Used Leaf or Volt below $15,000?

[theaveng]

I'm sure they exist somewhere*. Help me find one.

*
* my insight only cost $13,000 new; it was a demonstrator. My Beetle was $11,000 used. I'm sure I can find a used Leaf or Volt for a low price too..... just a matter of being patient.

 

[braineo]

Move to Georgia. After Tax Credits you can get a new one for less than $15,000 ($7,500 federal + $5,000 State tax credits) or move to West Virginia ($7,500 federal + $7,500 state tax credits).

 

[sirenbrian]

I've been watching the iseecars.com used nissan leaf queue and have been surprised that the price of used LEAFS (2011s and 2012s) hasn't dropped much since the introduction of the 2013s, including of course the cheaper S model. They've fallen to a low of about $17K, and you're taking a gamble on the condition of the battery.

For me, that price is close enough to a new S trim Leaf that I leased one of them instead of buying a used one. I get a brand new car and battery, full warranty, peace of mind etc. and I don't mind not having a built-in GPS, smart phone etc.

Good luck with your search!

 

[theaveng]

Move to Georgia. After Tax Credits you can get a new one for less than $15,000 ($7,500 federal + $5,000 State tax credits) or move to West Virginia ($7,500 federal + $7,500 state tax credits).

(1) How does a poor state like W.Virginia afford to give away so much money? That's incredible. (2) I actually have PA as my permanent residence. I need to look to see how much tax credit they give away.

 

[redLEAF]

Move to Georgia. After Tax Credits you can get a new one for less than $15,000 ($7,500 federal + $5,000 State tax credits) or move to West Virginia ($7,500 federal + $7,500 state tax credits).

(1) How does a poor state like W.Virginia afford to give away so much money? That's incredible. (2) I actually have PA as my permanent residence. I need to look to see how much tax credit they give away.

What other EV options exist? The Fit EV? MiEV? Anything else?

If you only need 2 seats smart will have a 3rd generation electric drive here -- right now about $3,800 less (at MSRP) than the SV LEAF so about $17,500 after just the Federal Tax rebate, slow rollout in the U.S. though; buying new gets you the best battery warranty -- here in IL the 'net' would be about $15,000 ($7,500 federal + $2,500 State IL EPA (10% of MSRP up to $4K) cash rebate); you'll see a few more EV's if you live in CA (BMW 'i', Fiat 500e, etc.) as compliance cars but nothing this cheap (for now).

http://www.smartusa.com/models/electric-drive/overview.aspx

 

[theaveng]

Ne'er mind. I see from a startpage search that the other EVs are "compliance cars" to meet ZEV credits. Nissan, Telsa, and Chevy are the only mainstream manufacturers making mass-market For Sale electrics

 

[theaveng]

http://www.iseecars.com/used-cars/used-nissan-leaf-for-sale

VERY useful link. I wonder what's "wrong" with the $8000 car?

As for the Smart car I've found they get lousy MPG in their gasoline and diesel models. I bet the electric Smart is equally poor (either low MPGe or low range). I saw a really hot dark-red Volt on youtube with black roof.... really nice looking. Reminded me of my dark Dodge Avenger.

 

[TomT]

I suspect you'll see a much bigger drop when the 2011s start coming off of lease soon...

I've been watching the iseecars.com used nissan leaf queue and have been surprised that the price of used LEAFS (2011s and 2012s) hasn't dropped much since the introduction of the 2013s, including of course the cheaper S model. They've fallen to a low of about $17K, and you're taking a gamble on the condition of the battery.

 

[RonDawg]

Ne'er mind. I see from a startpage search that the other EVs are "compliance cars" to meet ZEV credits. Nissan, Telsa, and Chevy are the only mainstream manufacturers making mass-market For Sale electrics

The Ford Focus Electric and Mitsubishi IMiEV are also officially available for purchase outside of CA.

 

[rmay635703]

Old thread but when this was posted as well as now there are high mile leafs and volts under $15k, just need to look around a bit.

I am almost tempted to get one with 85000 miles but the proffesy that lots of cars will come off lease and be cheap thus far has not materialized. Given the slowness of the rollout and semi-decent demand I don't think we will be swimming in lease returns until this fall (late).

Also cars with "normal" miles are worth more than I expected, but with the very important warranties on these cars the price seems to follow a bell curve as you approach the end of the warranty.

So maybe in the future some better deals (aka below the $13.5k bottom) we seem to see lately, odd part was last year or late 2 years ago a few in the $12k area sold

Ah well, never know how the values will go till we get there. I was hoping for lower mile specimens to end up in the price brackets I am seeing on the high milers, I guess I just wait a little longer but then run the risk of entering the buying season again.

 

[braineo]

i just picked up my 2nd EV (for wife) a 2012 Mitsu iMiev SE demo with 700 miles for 6,750 after tax credits. I thought i would never beat my $15k price (after tax credits) for a new 2011 Leaf SL demo with 300 miles. Bith cars have Navigation and all options including Chademo. Next car will be to replace my old ICE vehicles for long distance travel. Waiting for a model E.

 

[greenleaf]

Any idea how much would a 2011 LEAF SL with Q/C fetch, say with 36k miles?

 

[CayenneSJLEAFy]

Capital Chevrolet in San Jose has 2 LEAFs--a black one with 39K and a red one with 44K. The red one is asking for $16.2K and the black one is asking for $15.9K. I find they're asking too high, given that Sunnyvale Nissan had a certified one with 16K for $15K (it might be sold now).

I would expect that the resale will crater further once the lease returns start coming in. Once dealers and prospects start figuring out what the lost capacity bars mean, dealers may not even want to take them in on trade.

 

[greenleaf]

Capital Chevrolet in San Jose has 2 LEAFs--a black one with 39K and a red one with 44K. The red one is asking for $16.2K and the black one is asking for $15.9K. I find they're asking too high, given that Sunnyvale Nissan had a certified one with 16K for $15K (it might be sold now).

I would expect that the resale will crater further once the lease returns start coming in. Once dealers and prospects start figuring out what the lost capacity bars mean, dealers may not even want to take them in on trade.

Hmm. Looks like it can only fetch $14k to $15k when I try to sell mine in two months. On hindsight, leasing would have been a better deal. The residue value of a 36-month lease was given as $16k+ at that time.

 

[DaveEV]

I would expect that the resale will crater further once the lease returns start coming in. Once dealers and prospects start figuring out what the lost capacity bars mean, dealers may not even want to take them in on trade.

Hmm. Looks like it can only fetch $14k to $15k when I try to sell mine in two months. On hindsight, leasing would have been a better deal. The residue value of a 36-month lease was given as $16k+ at that time.[/quote]
You're looking at the wrong numbers.

In California a LEAF would have cost you about $25k after taxes, tax credit and state rebate in early 2011.

If you can sell for $14k, your cost is $11k, which would be a monthly lease of ~$305/mo. No way you could have gotten a LEAF on lease for that price back then. Most were paying $400-450, IIRC which would put your 3-year cost of leasing at $14.4k minimum which means that as long as you sell for at least $10.6k you are coming out ahead.

EDIT: I forgot that the CA rebate applies to the lease prices, too. See greenleaf's corrections below.

 

[adric22]

Those used Leafs with lost capacity may be worth more than you think. If they are well under 60,000 miles and the battery looks like its near losing the 4th bar, then the buyer can reasonably expect at this point to get a battery replacement in the near future. Since I doubt there are a lot of used batteries floating around at this point, one might assume a high probability of getting a brand new battery.

 

[greenleaf]

You're looking at the wrong numbers.

In California a LEAF would have cost you about $25k after taxes, tax credit and state rebate in early 2011.

If you can sell for $14k, your cost is $11k, which would be a monthly lease of ~$305/mo. No way you could have gotten a LEAF on lease for that price back then. Most were paying $400-450, IIRC which would put your 3-year cost of leasing at $14.4k minimum which means that as long as you sell for at least $10.6k you are coming out ahead.

A lease at say $400 for 36 months would be $14.4k. But I think we should also take out the $5000 of CA rebate. That would leave a total cost of only $9400. Is this correct?

Of course if the lease was $450, then the cost over the 3 years would have been 450*36-5000 = $11.2k.

 

[DaveEV]

A lease at say $400 for 36 months would be $14.4k. But I think we should also take out the $5000 of CA rebate. That would leave a total cost of only $9400. Is this correct?

Of course if the lease was $450, then the cost over the 3 years would have been 450*36-5000 = $11.2k.

Doh, you're right! So what were people leasing for early on? I do recall hearing numbers in the $450/mo ballpark range back then.

Anyway, if you can sell for ~$14k after 3 years, it still appears to come out as a wash between leasing/buying so far.

But who knows - prices may fall more as more lease returns start hitting the market, especially around June when the initial wave of deliveries made it here. That also brings to question - were people signing 36 or 39 month leases?

 

[greenleaf]

From my printout 3 years ago, the 36-month lease was $379 + tax per month with $1999 down.

after tax savings, net as low as $26,220 MSRP $33,720 with federal tax savings from 0-$7,500
$379 a month 1 - 36 month lease
($1,999 initial customer payment)
Excludes tax, title and license. MSRP subject to change. MY 2012 MSRP to be announced later. Initially available through online
reservation process. Orders through dealers commencing in August (in limited areas) and sales by dealer commences in
December 2010. LEASE payment of $379/mo. is an example of an offer if vehicle were sold in August 2010. The actual lease
offer for NMAC ("NILT") will be announced in December 2010 when sales commence. Subject to change. Limited quantities
available in select markets and states through online reservation system. Increased availability in Spring 2011 with full market
rollout through 2012. At start of sale, one order per household address until availability increases. Taxpayer must incur federal tax
liability to receive full benefits. Consult your tax professional.
1 Estimated monthly payment based on proposed offer subject to change at start of sale. Estimates include assumed residual,
money factor, and acquisition fee amounts. Excludes taxes, title, and license. $1,999 initial payment required at consummation
(includes $1,620 down payment and $379 first month payment). 2011 LEAF SL subject to availability to well qualified lessees
through Nissan-Infiniti LT ("NILT"). Subject to credit approval. Based upon $33,720 MSRP plus destination charge. Adjusted net
capitalized cost of $25,521 includes $7,500 manufacturer incentive for federal tax credit available to NILT by law, and $595 non-
refundable acquisition fee. Dealer contribution may affect actual price set by dealer. Monthly payments total $13,644. Lessee is
responsible for maintenance and repair. Lease payment excludes the cost of the EVSE/charging dock charging equipment.
Security deposit not required. Disposition fee due at termination of lease term. See participating dealer for details. Offer ends
September 30, 2010. Subject to change. Finalized lease terms available to be set upon start of sale.

 

[DaveEV]

$379 * 35 + $1999 = $15,264
+Tax (about 10%) = $16,790
-CA rebate = $11,790

IIRC my cost out the door was ~$25k including sales tax - tax credit - CA rebate.

So if I sell in June if I can do better than $13k I end up ahead.

May be close either way.