Wierd experience?

[user 10599]

I've had my Leaf for 7 months and 6100 miles and love it so far. I've been so impressed I even bought stock in the company and was at the dealership yesterday looking at the new Hybrid Pathfinder as a possible replacement for our aging Highlander Hybrid. But I just had a weird experience that is a bit disconcerting.

Last night I finished my commute and plugged in (with the supplied level 1 charger) with 31 miles on the GOM and the car set to charge to 80%. At bed time, I checked the garage and noted that the blue dash board lights were blinking as usual.

This morning, since I planned to drive longer range today, I took my ICE. It wasn't driven or touched during the day. The lights weren't blinking, but that is normal since it is always back to 80% by morning. Inside my So. Cal garage, I don't believe it would have gotten colder than 55 f or hotter than 75 f during this whole time period.

This evening, we decided to head out to dinner. I unplugged the car and started up normally, but was welcomed with a low battery message. The GOM said I had 11 miles range. Switching the display, I found that the battery was at 13%.

So somehow, even though the car was plugged in and charging over night, by this evening, it was drained. And it was plugged in just over 24 hours but still sitting at 13% with no blue dash lights flashing to indicate it was charging or needed to be charged.

I plugged it back in and the blue lights fired up normally. After and hour and half, the display now reads GOM 48 mile range and battery at 57%. That is a 44% charge in a short time for my level 1 charger.

Any ideas on what the issue is?

The only thing I can come up with (I'm an accountant, not an engineer) is that perhaps I have one bad cell that corrupted the ability to read the battery and now as that cell gets charged, the battery will read as full. Is that plausible?

Should I take it to the Dealer on Monday for a diagnostic?

 

[derkraut]

Strange :? :? :? :? :?
I would take it to the dealer, since it's under warranty..

 

[cgaydos]

You may need to take to dealer for diagnosis. However, two possibilities are: 1) your charging timer was set up so that you didn't get the normal charge, or 2) the car was left on. Probably neither is extremely likely, but I've seen both happen. For (1) you might have had an end time earlier than normal for that day of the week, for example. For (2) to be possible, since it was plugged in, the charging timer would have had to be off during the day - in that case if the car were left turned on it would slowly drain the battery during the day.

 

[user 10599]

I've never used the charge timer, just the long-life battery option that stops the charging at 80%. The car was definitely off and the key out of range - no beeping noise that it makes when it is on and I exit the vehicle.

Checking again now (2 hours after last reporting), it has stopped charging and shows at the 80% charge that it should stop at on the long-life setting. So per the computer, my level 1 charger just charged it from 13% to 80% in 3 and half hours.

 

[LeftieBiker]

If the pack was actually charged all along, then the #1 suspect is the 12 volt accessory battery. This is a known issue: the 12 volt battery gets drained if the car is often left plugged in but not charging, or if all the 12 volt accessories are used a lot in cold weather.

 

[smkettner]

Is it back to charging tonight? See what the morning brings. Make sure the plug is firmly inserted.

 

[Nubo]

At bed time, I checked the garage and noted that the blue dash board lights were blinking as usual.

Which of the 3 lights was blinking? Were any solidly lighted?

 

[Wennfred]

Ensure you got the Charger software update when you go back to the dealer.


Fred

 

[ERG4ALL]

I presume you were using an EVSE and not a 120V wall outlet charger. In the latter case I've had the cable get disturbed and it stop charging. Anyway, I was wondering if removing the charger and plugging it in again might have solved the problem, I always listen for that solid "click" when plugging the car in to make sure good contact was made.

 

[user 10599]

Turns out my dealer has service hours on Saturday, so it's there now for a diagnostic. I'll let you know what they say.

After it charged back to 80% in 3.5 hours last night, I left it unplugged. This morning it was still at 79% and had no problems driving it to the dealer or any indication of an issue.

As for the lights on Thursday evening, it was the normal middle light blinking with the passenger side light solid which indicates it is charging and somewhere in the middle. So it shouldn't have been a bad connection. But somehow it stopped charging and drained itself, but not really as there had to be a lot more power in there otherwise it could not get back to 80% in just 3.5 hours on a level 1. So I'm thinking there was some sort of bad cell causing a bad read or a software communication glitch confusing the computer regarding the level of the charge.

 

[thankyouOB]

weird

 

[donald]

Or perhaps early symptoms of a charger failure?

 

[cgaydos]

Turns out my dealer has service hours on Saturday, so it's there now for a diagnostic. I'll let you know what they say.

After it charged back to 80% in 3.5 hours last night, I left it unplugged. This morning it was still at 79% and had no problems driving it to the dealer or any indication of an issue.

As for the lights on Thursday evening, it was the normal middle light blinking with the passenger side light solid which indicates it is charging and somewhere in the middle. So it shouldn't have been a bad connection. But somehow it stopped charging and drained itself, but not really as there had to be a lot more power in there otherwise it could not get back to 80% in just 3.5 hours on a level 1. So I'm thinking there was some sort of bad cell causing a bad read or a software communication glitch confusing the computer regarding the level of the charge.

So, for the record, the problem you describe isn't one of those that are commonly mentioned on this forum. Please don't interpret that to mean I doubt you ... I'm sure this happened as described. We're all early adopters of LEAFs, and although most of the early problems are resolved now some of the more "squirrelly" problems (extra credit for those who remember the publication "Squirrel Killers") still remain. Since this isn't a common problem it may take your dealer some time to get to the bottom of it.

 

[LeftieBiker]

I presume you were using an EVSE and not a 120V wall outlet charger. In the latter case I've had the cable get disturbed and it stop charging. Anyway, I was wondering if removing the charger and plugging it in again might have solved the problem, I always listen for that solid "click" when plugging the car in to make sure good contact was made.

Everything you plug into an EV in order to charge it is an EVSE. The one that came with the car is a 120 volt, or "L-1" EVSE, not a "wall charger." The actual charger is built into the car, and the EVSE is just there to get the external power safely into it.

 

[user 10599]

Got the car back. The dealer diagnostics didn't find anything and the car checks out fine. Apparently no new software update is available either.

I will update this thread if it happens again. Otherwise I will assume it was a software glitch in terms of how the computer interpreted the info it was getting from the battery. I suppose if it happens again, I can take it straight to the dealer with the battery level showing as low and let them do the diagnostic at that point and find if it has more power in there than is registering.

In the meantime, I'm quite happy with this car and relieved that there appears to be nothing wrong (at least nothing major enough the dealer is able to detect it).

 

[LeftieBiker]

Got the car back. The dealer diagnostics didn't find anything and the car checks out fine. Apparently no new software update is available either.

I will update this thread if it happens again. Otherwise I will assume it was a software glitch in terms of how the computer interpreted the info it was getting from the battery. I suppose if it happens again, I can take it straight to the dealer with the battery level showing as low and let them do the diagnostic at that point and find if it has more power in there than is registering.

In the meantime, I'm quite happy with this car and relieved that there appears to be nothing wrong (at least nothing major enough the dealer is able to detect it).

Based on what has happened, I'd also watch the accessory battery. Prius owners have reported a similar glitch in charge reporting when their 12 volt battery (which also doesn't get charged well enough in many cases) is dying. It doesn't have to be dead to do it, just low.

 

[ksnogas2112]

Based on what has happened, I'd also watch the accessory battery. Prius owners have reported a similar glitch in charge reporting when their 12 volt battery (which also doesn't get charged well enough in many cases) is dying. It doesn't have to be dead to do it, just low.

+1 on the 12 volt

 

[user 10599]

Update: Almost exactly 2 months later at 7,900 miles it acts up again. But this time, I have more symptoms and am able to capture screenshots with my cell phone and got a diagnosis from the dealer.

After charging to 80% overnight, my wife took it to the store about 2 miles away. On way back, it suddenly put her in turtle mode without any prior low battery warning. However, she didn't pay any attention to its power level before it went into turtle mode, so we thought maybe it just didn't charge that night. She was able to make it back to our driveway okay. I plugged it in and charged it up, and it again recharged super quick. About half an hour later on my Level 2, it was back to 80%.

We then took it on a drive to Oxnard. 80% usually gets us there and nearly back no problem. I figured I'd stop at the Nissan dealer there for a 10 minute Level 3 and we'd be good.

However, by the time we were in Oxnard, it was really low. I noted several times in route that the battery was dropping faster than normal (I routinely drive to Oxnard, but I usually don't use the freeway, which I did this time, so I figured that could be the issue. We also had a strong headwind. So we stayed at the Level 3 until it was at 91%.

We then finished our 2nd errand and drove back to Thousand Oaks and stopped for a third errand. I still had plenty of range to get home. But on returning to the car after that 5 minute errand, the car greeted me with turtle mode. I was 2 blocks from the level 2 at the Home Depot and made it there. After an hour on that, it said I had plenty for my drive home. We made it home fine without any further problems. But since it was now after dealer closing time, I waited until next morning to take it in. I chose not to charge it that night, it had plenty of range showing for the 7 mile drive to the dealer and didn't want charging it to reset any error codes.

That morning, as I turned out from my tract, it suddenly went from 25% battery and 22 mile est. range to turtle mode. I returned to my driveway and when I put it into park, it went back to 25% and no warnings - it said it was good to go.

I was able to replicate it and get pictures before and after it changes its mind by driving around the block so I could document and show the dealer what it was doing. I then called the Nissan number for a tow as I couldn't safely drive it to the dealer in turtle mode.

They were able to replicate and collect error codes which required their Leaf Master Tech to call Nissan engineering. On the invoice, it says the error codes were P317A, P3180, and P30A1. Nissan instructed them to "remove battery and inspect bus bar for right front stack, cells 91 and 92 and check all cells for arcing, leaking or obvious damage". The invoice says they found connectors LB7 and LB8 were not properly seated. They also replaced Li-Ion modules JQ16AA and JQ162A and 4 beataseals, 1 seal, 2 breathers and 1 dam-rubber. It took them 10 workdays to do this (supposedly 1 was due to FedEx delay in delivering needed parts due to fires in San Diego.) The tally on the invoice was $2,300 before being charged to warranty. Fortunately, since it was under warranty, they provided a rental.

The car seems to be perfectly fine again. So I'm back to being happy with it.

Aside from the one instance 2 months earlier and this encounter, it has been the perfect car. With the info I have now, I'm guessing I was very lucky to not have it catch fire since Nissan engineering was suspecting leaking or arcing in the battery modules. Going forward, if it shows any symptoms, I will park it on the street until I can get it checked. While the invoice didn't comment on whether arcing, leaking or damage was found on any modules, the fact that 2 were replaced suggests something happened.

The dealer service department seemed very professional and seemed this time to properly find and fix the problem. I'm still quite happy with my Leaf, assuming this to be an isolated situation that is now fixed. I will update this post again if I get any new symptoms of battery/connection problems.

Any of you engineering types can provide more insight on those error codes?

Thanks!

 

[thankyouOB]

there are a variety of errors that can happen when you plug in that will not let you charge.
it is hard to know what you did, but the remedy, which i learned to use the hard way, is to always check that the blue lights are dancing appropriately, indicating a charge is in progress.

no blue lights blinking = not charging.

 

[user 10599]

Actually it's not a charging issue. I have no problems charging the car. And I do have a good habit of checking the lights when I plug in.

The issue here was a bad connection with the battery system inside the car that appears to sporadically lose its connection or short.