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LEAFer
Posts: 2648
Joined: Mon May 24, 2010 10:10 am
Delivery Date: 19 Jan 2011
Leaf Number: 000215
Location: Sacramento Area

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:02 pm

Had ours done today after 9 days shy of 12 months at 15,237 miles. 12 boxes, and 5 stars for the five categories, except 4 stars for "2. Frequent charging when battery state of charge is already high". First 6-7 months (generally speaking) charged to only 80%, but last 5-6 months 100% charging.

Service advisor mentioned he had seen one LEAF with only 11 boxes after 12k miles; no other details on that tho.
2011 Silver SL+QC [Mfg: 11/2010] 36mo/15k LEASE
06Jun2013 Status [28.5 months][34,173 miles][11 bars]
Lost CapacityBar 6/6/13 @34,173 miles while in LEAF Battery Monitor: 83.41%, 71.4F (avg); cool overnight;

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 15875
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Sat Jan 14, 2012 10:54 am

**off topic alert** (sort of)

interesting post at PC about Prius battery pack testing

http://www.artsautomotive.com/services/ ... ius-hybrid" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

now the Prius pack never sees an SOC outside 40-80% which kinda makes me wonder about the differences between "cell balancing" on the unproven Nissan battery pack verses the Toyota battery pack which has active examples of some packs approaching a half million miles (2fas4U on priuschat.com)

granted different chemistry's so a direct comparison is not applicable (see off topic warning above) but still interesting
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 25,047 mi, 92.12% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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evnow
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Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 11:41 am
Delivery Date: 25 Feb 2011
Leaf Number: 303
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:13 am

DaveinOlyWA wrote:... verses the Toyota battery pack which has active examples of some packs approaching a half million miles (2fas4U on priuschat.com)
Ofcourse a very small % of those half a million miles are really EV miles ...
1st Leaf : 2/28/2011 to 5/6/2013
2nd Leaf : 5/4/2013 to 3/21/2017
Volt : 3/25/2017 to 5/25/2018
Model 3 : 5/10/2018 to ?

DaveinOlyWA
Posts: 15875
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:43 pm
Delivery Date: 16 Nov 2019
Leaf Number: 319862
Location: Olympia, WA
Contact: Website

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Sat Jan 14, 2012 11:27 am

evnow wrote:
DaveinOlyWA wrote:... verses the Toyota battery pack which has active examples of some packs approaching a half million miles (2fas4U on priuschat.com)
Ofcourse a very small % of those half a million miles are really EV miles ...
absolutely but still addresses the #1 degradation factor of any battery chemistry of time and charge cycles. granted shallow charge cycles are beneficial but in driving a Prius, i go thru a dozen cycles daily. that does not correlate equally to any chemistry.

so the real question is how each chemistry survives the march of time without regard to how extensively it is charged? in this respect, i think NiMH does last longer as evidenced by RAV 4EVs going on two decades with minimal maintenance issues.
2011 SL; 44,598 mi, 87% SOH. 2013 S; 44,840 mi, 91% SOH. 2016 S30; 29,413 mi, 99% SOH. 2018 S; 25,185 mi, SOH 92.23%. 2019 S Plus; 25,047 mi, 92.12% SOH
My Blog; http://daveinolywa.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

vegastar
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 11:29 am
Delivery Date: 07 Jul 2011
Leaf Number: 5564
Location: Portugal

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Sat Jan 14, 2012 2:47 pm

LEAFer wrote: Service advisor mentioned he had seen one LEAF with only 11 boxes after 12k miles; no other details on that tho.

85% pack capacity after 12k miles is scary... What is the most miles driven by a LEAF with still 12 capacity bars? I have 9500 miles after 6 months, and I hope in my first annual battery check with 19k miles that I still have the full 12 capacity bars.
2011 Nissan LEAF since 2011-07-07, 151000 km on 2018-03-03, 7 bars, 37.9Ah.

tbleakne
Gold Member
Posts: 988
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 12:05 pm
Delivery Date: 03 Jun 2011
Leaf Number: 2400
Location: Claremont, CA

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Sat Jan 14, 2012 4:01 pm

DaveinOlyWA wrote: the #1 degradation factor of any battery chemistry of time and charge cycles. granted shallow charge cycles are beneficial but in driving a Prius, i go thru a dozen cycles daily. that does not correlate equally to any chemistry.

so the real question is how each chemistry survives the march of time without regard to how extensively it is charged?.
My understanding is that shallow charge cycles are HIGHLY beneficial in extending battery life. That is why a Prius, using just the middle of its battery range, can sustain many thousands of charge/discharge cycles. I don't have any information on how the chemistry of Li-ion compares to NiMh with respect to lifetime, but I believe you really can't separate lifetime from charge/discharge. I have seen an equation that models the shelf life (no charge or discharge) of Li-ion as declining at a t^(1.5) rate, but virtually all Leaf drivers are presumably not keeping their batteries "on the shelf."
LEAF Ocean Blue SL, "100 % Electric" decals, Delivered June 3, 2011
Sold June 2014 27K miles, 18% capacity loss, 1 bar, 5.0 mi/kWh.
Solar 4.6 KW DC with both string and micro-inverters.

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garygid
Posts: 12469
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:10 am
Delivery Date: 29 Mar 2011
Leaf Number: 000855
Location: Laguna Hills, Orange Co, CA

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Sun Jan 15, 2012 12:43 am

The LEAF turns Off the top Capacity-Bar only after 15% capacity has been lost, NOT 1/12 (about 8%).

I would prefer to know at about 0.5% intervals (1/200 of the battery).

I you have lost a Capacity-Bar, Please let comebody Log your LEAF's EV CAN bus for at least 5 or 10 minutes, preferably while the LEAF is being Powered ON.
See SOC/GID-Meter and CAN-Do Info
2010 Prius
2011 LEAF, 2014 Tesla S85
2018 & 2019 Tesla Model 3
PU: SDG&E
Solar PV: 33 x 225W -> 7 kW max AC
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TonyWilliams
Posts: 10104
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 1:48 am
Delivery Date: 02 May 2011
Leaf Number: 002244
Location: Vista, California USA
Contact: Website YouTube

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Sun Jan 15, 2012 4:54 pm

vegastar wrote:
LEAFer wrote: Service advisor mentioned he had seen one LEAF with only 11 boxes after 12k miles; no other details on that tho.

85% pack capacity after 12k miles is scary... What is the most miles driven by a LEAF with still 12 capacity bars? I have 9500 miles after 6 months, and I hope in my first annual battery check with 19k miles that I still have the full 12 capacity bars.
I'm approaching 17,000 miles, and not experiencing any degrading (not to be confused with cell imbalance loss of range in the bottom 15% of capacity).

I probably use the full capacity of the battery on a daily basis more than 99.9% of the LEAF population. I now charge to 100% only with time left at the end of the charge to balance the battery (1-4 hours typical).

I expect when it does start to degrade, that it will be noticeable and steady all the way to 20-30% reduction in capacity at 100,000 miles (160,000km). I'm fortunate that my battery will never be exposed to significant temperature extremes, particularly the +100F / +40C temps.
Thanks,

Tony Williams
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1497 POINSETTIA AVE
Suite 154
VISTA, CA 92081-8542 USA
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TangoKilo
Posts: 278
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:39 pm
Delivery Date: 09 May 2011
Leaf Number: 2212
Location: Moorpark

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Sun Jan 15, 2012 5:14 pm

TonyWilliams wrote:
vegastar wrote:
LEAFer wrote: Service advisor mentioned he had seen one LEAF with only 11 boxes after 12k miles; no other details on that tho.

85% pack capacity after 12k miles is scary... What is the most miles driven by a LEAF with still 12 capacity bars? I have 9500 miles after 6 months, and I hope in my first annual battery check with 19k miles that I still have the full 12 capacity bars.
I'm approaching 17,000 miles, and not experiencing any degrading (not to be confused with cell imbalance loss of range in the bottom 15% of capacity).

I probably use the full capacity of the battery on a daily basis more than 99.9% of the LEAF population. I now charge to 100% only with time left at the end of the charge to balance the battery (1-4 hours typical).

Same here... 14,500 miles with no perceived degradation. I charge to 100% all the time... 8-)

I expect when it does start to degrade, that it will be noticeable and steady all the way to 20-30% reduction in capacity at 100,000 miles (160,000km). I'm fortunate that my battery will never be exposed to significant temperature extremes, particularly the +100F / +40C temps.

vegastar
Posts: 208
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 11:29 am
Delivery Date: 07 Jul 2011
Leaf Number: 5564
Location: Portugal

Re: 1 Year "Battery Check" Results

Mon Jan 16, 2012 2:48 pm

That is reassuring Tony and TangoKilo. In my Leaf I notice around 5% less capacity tham 6 months ago (measured from my wall meter from LB or VLB to 100%), but I think that is because of the lower temperatures. In summer I had around 24ºC (75ºF) in my garage and now it is at 14ºC (57ºF).
2011 Nissan LEAF since 2011-07-07, 151000 km on 2018-03-03, 7 bars, 37.9Ah.

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