must be between forward and reverse, but doesn't say which one should be on which side except for steering column mounted shift levers. I certainly remember driving some of those, but I think it's been quite a while. My guess is, though, that quite a few people would have screamed if the column-mounted order was PRNDL, top to bottom, and they switched to a car with a transmission tunnel mounted shifter that was LDNRP, front to back.

Given that every tunnel/console mounted automatic shifter I've ever used was PRNDL, front to back, presumably for that reason, It would have seemed very odd for the LEAF to have DNR instead of RND.

Ray

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

i have driven many different cars including one that had a push button transmission (it a 1962...something forgot now. only had it a year and i have gone thru 50 cars ,maybe?..Dodge Dart maybe?)

but the tranny setup is the same as the Prius so not quite sure what the confusion is. but what ever it is, i think we simply need to adjust because this pattern seems to be the go to solution for newer cars

 

[ontariomonkey]

So embarrassing, I got flustered at a stop sign yesterday (long story) and suddenly forgot what car I was in, reached down to put her in 1st gear and started to go backwards! Thank goodness I noticed before hitting the car behind me! Sometimes randomly, my foot is going for the clutch, such a weird feeling that it is not there.

I think reverse should be back and forward should be forward too. So odd.

 

[N1ghtrider]

i have driven many different cars including one that had a push button transmission (it a 1962...something forgot now. only had it a year and i have gone thru 50 cars ,maybe?..Dodge Dart maybe?)

I had a '62 Dodge Lancer with push button shifter.

 

[GRA]

In the test drive I took in the Leaf, the first oddity I noticed was what seemed to be the counter-intuitive nature of the shift selector. I've always owned sticks, from 3 on the tree + O/D ('65 Impala SS), 4 or 5 speeds, but have driven automatics and found the PRNDL (or PRND321) sequence made sense. After all, if you're parallel parked or parked nose-in, you probably need to reverse before moving forward, and if you back in you're going to go into park immediately after.

But the Leaf just seems wrong, probably due to the lack of Park forward of reverse. If Park is in the middle off to the side, the justification for having reverse being the first backward increment falls away. Of course, selecting higher regen braking modes by pulling back would also be a problem as you're unlikely to need that most of the time, and you wouldn't want to have to go through the whole sequence from Park through neutral and then forward two or more steps every time, if it's purely an electronic switch (as opposed to physical position).

D

Eco

B

N - P

R


Perhaps something like Park pushed off to the right from the neutral position, and Eco/B off to the left from Drive (forward) would be the most intuitive standard?


B - Eco - D

.......... N - P

.......... R

 

[bradleygibson]

Hi, Gra,

I like them! Both of those layouts would work for me. Not sure what "B" is, though?

 

[GRA]

Hi, Gra,

I like them! Both of those layouts would work for me. Not sure what "B" is, though?

'B' is for cars with a high regenerative braking mode, which some people here have asked Nissan to add to the Leaf. Thinking about it, I think this might be an even better setup:

......D

..B - Eco

......N - P

......R

This way, Eco would be the normal around town or moderately-heavy freeway driving mode, 'D' would be for open freeway cruising with no regen, and 'B' for steep descents and stop and go. You could also have a button on the shifter to select between D and Eco, much as many automatics have an O/D lock-out button. When driving my friend's automatic 4-Runner in the mountains, I'm often going back and forth between O/D (4th gear) off for small descents and minor compression braking and O/D On for cruising/coasting, while for steep descents I've already got O/D off before I pull it into 'L' (or '2', I forget).

Guy