2nd LEAF in Colorado?

[defiancecp]

Someone has said that reservations are "hard locked" to the state of the billing address of the credit card used to make the reservation. Their assertion was that the profile address didn't matter, and that once the registration was made, the state was locked in and it didn't matter even if the bank updated your billing address... Was your credit card billing address from a tier 1 state at the time you made the reservation? If, OTOH, you've indeed found some previously unknown loophole in the Nissan reservation system, PM me immediately with details of how you did it so I too can order my LEAF right away. You should probably prepare yourself for what amateur radio operators call a pile-up.

Reservations are *not* locked to the billing address state for sure. I called Nissan and asked them flat out: what do I need to do to order a car, they replied with: 'you need a tier 1 address', I said: 'any address will do?', they said: 'yes, any address, and select a tier 1 dealer as well'. So I did, and within 24 hours I got a call from the dealer that I can order my LEAF. That was in May. Then you will need to work with your bank and the out-of-state dealer to see if you need to travel there to complete the sale or not, and you need to organize your own transportation, etc...

I'm glad they changed it then, because it DEFINITELY was. For my original reservation from April 23rd I changed the address to Memphis back in August 2010 and it STILL doesn't allow me to order. I wonder if I changed it back then changed it to memphis again if it would let me order now? :lol:
I need to remember to cancel that thing anyway.

In any case, the cross-state thing was actually pretty easy in my case - guess the dealership did a lot of the work? I had to pay state taxes when I registered the car instead of built into the loan, that was the only difference. I bet it was because Memphis is basically on the border with 3 states (Mississippi, Arkansas, Tennessee) and pretty close to Illinois and Missouri as well, they probably get a TON of out-of-state traffic, so they've got the process down.

 

[TEG]

...Someone elsewhere was dismayed at the "EVSE upgrade" homebrew installations; he thought they were unsafe around children...

What homebrew instructions? Are they talking about evseupgrade.com? ...

No, there was a different thread where someone else started to spell out how they modified their Nissan portable EVSE to do 240V "on the cheap" in part by bypassing some GFCI safety features that evseupgrade leaves intact.

 

[dgpcolorado]

No, there was a different thread where someone else started to spell out how they modified their Nissan portable EVSE to do 240V "on the cheap" in part by bypassing some GFCI safety features that evseupgrade leaves intact.

My use of the term "homebrew" was perhaps too hyperbolic. While I have been following that thread you mention, I was referring to some criticism I saw at Plugincars.com to the effect that the Panasonic 120V EVSE doesn't have the safety features of other EVSEs:

The 120 volt EVSE that comes with the Leaf does not comply with all o the J1772 safety recommendations. I would not use it at 120 V or 240 V. The little kids that might be around are too valuable to cut corners like that.

I think his objection was that a portable EVSE has a removable wall plug that could be a danger to children (although I'm just guessing at that). That was something that hadn't occurred to me, being single and childless, and seems a valid concern for parents.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Less than three days until Nissan's Drive Electric Tour hits the Front Range (Flatiron Crossing, Broomfield). I'm looking forward to being able to see and drive a Leaf for the first time!

 

[davewill]

The 120 volt EVSE that comes with the Leaf does not comply with all o the J1772 safety recommendations. I would not use it at 120 V or 240 V. The little kids that might be around are too valuable to cut corners like that.

I think his objection was that a portable EVSE has a removable wall plug that could be a danger to children (although I'm just guessing at that). That was something that hadn't occurred to me, being single and childless, and seems a valid concern for parents.

The only "safety feature" I'm aware of that the Nissan EVSE lacks is something called the diode test. This test is intended to keep a J1772 plug that is dropped into water from being fooled into thinking a car has been connected and activating. The Nissan EVSE has GFI that would keep this very unlikely happenstance from being dangerous. BTW, it seems that the Aerovironment unit and maybe others ALSO lack this test. We found that out when a forum member's car turned out to have a defective diode, but would charge on those units, but not his Blink.

As far as the wall plug goes...it's no more dangerous than any other plug in the world, in fact, the locking plug that the upgrade uses is probably safer than the regular 120v plug since just pulling on the cord won't disconnect it. It should go without saying that you need to supervise little ones that might pull on any plug.

 

[milanski]

BTW, I don't know about you other guys in CO, but I have been in contact with Doty, John B. from the DOR about the CO tax rebate, and we have new numbers:

The incremental price difference (IPD) for the Nissan leaf is $12,250

, which is higher then they originally posted, so the tax credit should be turning out to be:

$12,250.00(IPD) - $7,500(FTC) = 4,750

$4,750 x 0.85 = $4,038

Your tax credit is $4,038.00

Just FYI

Is that for a 2011 Leaf? Any idea if the higher price for a 2012 model would increase the credit?

Bump. I'd like to know as well if this was a 2011 or 2012 (price increased) Leaf.

Can someone also give me a quick rundown of when the federal and state (Colorado) tax credits will expire for EV and for EVSEs? I'm wondering if I should get both in by Dec 31, 2011, or wait on one or the other until after Jan 1, 2012.

Thanks!

 

[dgpcolorado]

Is that for a 2011 Leaf? Any idea if the higher price for a 2012 model would increase the credit?

Bump. I'd like to know as well if this was a 2011 or 2012 (price increased) Leaf.

Can someone also give me a quick rundown of when the federal and state (Colorado) tax credits will expire for EV and for EVSEs? I'm wondering if I should get both in by Dec 31, 2011, or wait on one or the other until after Jan 1, 2012.

Thanks!

I believe that seeker's numbers were for a 2011 SV. I have sent an e-mail to the DOR guy asking about 2012 models. I'll post any information I get on the 2012 model year Colorado tax credit numbers.

So far as buying in 2011 versus 2012, the tax credit is 85% of the "Incremental Price Difference" at present but drops to 75% on January 1, 2012:
http://www.colorado.gov/cs/Satellite?blobcol=urldata&blobheader=application%2Fpdf&blobkey=id&blobtable=MungoBlobs&blobwhere=1251713597816&ssbinary=true" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'm hoping that I can close my Leaf purchase before December 31st because of the 10% greater tax credit, whatever it turns out to be.

The federal tax credit phases out after the car manufacturer has sold 200,000 qualifying vehicles, so it remains in effect. It is possible that Congress could kill the federal tax credit next year; it seems unlikely that the credit for the 2011 tax year would be changed at this late date. The federal tax credit is for $7500 but is not refundable, meaning that one must owe $7500 in federal income taxes to qualify for the entire credit. Any unused credit is lost. By my rough estimate, it would take an income of about $55K for a single person using the standard deduction to generate a tax bill of $7500. Couples and others with higher exemptions and deductions would need a higher income to generate that tax amount.

For EVSEs, it appears that the credit was renewed for one more year (2011) but the amount of the credit was lowered back to 30% (from 50% in 2010), with a cap of $1000:
http://www.afdc.energy.gov/afdc/laws/law/US/351" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I am unclear on whether or not the residential EVSE tax credit is refundable or can be carried forward to future tax years. It seems unlikely to me that the credit will be renewed for 2012, so putting in one's EVSE this year seems wise.

[Edit: The EVSE tax credit is not refundable and can't be carried to future years. See IRS Draft Form 8911.]

[Full disclosure: I am not an accountant, for more accurate numbers one ought to contact a tax professional.]

 

[batzman]

I stumbled across this site this evening and have read through the articles regarding the Leaf in Colorado. I too have been frustrated since my April 2010 reservation. I thought tonask again today when the Colorado ordering process will open up and to my surprise by the Nissan Leaf representative it is the 29th of this month (September). We shall see if that holds true, but I thought to share this information.

I for one will be checking on the 29th in the morning.

Cheers.

 

[ampitupco]

Wow other Colorado Leaf owners! Yay!

I have been patiently waiting since May of 2010 when I got on the waiting list. I went to the test-drive event at Flatirons Mall last weekend. I am totally ready for this thing to finally become "officially" available for purchase in Denver.

I would be interested in any sort of local area meet up as well.

 

[milanski]

I also went to the test drive at Flatiron Mall outside Boulder last weekend. Took my wife too. While I'm sure we'll pull the trigger on a base Leaf and Schneider charger before the end of the year, I must say I wanted the car to be more... refined... advanced... leading edge.

Being a fully electric car is a big deal, and I'll buy it for that. But one interior color, so-so interior materials, limited visibility, odd trunk space. It feels like a fair-good hatchback. I guess I expected a higher level of refinement.

As many have said, the idea was to make the Leaf feel like driving 'a regular car.' And it does. But I just wish the Leaf took more departures than simply 'electric', more of a reinvention of what a mass-produced car could be when it's not tied to a gas pump.

If we ever do that Colorado Leaf meet-up, boy, I'm going to get flamed, aren't I

 

[Leon]

I've had mine since July. As far as it feeling like a "regular car". That is soooo not true. After you live with one for a bit. Drive your old car and try that thought again. Look for it in Wheat Ridge. Weekdays. Somewhere along Wads.....

 

[lektrik]

Is anybody else going to the Plug in Day event at Denver's Sustainablility Park on Oct 16th besides me? Not sure how big the event is going to be but it would be a place to get together. Still not sure how I am going to charge the car so I can get home but I guess I need an adventure.

 

[seeker]

Is anybody else going to the Plug in Day event at Denver's Sustainablility Park on Oct 16th besides me? Not sure how big the event is going to be but it would be a place to get together. Still not sure how I am going to charge the car so I can get home but I guess I need an adventure.

Do you have any more information about the event?

 

[lektrik]

Not much, but try the Colorado Renewable Energy Society, see:

http://www.cres-energy.org/events/index.html#Show_shine_dine" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You should be able to at least download the event flyer.

 

[seeker]

Not much, but try the Colorado Renewable Energy Society, see:

http://www.cres-energy.org/events/index.html#Show_shine_dine" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You should be able to at least download the event flyer.

What to Expect:
• Demonstrations of electric vehicle charging

I would hope that you can charge there, any Nissan Dealer on the way has also charging stations, see carstations.com and zoom into Denver.

 

[lektrik]

They are having to run the event off of extension cords because of limited electricity at the site. None of the dealers in Denver that I have talked to have chargers yet, the only level 2 I have been able to locate along my route is at Crescent Electric and they are closed on Sunday, best bet right now looks like I will turn my EVSE into a portable and take it to an RV park so I can have 240 volts, 8 hrs at 120v. would make the trip just too long.

 

[seeker]

They are having to run the event off of extension cords because of limited electricity at the site. None of the dealers in Denver that I have talked to have chargers yet, the only level 2 I have been able to locate along my route is at Crescent Electric and they are closed on Sunday, best bet right now looks like I will turn my EVSE into a portable and take it to an RV park so I can have 240 volts, 8 hrs at 120v. would make the trip just too long.

Well at the Nissan LEAF tour event, they had a generator powered 440V DC quick charge there. I guess they needed that for the cars people drove, but it would be silly if they don't have any chargers there...

Not sure if this one is open on Sunday: http://carstations.com/4452

 

[lektrik]

Seeker thanks for trying but just to show how my luck runs, dealers (Eaton and ?) are going to be showing chargers at the event but don't have power available to demonstrate them, I tried calling Elec. City Motors, his phone has been disconnected, Elements Hotel looks my best bet, they show to be 120v. It's going to be a long day if the homemade portable doesn't work.

 

[dgpcolorado]

I stumbled across this site this evening and have read through the articles regarding the Leaf in Colorado. I too have been frustrated since my April 2010 reservation. I thought tonask again today when the Colorado ordering process will open up and to my surprise by the Nissan Leaf representative it is the 29th of this month (September). We shall see if that holds true, but I thought to share this information.

I for one will be checking on the 29th in the morning.

Cheers.

FWIW, the order process has opened in Colorado already. I did the RAQ (Request a quote) this morning for the only Leaf Certified dealer in Leaf driving distance from me (Durango). They came in well above MSRP, to my disappointment. I guess I will be getting one from Oregon after all. The difference in price for the same model/accessories was a stunning $2600. Oh well. It would have been fun to pick it up and drive it home over Red Mountain Pass.

 

[milanski]

I'm lucky, I guess. There are two dealers within 10 miles of me. So I submitted a RAQ through the dashboard to one of them, Boulder Nissan. But I'm wondering if I screwed up already.

If I don;t like the RAQ they give me, and I then call up the other local dealer, will I drop to the back of the reservation line? Should I have simply called the two dealers first, and then submitted a RAW to the lower one? Crap.

 

[davewill]

... If I don;t like the RAQ they give me, and I then call up the other local dealer, will I drop to the back of the reservation line? Should I have simply called the two dealers first, and then submitted a RAW to the lower one? Crap.

Yes, you should have, but it's not too bad as long as the first dealer doesn't sit on your reservation. You can pull the RAQ back by calling CS, but it takes an extra day. You don't go to the end of the line, and can resubmit to another dealer as soon as your RAQ is released. What you want to do now, is call the dealer you DID submit to and get some of the haggling done so you don't just get some sky-high default first offer.