Update on Nissan LEAF Battery Replacement

[JPWhite]

The discussion was simply on the merits and ramifications of having to maintain multiple, different battery inventories, nothing more... Sometime people try to read things in to comments that are simply not there from the OP...

It does appear that there are some who feel Nissan did not do any of this to help their customers or provide better service, but was instead primarily self-serving.

That's cynicism in my book, I agree with Stanton.

That isn't to say there aren't grounds to have become cynical in the first place, slow to listen, slow to acknowledge, slow to act etc. Now that something decent has happened, I believe its time to leave some of that cynicism behind.

 

[vgonzalez]

I own a 2011 Leaf and plan to keep it for many years, the replacement battery packs fits all current years, but the possibly of Nissan no longer making the kit for 2011 or 2012 might be a possibility, I know our Leaf will be needing one in the future so I am going to arrange and purchase this kit.

 

[Wennfred]

I own a 2011 Leaf and plan to keep it for many years, the replacement battery packs fits all current years, but the possibly of Nissan no longer making the kit for 2011 or 2012 might be a possibility, I know our Leaf will be needing one in the future so I am going to arrange and purchase this kit.

+1 ...

I wonder if they only sell the kit with the battery pack only to prevent after market battery installs.

Fred

 

[vgonzalez]

I own a 2011 Leaf and plan to keep it for many years, the replacement battery packs fits all current years, but the possibly of Nissan no longer making the kit for 2011 or 2012 might be a possibility, I know our Leaf will be needing one in the future so I am going to arrange and purchase this kit.

+1 ...

I wonder if they only sell the kit with the battery pack only to prevent after market battery installs.

Fred

I have a schedule 3 years maintenance coming up and definitely will be asking the Nissan parts department.

 

[DaveInAvl]

Now that something decent has happened, I believe its time to leave some of that cynicism behind.

Agree. The alternative could easily lead a throwing up of hands, be they individual or corporate, and concluding, "There's no pleasing these people!"

I don't have anything against the notion of "never being satisfied" if it serves the purpose of encouraging positive growth/change. However, using that tool for relentless criticism, including (or especially?) the questioning of motives, seems unlikely to accomplish that...

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

This does bring to mind the validity of having a more flexible charging system as a whole. Realistically, mating the SW/HW should be made simpler. Have no idea what the current hurdles are but the ability to be backwards compatible on the LEAFs for at least several years is a real issue that will continue to crop up over and over again. With my VERY limited knowledge, can it simply be a question of providing a voltage/current that is within a certain range?

 

[evnow]

I've split all the range & refuel related offtopic comments to a different thread.

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=17413" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Nissan confirms the battery replacement program is a money loser:
https://www.yahoo.com/autos/news/nissan-leaf-5-500-battery-replacement-loses-money-122625212.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[mctom987]

All that said, however, after the first month, "we have yet to sell one battery as part of the program."

Not one?

I didn't buy a 2011 Leaf, but if I had, I probably would have taken up the offer on that battery.

Maybe those early adopters are fine with the ~60-70% capacity. I don't think the capacity falls as fast after that point, leaving little to gain if 60% is sufficient.

 

[WetEV]

All that said, however, after the first month, "we have yet to sell one battery as part of the program."

Not one?

I didn't buy a 2011 Leaf, but if I had, I probably would have taken up the offer on that battery.

Maybe those early adopters are fine with the ~60-70% capacity. I don't think the capacity falls as fast after that point, leaving little to gain if 60% is sufficient.

Many are under the capacity warranty. The relative few outside that are more likely to buy a battery before the weather gets cold than during the heat of summer.

 

[abasile]

Maybe those early adopters are fine with the ~60-70% capacity. I don't think the capacity falls as fast after that point, leaving little to gain if 60% is sufficient.

Our early 2011 LEAF still has roughly 80% of its original capacity. While this has necessitated the use of a gasoline burning car for some drives that the LEAF could previously handle, our LEAF is still good for local driving (no more than ~25 miles from home and less than 2000' of elevation change), as well as some longer drives when we're willing/able to wait longer when using public charging. Even at 60% capacity, our LEAF should be okay for almost all of our local driving. So, even at Nissan's subsidized replacement price, there's not sufficient ROI for us to justify the purchase of a new battery. It's still comforting to know that the option exists if we change our mind.

 

[Sifuyee]

This is excellent news! When I was deciding whether to purchase a Leaf or another EV I had to work hard to get dealers (of all vehicles) to level with me on the eventual replacement cost of the battery pack. Finally one dealer gave me the honest answer that they just didn't know for sure but he said that if he took the replacement cost of a single module and multiplied by the number of modules then guessed at some labor savings he would estimate the full cost at between $13-$15k. Of course he pointed out that by the time I should need replacement the unit price should come way down as more capacity in manufacturing came online. Even at the estimated price from the dealer, the Leaf is still a great ROI, so the numbers just improve the outlook.

 

[JPWhite]

All that said, however, after the first month, "we have yet to sell one battery as part of the program."

Not one?

I didn't buy a 2011 Leaf, but if I had, I probably would have taken up the offer on that battery.

Maybe those early adopters are fine with the ~60-70% capacity. I don't think the capacity falls as fast after that point, leaving little to gain if 60% is sufficient.

Many are under the capacity warranty. The relative few outside that are more likely to buy a battery before the weather gets cold than during the heat of summer.

Even though I am still under the capacity warranty, the only reason I haven't bought a replacement battery is that the car still gets me to and from work every day thanks to charging close to my workplace. I have 10,000 miles left on the capacity warranty, but if in the winter I can't make it without a quick charge visit I will consider buying the replacement pack early.

I anticipate I will face 3 primary options if the car no longer meets my needs.

1. Buy a new LEAF and sell/trade the old one.
2. Buy a used 2013 LEAF with low miles and no more than 15% degradation.
3. Buy a new pack.

If that decision comes about I'll weigh the costs and merits of each option. The capacity warranty will not apply to me before I reach 60,000 miles, I'm at one bar loss and 50,000 miles currently.

If I can get through the next two winters then I may never need to buy a pack. My employer will have a new office closer to home (25 miles one way) with workplace charging.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

I recall an old Yugoslavian friend of my parents from many years ago had a saying: "For free take, for buy waste time"

 

[evnow]

All that said, however, after the first month, "we have yet to sell one battery as part of the program."

Not surprising at all - all along I've thought the buy option is more an emotional need than an immediate practical need. Even SFTyler isn't buying one (he did buy a new Leaf).

 

[DaveEV]

All that said, however, after the first month, "we have yet to sell one battery as part of the program."

Not surprising at all - all along I've thought the buy option is more an emotional need than an immediate practical need. Even SFTyler isn't buying one (he did buy a new Leaf).

What's surprising is that even though the expected sales rate is slow (and is not surprising given that nearly all packs are still under capacity warranty), it still took Nissan a long time to come up with it while in the meantime, it left owners with a lot of uncertainty even if nearly all would never take Nissan up on the offer.

Let's look at the economics of buying a new battery for an old LEAF:

2011 LEAF SL cost ~$25k (inc sales tax and all rebates)
2015 LEAF SV cost ~$23k (inc sales tax and all rebates)

Trade-in value of 2011 LEAF (guestimate): $12k
Cost to install 2015 LEAF battery into 2011 LEAF (inc adapter/labor/tax): $6500

So your options are for $11k you can get into a new LEAF.
Or for $6500 you can get a new battery pack.

But with the new LEAF you get a few things which have significant value, IMO:
6.6 kW OBC
Heat-pump heating
More trunk space
Fresh bumper-bumper and power-train warranty

So in the end, I think it's probably about a wash in terms of value if you want to stay in a LEAF and value those additional features. I think for most LEAF fans you're probably more likely to see them trade-in to a new LEAF than buy a replacement battery pack at this point.

 

[thankyouOB]

All that said, however, after the first month, "we have yet to sell one battery as part of the program."

Not surprising at all - all along I've thought the buy option is more an emotional need than an immediate practical need. Even SFTyler isn't buying one (he did buy a new Leaf).

who is quoted here. i dont see an attribution, though i havent re-read the whole thread.

---
that said, has nissan reported that anyone has opted for the SYB program at $100 a month?

 

[Stoaty]

All that said, however, after the first month, "we have yet to sell one battery as part of the program."

Not surprising at all - all along I've thought the buy option is more an emotional need than an immediate practical need. Even SFTyler isn't buying one (he did buy a new Leaf).

who is quoted here. i dont see an attribution, though i havent re-read the whole thread.

The quote is from Nissan at the end of this article:

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1093463_nissan-leaf-5500-battery-replacement-loses-money-company-admits" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[swaltner]

All that said, however, after the first month, "we have yet to sell one battery as part of the program."

Not surprising at all - all along I've thought the buy option is more an emotional need than an immediate practical need. Even SFTyler isn't buying one (he did buy a new Leaf).

who is quoted here. i dont see an attribution, though i havent re-read the whole thread.

That was a quote from Jeff Kuhlman, Nissan's vice president of global communications, from the Yahoo! Autos news article.

 

[TimLee]

who is quoted here. i dont see an attribution, though i havent re-read the whole thread.

---
that said, has nissan reported that anyone has opted for the SYB program at $100 a month?

Jeff Kuhlman, Nissan's vice president of global
communication
In the Green Car Reports article.

SYB program at $100 a month never arrived. Nissan killed it (with a lot of encouragement from all of us).
Later in the year they will offer a financing package and terms for buying replacement battery.
Will be interesting to see how close that is to $100 per month.