Surprise: No Level-2 High charging for LEAF? 15A maximum!

[Coffee_Slurry]

It's also a bit misleading that Nissan sends out the Level info above when anyone asks "how long does it take to charge". If Level2 High is not an option (ever), then that might be nice to point out.

This statement keeps bugging me. What information is Nissan sending out or has it sent out any time recently about Level2 high?

That's what Nissan told me in Live Chat. Straight from our transcript when I asked how much current the car uses while charging:

Level One Charging uses 110V - 15 A, The Charge Power is 1.4kW and would take about 18 hours to charge.
Level 2 (low) Charging uses 220 V -15A, The Charge Power is 3.3kW and will charge in about 8 hours
Level 2 (high) Charging uses 220 V - 30A, The Charge Power is 6.6kW and will charge in about 4 hours
Level 3 Charging uses 480V - 167A, The Charge Power is 70 - 50 kW and will charge in 20 -50 minutes.

I believe this is misleading information, since there is no way to do a 4hr charge on AC.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

Car marketing 101- it gets them to sell more SL models and ONLY SL will be wired initially per the nissan Rep. 7.2 kw charging won't hurt the pack, if it did then L3 would destroy it shortly, there is a HUGE difference in heat on those two. Driving the car at a constant speed is harder on the pack then 7.2 kw charging. Most Leaf orders are SL so that blows the "limit" the fast charging option. 7.2 kw is only 30A, thats low current considering hill climbs will pull closer to 200A plus.

Does drinking a beer every night when you come home shorten your life? Nah! How about two beers? Or three? Well there might be some long term effects. Now how about pounding down a 12-pack every night? Will it kill you? Probably not, but it sure isn't good for you.

You may not have much choice whether or not to drive up a hill now and then. But that doesn't mean it isn't a life shortening activity; that might be like downing a 6 pack After all the surgeon general warned us that driving up hills a lot is hazardous to the Leaf's health.

My point is just that I don't think Nissan really knows how these batteries are going to perform when the cars get in the hands of real world users. You seem confident the Leaf can live a long happy life charging in four hours; I'm thinking that, particularly considering most people sleep or are home for at least 8 hours most nights, slower charging is a healthier lifestyle for the Leaf population as a whole. Risk mitigation 101.

 

[EVDRIVER]

Car marketing 101- it gets them to sell more SL models and ONLY SL will be wired initially per the nissan Rep. 7.2 kw charging won't hurt the pack, if it did then L3 would destroy it shortly, there is a HUGE difference in heat on those two. Driving the car at a constant speed is harder on the pack then 7.2 kw charging. Most Leaf orders are SL so that blows the "limit" the fast charging option. 7.2 kw is only 30A, thats low current considering hill climbs will pull closer to 200A plus.

Does drinking a beer every night when you come home shorten your life? Nah! How about two beers? Or three? Well there might be some long term effects. Now how about pounding down a 12-pack every night? Will it kill you? Probably not, but it sure isn't good for you.

You may not have much choice whether or not to drive up a hill now and then. But that doesn't mean it isn't a life shortening activity; that might be like downing a 6 pack After all the surgeon general warned us that driving up hills a lot is hazardous to the Leaf's health.

My point is just that I don't think Nissan really knows how these batteries are going to perform when the cars get in the hands of real world users. You seem confident the Leaf can live a long happy life charging in four hours; I'm thinking that, particularly considering most people sleep or are home for at least 8 hours most nights, slower charging is a healthier lifestyle for the Leaf population as a whole. Risk mitigation 101.

Charging the pack at any voltage shortens the life and so does using it. The difference between 3.3 and 7.2 KWh charging is not worth mentioning. The decision to use 3.3kw over say 6.6/7.2 was not pack life. L3 doe smake a differnce on pack life and the reason they don't want it done 2x a day is pack heat. It was a cost issue not a pack life issue.

 

[evnow]

It was a cost issue not a pack life issue.

I'm not even sure it was a cost issue - though it may have played a role. I think it was just wrongly speced - mostly for EU where 3.3kw is the widely available home power source. Nissan is probably sharing this charger with Renault.

 

[palmermd]

Based completely on a hunch, I got the impression that Nissan was going to "stack" the chargers like the way the Brusa chargers scale up. Brusa makes a 3.3kw charger, 6.7kw, and 10kw. The 3.3 is a single charger, 6.7 is two of them and 10 is three of them connected together. There is certainly enough room under the "bridge" that they built behind the back seat to put two 3.3kw chargers. I hope that is the case, and if so, it will be quite easy to upgrade the charger from 3.3 to 6.6 as long as the cable from the nose to the charger is sized properly.

http://www.brusa.biz/products/e_nlg5112.htm

 

[palmermd]

I read this in the GM-Volt.com review of the Nissan Leaf and thought it was an interesting comment. I wonder what was meant by this. I would love to have heard this comment on the video or had some followup questions to clarify.

The on-board charger is limited to 3.3 kw, same as the VOLT, or 240-v and 20 amps. At that rate a full recharge will take 8 hours. The charger is capable of a faster rate, but Hawson says most customers’ homes won’t tolerate more than 20 amp 240-v service.

My guess is that he meant to say the batteries can handle a faster charge rate.

http://gm-volt.com/2010/10/04/nissan-leaf-test-drive-and-review-wvideo/

 

[smkettner]

My home has 200a service and is nothing that special. As far as I am concerned the house limit is just flat wrong.

 

[LEAFfan]

Does drinking a beer every night when you come home shorten your life? Nah! How about two beers? Or three? Well there might be some long term effects. Now how about pounding down a 12-pack every night? Will it kill you? Probably not, but it sure isn't good for you.

Umm, that wasn't a good analogy. I guarantee you that if you down a 12-pack every night, you won't live that long. Your liver would become mush in a short time and you would definitely die from liver failure and or alcohol poisoning.

 

[evnow]

My home has 200a service and is nothing that special. As far as I am concerned the house limit is just flat wrong.

Least Common Denominator ?

 

[EVDRIVER]

Chargers are expensive, they are one of the more expensive electronic items besides the motor and inverter and the more powerful the charger the more costly and the more cooling it needs. This is not a pack issue, let's get off that silly point since the motor pulls massive current from the pack for extended times. If they were able to add a stackable module that would be great but I doubt it. I have owed a few Brusa chargers and I think they use that model because o limited production and to keep production simple but it becomes far more complex and expensive to buy and uses quite a bit of space. A charger with 2X the power is only slightly larger and only needs one set of connections and cooling lines if used. Brusa is insanely expensive and takes up lots of space. Look at the form factor of a PFC 30 VS PFC 50. Regardless, I really hope Nissan has an upgrade path early on but it would be wise for someone to make an L3 external kit that is 40-50A like a PCF based project . You could take it along and use it at home, even do 20A 120V if needed. Nothing novel about that idea though.