Battery degradation anxiety

[IBELEAF]

So range anxiety was easily overcome, but seeing posts about possible reduced range I am starting to think we might have new kind of anxiety that would only increase over time... How do you deal with it?

 

[surfingslovak]

I am starting to think we might have new kind of anxiety that would only increase over time...

+1!

 

[Volusiano]

How do you deal with it?

Should be solved by having enough charging stations around by the time the degradation starts causing any real effect on your range capability.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

i "dealt" with it by examining my needs during a time where "spare time" was minimal and that was during my very short wait period between email confirm and RAQ.

i knew that 50 miles (winter range) is all i needed for it to work for me and more was a benefit.

as it stands right now, i am about 10 miles short of what i need (winter range) as the commute we have that is longest is about 62 miles and last winter, we were getting 6-10 miles left on full charge when returning home.

now that was before the "recalibration" so guessing it will be much "scarier" now i am not the driver on this trip so most likely the Leaf will not do this trip during winter (it was a battle last winter) so might only do this during summer only (she has no problem with the Summer range which gives us 15-20 miles left)

 

[SanDust]

Lease. No worries.

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

I think we can expect ups and downs in reports on range due to a wide range of factors such as seasonal climate change, new driver break in, seasoned drivers relaxing their conservation habits a bit etc, etc. I'll be worried if there is an across the board loss of range in just the first year that can be duplicated the following year with the full range of seasons to compare. At this point there are so many factors it's hard to tell what people are actually seeing. In some places we can expect to see heat related limits that will rebound when things cool off after the summer. For the places that get really cold we will likely see cold related limits that will rebound when things warm up after the winter. It's nerve racking to be a first adapter some times, but also very exciting and rewarding. I'm on board for the long haul as I see no other alternative that offers the prospects of emission free driving with the infrastructure virtually already in place.

So far our Leaf still goes everywhere it's been able to go, so much so I no longer give the range much attention.

"DON'T PANIC"

 

[mdh]

My hope is nissan will be smart by offering a battery refresh program. We are all walking in the snow backwards... this is ground breaking... we are really in an real-world beta program. I hope nissan nurtures their customers.

 

[TomT]

I dealt with it by leasing for four years.

So range anxiety was easily overcome, but seeing posts about possible reduced range I am starting to think we might have new kind of anxiety that would only increase over time... How do you deal with it?

 

[GaslessInSeattle]

I dealt with it by buying instead of leasing, knowing that I could get a decent price if need be, probably do better than leasing, if I sold before the first round of 3 years leases end and flood the market with used Leafs. If you walk from the Leaf lease and don't end up buying the car, they take a fairly big bite, enough that it would take a fairly disastrous outcome for the Leaf to make it worth it, at least that's what we calculated with the Lease we were offered. I'm pretty sure that next year I will be able to discount the car by the tax credit, take off some for depreciation and get a pretty decent price from the "I never buy new" crowd or someone who is not eligible for the credit. I've been very pleased with how the "never buy new" crowd is willing to pay such a premium for cutting edge used vehicles, it kind of boggles my mind. It's not a perfect science but the depreciation curve on new cutting edge cars is more level for the first few years, making this kind of investment somewhat less risky if you work the timing right. I can certainly understand the temptation to Lease and it's a roll of the dice either way.

I dealt with it by leasing for four years.

So range anxiety was easily overcome, but seeing posts about possible reduced range I am starting to think we might have new kind of anxiety that would only increase over time... How do you deal with it?

 

[mwalsh]

I dealt with it by buying instead of leasing

Shhh....don't tell anyone, but I bought with $0 down specifically so I could stick the banksters with losses if it turned out to be a pig.

But, as it happens, it looks like they'll have to pry it from my cold dead hands instead. So it's all good!

 

[smkettner]

No fear, no anxiety here. There are bigger things in life to worry about than a car battery.

 

[IBELEAF]

I have no regrets by not leasing and buying because essentially it saved me bunch of money, but I might consider selling it if I start seeing that high mileage drivers would start reporting unexpectedly high battery degradation and Nissan wouldn't do anything after say 60k miles...

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

o believe when the TN battery plant is up and running, Nissan will start offering battery upgrades for better range. i am hoping as early adopters, we might be afforded a one time special price.

either way, i am looking to be fine for a good 5 years in which time i will have saved about $4,000 at todays gas price (i filled up Prius yesterday and wasnt too hard to notice that gas has gone up 11 cents per gallon since the last fillup)

so even if the batteries were spendy, i am "banking" money for that expense every single mile i drive

 

[TomT]

And I also believe in the tooth fairy! :lol:

o believe when the TN battery plant is up and running, Nissan will start offering battery upgrades for better range. i am hoping as early adopters, we might be afforded a one time special price.

 

[IBELEAF]

Unfortunately, we are just speculating on cheap battery upgrades... but this anxiety is there because we are told about "some" degradation upfront. Although, now I am taking Nissan's estimates on degradation with a grain of salt just like their unrealistic "100 mile range".

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

ibeleaf; so based on your statement Nissan

1) knew ahead of time that the batteries are not ready for prime time and were

a: scamming us to get a quick sale
b: you are completely wrong
c: lied to us to gain the extra time they needed to develop a better battery

if its a, i find it hard to believe that they are backing that scam with a $2+B complex in TN. if its C, then that means a free warranty upgrade in all our futures!!

unfortunately, i am afraid it will be B and we will probably get nothing but a slow "undefendable" leak in range.

2) have the most inept engineering team in automotive history (but then again, they would pair up well with the marketing team!) after all, Coda is 2nd (out of fricking nowhere i might add because they sure were not on my radar) out of the box with completely different battery technology

so, we are definitely on the edge of something; now whether it be cutting or bleeding, i guess only time will tell

 

[JimSouCal]

No fear, no anxiety here. There are bigger things in life to worry about than a car battery.

Boy do I agree with that--my energies are elsewhere. "No worry, so no worry".

 

[IBELEAF]

It's probably closer to a, although it doesn't mean they scam us, but mainly exaggerating the estimates with best (uncommon) case scenario. Also, their refusal to warranty the battery capacity tells us something.

 

[LEAFfan]

Also, their refusal to warranty the battery capacity tells us something.

I leased so no worries about the battery pack. But Nissan DID give us a battery capacity warranty. Loss of capacity is covered EXCEPT for gradual capacity loss, which is NORMAL. So if your battery pack loses more capacity than what is normal, it will be covered. I really don't see a problem with the warranty and why people can't read what is in writing.

 

[Stoaty]

But Nissan DID give us a battery capacity warranty. Loss of capacity is covered EXCEPT for gradual capacity loss, which is NORMAL. So if your battery pack loses more capacity than what is normal, it will be covered. I really don't see a problem with the warranty and why people can't read what is in writing.

The problem with this way of looking at things: Nissan either doesn't know (or isn't saying) exactly how much on average the "normal" gradual loss will be. Sure, they have said things like "80% capacity remaining at 5 years" but this is not covered in the warranty. If it turns out to be 6% per year, or 8% per year, that is still fairly "gradual", and thus presumably won't be covered by the warranty.

With all that said, I am not too worried, because if the batteries degrade too quickly and Nissan doesn't cover it they will have a black eye and no one will want to buy a Leaf in the future. I think this limits the risk for the early adopters to some extent. Time will tell.