What is your guaranteed, worst-case, no-anxiety range?

[thankyouOB]

To qualify for posting here, trips should:

1. Start with 80% Charge (you must to be able to make the same trip when the battery is approaching replacement as when it's new).

2. Not use pre-heating or pre-cooling (you forgot/the power went out/it's an emergency). For bonus points, don't use battery warming either.

3. Use your HVAC system as necessary to provide comfortable (not just tolerable) conditions for you and your passengers, while wearing the clothes you'd normally wear, and with no aftermarket heating accessories. You paid $35k for the car; it should keep you as comfortable as the cheapest ICE. Report ambient temps, outside and (initial) interior, and temp settings you used on the HVAC.

4. Use your defroster and windshield wipers as necessary for safety, and report use.

5. Use your lights ditto, and report whether low/high/fog lights were used.

6. Use your infotainment system as you do otherwise; if you just have to play 'Purple Haze' at maximum volume during your trip, do so. Report.

7. Not take surface streets when there's a quicker, more convenient freeway that you'd otherwise take.

8. Not cruise in the far right lane of a multi-lane urban freeway at a speed that may be legal, but is definitely less safe. You should be a lane or two over. Cruise at whatever speed is the flow of traffic, whether that's the speed limit or something more, as long as you're comfortable doing so. Report speeds.

9. No hypermiling (drafting semis, coasting in neutral, constant power/decreasing speed up hills, etc.)

10. Not get a Very-low battery warning. Delays and diversions happen; you should keep a reserve. If you prefer, you can list your achievable range without getting a Low-battery warning, if you want more reserve.

11. Report elevation gain or loss.

12. Report number of people on board, their genders, and approximate ages (infant/child/teen/adult), or else the total payload weight.

the problem with this list is that it includes things I would not normally do (8 and 9, for sure) even in my manual turbo Volvo.

 

[thankyouOB]

In six months, my worse day was 3 m/kw. You wanted 80% charge (I always do 100%, but otherwise use all of the other restrictions and caveats, in this case it was 68 degrees, freeway, 1000' foot elevation change, alone, traveling with traffic (scal 75 mph) and in that scenario 50 miles is no sweat.

aside: My average day has been 5+ m/kw, and that is the same run, except I do the speed limit of 65 mph. So truth is I don't sweat until 75 miles. I did worry once about getting 85 miles on one longer loop multi-stop trip. To help my anxiety, I planned out where I would refuel, but then never had to make use of the refuel plan.

what he said, except my worst day was 3.9 and otherwise after 8k miles and 8 months, always above 4.0

 

[GRA]

I have modified the instructions to allow for people to start with 100% charge (just treat the 3rd white bar as LBW, and the 2nd as VLBW), and added special conditions (snow, chains etc.)

FWIW, when I got my hands on Tony's chart it didn't take much to figure that for my local driving the maximum guaranteed range multiplier (of the max. ideal range) wouldn't exceed .5, and might well fall as low as .33. This assumes -20% for battery aging, -20% for temperature (30 deg. vice 70 deg. F. Temps in the mid to low 20s here break records), and a guesstimate of at least -10% for lights, wipers, heat and defrost, which is probably too low. Boost that and it's pretty easy to get guaranteed ranges in the low thirties or mid twenties (assuming a reserve of 3-8 miles in VLBW). People who in live in real cold climates, instead of next to a large thermal sink like the Pacific Ocean as I do, are going to be very restricted in range.

 

[GRA]

To qualify for posting here, trips should:

<snip>

8. Not cruise in the far right lane of a multi-lane urban freeway at a speed that may be legal, but is definitely less safe. You should be a lane or two over. Cruise at whatever speed is the flow of traffic, whether that's the speed limit or something more, as long as you're comfortable doing so. Report speeds.

9. No hypermiling (drafting semis, coasting in neutral, constant power/decreasing speed up hills, etc.)

the problem with this list is that it includes things I would not normally do (8 and 9, for sure) even in my manual turbo Volvo.

Which is the point. Normal drivers Don't do these things, so they're not allowed for this.

 

[Blackhouse]

I feel very comfortable going 30 miles round trip on an 80% charge in very bad conditions. I have 1,500 miles on the OD in 2 months, charge daily to 80%, always play radio med level, low beam lights no fog used one way in the morning, and never pre-heat. I live on the backside of an 800ft hill with 25mph steep neighborhood roads leading to my covered garage. For the past month, my wife has been driving a 35+/- mile round trip route and is coming home with 2 of 12 battery bars remaining and 15+/- miles on the guessometer off of an 80% charge. She drives from the top of the hill down 3 miles to drop off a preschooler, drives back up the hill, drops off a 1st grader, drives down the hill to freeway 4 miles, freeway 11 miles 50-60mph -200ft, surface streets 3 miles +100ft to work, parks for 8hrs, drives home, plus 1-3 store stops to/from work. She was getting 3.3-3.5 m/kw with fan on 3 bars, temp set in low 60s, outside temp 45-60*, garage 53* and cost around $.75 on a 2.5ish hour charge, now with outside temp at 30-40*, and garage at 46*, she's getting 3.1-3.2m/kw and returned home once with 1 battery bar left, 9 miles on guessometer, with fan on 3-4 bars, front vent, temp set at 62*with a cost just over a dollar and 3.5ish hour charge. Charging time is increasing and range is dropping as the temps lower. The battery temp bars drop to 4 when the car sits for a while now. With an 80% charge, I can take my wife's odometer reading for the day and add the guessometer miles left and it usually adds up to a little over 50 miles. Now it adds up under 50 miles. 100% charge is needed to go more than 30 miles in very poor conditions with comfort.

I drive the same route 28 miles to the same work without dropping off the kids and driving up and down the hill. The first month when it was warmer, I hypermiled, no cc and I could get 5.3m/kw using 4 energy bars, 6 left. In the Prius, I get 52mpg, wife gets 48 round trip or 45mpg when dropping off kids. Whoever drives farthest gets to drive the Leaf. It's usually her.

 

[GRA]

Excellent post, Blackhouse! Just the kind of info we're looking for.

Guy

 

[MrFish]

For me a more simplistic approach is to use the rule of thumb method with no stress:

75 mph on freeway = 5 miles per bar

60 mph on freeway = 6.5 miles per bar

Around town = 6 miles per bar

I know it isn't what you asked for but it works for me.

 

[thankyouOB]

To qualify for posting here, trips should:

<snip>

8. Not cruise in the far right lane of a multi-lane urban freeway at a speed that may be legal, but is definitely less safe. You should be a lane or two over. Cruise at whatever speed is the flow of traffic, whether that's the speed limit or something more, as long as you're comfortable doing so. Report speeds.

9. No hypermiling (drafting semis, coasting in neutral, constant power/decreasing speed up hills, etc.)

the problem with this list is that it includes things I would not normally do (8 and 9, for sure) even in my manual turbo Volvo.

Which is the point. Normal drivers Don't do these things, so they're not allowed for this.

I said exclude these two because I DO THEM even in my ICE. (it is a double negative the way the OP set it up.)

 

[leafme]

50 mi (81 km) from 80% charge. Car has 9k+ mi (14.6k km), solo, in San Diego, CA, USA, minimal elevation change but some, winter, 58 deg F (14.4 deg C) daytime, 40 deg F (4.4 deg C) nighttime, coming home in the dark, climate control on auto at 75 deg F (24 deg C), lights on, wipers on, raining all day, mostly freeway at 65+ mph (97.2 km/h) (slower when the rain is coming down) with Mick and the boys blastin' out "Can't ya hear me knocking" supported by an added pair of 250w/100w, 6 inch (15.2 cm), Bazooka BTA6250D/BT6014 woofers behind the rear seat (yowza bebay and takin' noooooo prisoners).

Malcolm

 

[Mx5racer]

80% and driving normal (75 on the freeway) is 45 miles
if I need more I will charge to 100%
at 100% it is about 55 miles

This gets me hope with 7-8 miles left.
at the last bar things get stressful

 

[kmp647]

I just completed a 35 mile drive @ 26F. Driving on highway with traffic and hot cabin. Even did a pre-heat on battery before driving back. Got 3.2 m/kwh or 67 miles @ 100%, 54 miles @ 80% (50 to v. low battery).

Those numbers seem to all be based on 21kWh.... which won't be available at low temps.

I didn't see much capacity loss at one temperature bar and 3 F outside. No regen for quite a while though, even with a 80% charge. Still did 62 miles on 77% of the battery with heater blasting all the time. There was some elevation loss, but mostly at the start when I had no regen at all.

1 battery temp bar?

How long did it take to drop to 1 temp bar?

 

[brent]

I'm only a week into the Leaf, and first snow here started the night I brought it home ( just north of Toronto)

My trip to work is 28 miles (45km) and I have not yet had the courage to start home without charging at work.
The Guess-O-Meter says I should be able to make it, but each day last week got colder and the range dropped off.
The trip to work drops a few hundred feet and the return climbs that, and the wind is almost always in my face on
the return, so at our temps, I'd say a safe no worry trip would be about 20 out and 20 back .... on a 100% charge.

 

[LEAFfan]

80% and driving normal (75 on the freeway)

So in CA, ALL your freeways/Interstates have 75mph speed limits? Normal here is 55 and 65. The only 75 is once you are beyond Phoenix.

 

[adric22]

80% and driving normal (75 on the freeway)

So in CA, ALL your freeways/Interstates have 75mph speed limits? Normal here is 55 and 65. The only 75 is once you are beyond Phoenix.

Most of our speed limits in the Dallas/Ft.Worth area are 65 on the highway. However, most of the time traffic in all lanes is moving faster than that with left lane speeds around 80 and right lane speeds around 70.

 

[OrientExpress]

For the last 7500 miles we have driven our Leaf between 50 & 98 miles each day on a single charge with no issues.

 

[TonyWilliams]

For the last 7500 miles we have driven our Leaf between 50 & 98 miles each day on a single charge with no issues.

So, in the context of this thread, 50 is the number?

 

[GRA]

the problem with this list is that it includes things I would not normally do (8 and 9, for sure) even in my manual turbo Volvo.

Which is the point. Normal drivers Don't do these things, so they're not allowed for this.

I said exclude these two because I DO THEM even in my ICE. (it is a double negative the way the OP set it up.)

Ah, got ya. Definitely not mainstream practice.

 

[thankyouOB]

80% and driving normal (75 on the freeway)

So in CA, ALL your freeways/Interstates have 75mph speed limits? Normal here is 55 and 65. The only 75 is once you are beyond Phoenix.

the speed limits in CA are generally topped at 65 mph.
There are some exceptions, allowing 70 mph. they are limited, in the boonies and can be found here:
http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/roadinfo/70mph.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[GRA]

80% and driving normal (75 on the freeway)

So in CA, ALL your freeways/Interstates have 75mph speed limits? Normal here is 55 and 65. The only 75 is once you are beyond Phoenix.

Most of our speed limits in the Dallas/Ft.Worth area are 65 on the highway. However, most of the time traffic in all lanes is moving faster than that with left lane speeds around 80 and right lane speeds around 70.

Interstate speeds in California are 65, except on a few sections of rural interstates where it's 70 - see

http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/roadinfo/70mph.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

California drivers know the CHP will give them about a 5 mph cushion to allow for speedometer error, so the flow of traffic is usually 4-5 mph over the speed limit, if not more. For example, crossing the San Mateo Bridge (65 mph) in light traffic around noon a few Sundays back, initial flow after accelerating out of the toll plaza was 69-70. Several miles further on at the base of the incline, and with no opportunity for CHP to enter the bridge in the middle, flow in the middle lanes had increased to 73mph. Of course, there are always people going faster than the flow if the traffic allows.

Riding along with a friend of mine in his 328i from Oakley to Concord in moderate traffic on Highway 4 a week ago Friday after midday, we were cruising in the fast lane at 85, which was the flow in that lane. I'd estimate the flow in the middle lanes at 70+, with the right lane in the high 60s. I-5 in the Central Valley, and I imagine I-15 in the desert tend to move well above 75 in the fast lane. Plenty of people are cruising at 85, and there are more than a few doing 100 or more.

Edit: Oops, you beat me to it!

 

[GRA]

I'm only a week into the Leaf, and first snow here started the night I brought it home ( just north of Toronto)

My trip to work is 28 miles (45km) and I have not yet had the courage to start home without charging at work.
The Guess-O-Meter says I should be able to make it, but each day last week got colder and the range dropped off.
The trip to work drops a few hundred feet and the return climbs that, and the wind is almost always in my face on
the return, so at our temps, I'd say a safe no worry trip would be about 20 out and 20 back .... on a 100% charge.

What kind of temps are you seeing now?