So, owners what range are you getting ?

[donald]

Conserving range was only one of the reasons, the Leaf is so quiet that I enjoy cruising the city streets with the windows down listening to the urban sounds around me.

Depending on my mood (!) and circumstances, I agree.

Driving certain streets (not all, though!!!) is a different experience in an EV. Different, and otherwise less economic routes for ICEs may become a better route for EVs for economy and less wear & tear, but I agree that in some cases it is simply a different and more pleasant experience.

My wife has already noted as such - 'Why are you going this way, you always go that way?' - 'because this is a better route for an EV'.

Which integrates with the question of achievable range - it may not simply be a case of absolute miles, it may also be a case of the equivalent ICE journey, which may be two different things because of the nature of an EV.

What possible road conditions exist that anyone could possibly drive at a steady 15 mph I have no idea. But I would take a 15 mile journey around a city in an ICE car at 60mph, than a 5 mile journey through a town at a 20 mph average. That may invert with an EV. So if it took a kWh across town, have I now achieved "15 miles [ICE equivalent]/kWh" instead of 5m/kWh?

 

[djchrispaul]

2012 Leaf, Palm Springs, 4780 miles. Yesterday I charged to 100% I have lost a bar already but it showed 12 charged bars of 11. Drove in Eco from Palm Springs to La Quinta freeway for 10 miles 62mph then surface roads, back to Palm Springs, total 49 miles with 6 left on the GOM. No a/c. Display showed 3.5 kW average. I am totally disappointed with the car, it hates Palm Springs weather. Hoping the cooler October weather would improve the range but no.
This is my second leaf, I purchased my first in September 2011 then traded in last year for a lease vehicle because of range issues with the heat here.
80% charged every night! only full charge when I have an extended trip planned, bearing in mind extended to me seems to be 25 miles from my house.
I don't get range anxiety at all as I know the car but with this golf cart range I have, I find myself not having the enjoyable days out that I used to.
The car is actually making me feel trapped! I will have to stick with it till the end of the lease due to the fact they are just not worth anything used. KBB quote is about 17-18k on a year old car that cost 36k.
I have to admit that I am defeated and am looking at a volt although I don't particularly like them but once you drive electric, there is no way back!

 

[KJD]

2012 Leaf, Palm Springs, 4780 miles. Yesterday I charged to 100% I have lost a bar already but it showed 12 charged bars of 11. Drove in Eco from Palm Springs to La Quinta freeway for 10 miles 62mph then surface roads, back to Palm Springs, total 49 miles with 6 left on the GOM. No a/c. Display showed 3.5 kW average. I am totally disappointed with the car, it hates Palm Springs weather. Hoping the cooler October weather would improve the range but no.
This is my second leaf, I purchased my first in September 2011 then traded in last year for a lease vehicle because of range issues with the heat here.
80% charged every night! only full charge when I have an extended trip planned, bearing in mind extended to me seems to be 25 miles from my house.
I don't get range anxiety at all as I know the car but with this golf cart range I have, I find myself not having the enjoyable days out that I used to.
The car is actually making me feel trapped! I will have to stick with it till the end of the lease due to the fact they are just not worth anything used. KBB quote is about 17-18k on a year old car that cost 36k.
I have to admit that I am defeated and am looking at a volt although I don't particularly like them but once you drive electric, there is no way back!

Have you looked at the RAV4 EV. It has a lot more range than the LEAF.

The Tesla batteries seem to hold up better in the heat. The battery cooling system in the RAV would also be useful in Palm Springs.

The other option you have is wait for the BMW i3 to come out. It may like the heat better than your LEAF.

 

[djchrispaul]

2012 Leaf, Palm Springs, 4780 miles. Yesterday I charged to 100% I have lost a bar already but it showed 12 charged bars of 11. Drove in Eco from Palm Springs to La Quinta freeway for 10 miles 62mph then surface roads, back to Palm Springs, total 49 miles with 6 left on the GOM. No a/c. Display showed 3.5 kW average. I am totally disappointed with the car, it hates Palm Springs weather. Hoping the cooler October weather would improve the range but no.
This is my second leaf, I purchased my first in September 2011 then traded in last year for a lease vehicle because of range issues with the heat here.
80% charged every night! only full charge when I have an extended trip planned, bearing in mind extended to me seems to be 25 miles from my house.
I don't get range anxiety at all as I know the car but with this golf cart range I have, I find myself not having the enjoyable days out that I used to.
The car is actually making me feel trapped! I will have to stick with it till the end of the lease due to the fact they are just not worth anything used. KBB quote is about 17-18k on a year old car that cost 36k.
I have to admit that I am defeated and am looking at a volt although I don't particularly like them but once you drive electric, there is no way back!

Have you looked at the RAV4 EV. It has a lot more range than the LEAF.

The Tesla batteries seem to hold up better in the heat. The battery cooling system in the RAV would also be useful in Palm Springs.

The other option you have is wait for the BMW i3 to come out. It may like the heat better than your LEAF.

Thanks, I'll check out the specs!

 

[TonyWilliams]

Just to be clear, the Rav4 EV (unlike Tesla cars) will not cool the batteries just sitting in a parking lot. It needs to be charging or in READY (driving) mode.

So, the trick in brutal hot places is to make sure the car is plugged in AND charging or driving at midday.

Yes, you can leave the car in READY and lock the doors. I've done it in 100F heat all afternoon, and it used less than 20 miles of range.

 

[Den]

80% charged every night!

Maybe this is the reason! it dis-balances the battery. Try to charge till 100% (and keep charging even 100% level is reached for a while) to balance the cells. Better do it twice in a row.

If it is not so hot weather now in your region charging to 100% will not hurt the battery.

 

[planet4ever]

2012 Leaf, Palm Springs, 4780 miles. Yesterday I charged to 100% I have lost a bar already but it showed 12 charged bars of 11.

I get the impression you find that odd. It isn't; it is what is supposed to happen. The charge bars are not telling you how much electricity you have, but how full the battery is. The 11 capacity bars effectively tell you you now have a smaller battery than you used to have. The 12 charge bars tell you the battery is holding all the energy it can, even though it is smaller now. The more the capacity goes down, the fewer miles you will be able to get out of each charge bar.

Drove in Eco from Palm Springs to La Quinta freeway for 10 miles 62mph then surface roads, back to Palm Springs, total 49 miles with 6 left on the GOM. No a/c. Display showed 3.5 kW average.

3.5 m/kWh sounds low to me for that trip. Note that this number should not go down as the battery degrades. It will, of course, go down if you drive faster, or if you use heat or A/C. It will also go down in the rain, or if it is windy. In other parts of the country it will go down due to cold, or snow, or mountains. But at 62 mph on a dry level freeway and a moderate temperature you should be able to get about 3.8 m/kWh unless it's windy. And you should be able to get over 4 m/kWh on surface roads. You might want to check out Stoaty's Guide to Energy Efficient Driving of the Leaf.

Ray

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

2012 Leaf, Palm Springs, 4780 miles. Yesterday I charged to 100% I have lost a bar already but it showed 12 charged bars of 11.

I get the impression you find that odd. It isn't; it is what is supposed to happen. The charge bars are not telling you how much electricity you have, but how full the battery is. The 11 capacity bars effectively tell you you now have a smaller battery than you used to have. The 12 charge bars tell you the battery is holding all the energy it can, even though it is smaller now. The more the capacity goes down, the fewer miles you will be able to get out of each charge bar.

Drove in Eco from Palm Springs to La Quinta freeway for 10 miles 62mph then surface roads, back to Palm Springs, total 49 miles with 6 left on the GOM. No a/c. Display showed 3.5 kW average.

3.5 m/kWh sounds low to me for that trip. Note that this number should not go down as the battery degrades. It will, of course, go down if you drive faster, or if you use heat or A/C. It will also go down in the rain, or if it is windy. In other parts of the country it will go down due to cold, or snow, or mountains. But at 62 mph on a dry level freeway and a moderate temperature you should be able to get about 3.8 m/kWh unless it's windy. And you should be able to get over 4 m/kWh on surface roads. You might want to check out Stoaty's Guide to Energy Efficient Driving of the Leaf.

Ray

might not be low. Palm Springs as I remember it is in a hole and its uphill in nearly every direction leaving town.

 

[djchrispaul]

80% charged every night!

Maybe this is the reason! it dis-balances the battery. Try to charge till 100% (and keep charging even 100% level is reached for a while) to balance the cells. Better do it twice in a row.

If it is not so hot weather now in your region charging to 100% will not hurt the battery.

Thanks, I'll try that.

 

[epirali]

I am a relative new (under two weeks) but I am seeing pretty good range. As long as I attend just a little bit (don't just stomp on the floor, drive in B mode for good regen) I am pretty much getting 90-100 miles range. I'll get closer to 90 on mostly highway driving (65 mph) and 100 on 40-50 mph roads.

This week wife drove to WholeFoods (50 miles away) at 65 mph all the way and arrived with 51% battery charge. She was driving in ECO mode all the way.

So for now with fresh batteries I am pretty pleased. LeafSpy says my health is at 102% based on internal resistance.

 

[Pipcecil]

Range has steadily decreased. Two years 3 months, 45k miles and down three bars, range is 55 miles at 100% charge. Work is 55 miles round trip. Any more capacity loss (and it will happen) and I will offically no longer be able to drive to work and back on one charge.

 

[epirali]

Range has steadily decreased. Two years 3 months, 45k miles and down three bars, range is 55 miles at 100% charge. Work is 55 miles round trip. Any more capacity loss (and it will happen) and I will offically no longer be able to drive to work and back on one charge.

Doesn't that almost qualify you for the warranty?

 

[trojanm50]

Range has steadily decreased. Two years 3 months, 45k miles and down three bars, range is 55 miles at 100% charge. Work is 55 miles round trip. Any more capacity loss (and it will happen) and I will offically no longer be able to drive to work and back on one charge.

Doesn't that almost qualify you for the warranty?

Why almost? 3 bars loss should qualify him right?

I'm at 2 years 5 months, 35000 miles and today I reached turtle mode after 74 miles. That is the lowest I have driven before turtle. My last turtle was at 79 miles but then I was intentionally pushing it to the edge to establish a base line. Luckily the number of days I drive has gone down. Im in NorCal and my car is garaged every night and spent the first 20 months inside parking structures. No real exposure to heat.

Im disappointed to say the least. Nissans claim of 80% after 5 years is all hog wash.

 

[dgpcolorado]

Why almost? 3 bars loss should qualify him right?

It takes a four bar loss (~66% remaining) for the warranty to kick in.

...Im disappointed to say the least. Nissans claim of 80% after 5 years is all hog wash.

Yes. I'm in a cooler place than most Bay Area residents and I expect to be well below 80% at five years, although not quite down to 66%. So, no warranty replacement for me.

 

[planet4ever]

I'm at 2 years 5 months, 35000 miles and today I reached turtle mode after 74 miles. That is the lowest I have driven before turtle. My last turtle was at 79 miles but then I was intentionally pushing it to the edge to establish a base line.
<snip>
Im disappointed to say the least. Nissans claim of 80% after 5 years is all hog wash.

I see no basis for your "hogwash" claim in the numbers you reported. If your base line is 79 miles and you get 74 miles after about 2½ years, then you are nearly halfway to five years and still almost at 94%. A straight line projection would put you at 87% after 5 years.

Besides, Nissan never guaranteed 80% at 5 years. Here is a direct quote that has appeared in bold print on page EV-3 of every owner's manual from 2011 through 2013:

NISSAN estimates that battery capacity will be approximately 80% of original capacity after five years, although this is only an estimate, and this percentage may vary (and could be significantly lower) depending on individual vehicle and Li-ion battery usage.

See those words? "estimates", "approximately", "only an estimate", "may vary", "significantly lower".

Ray

 

[DaveEV]

Besides, Nissan never guaranteed 80% at 5 years. Here is a direct quote that has appeared in bold print on page EV-3 of every owner's manual from 2011 through 2013:

NISSAN estimates that battery capacity will be approximately 80% of original capacity after five years, although this is only an estimate, and this percentage may vary (and could be significantly lower) depending on individual vehicle and Li-ion battery usage.

See those words? "estimates", "approximately", "only an estimate", "may vary", "significantly lower".

One generally assumes that an estimate would be based on the average customer. Given than on average, most LEAFs are sold on the west coast, predominately California, that the average Californian will see about 80% capacity remaining after 5 years.

The two major Californian markets are the Bay Area and Los Angeles. One would expect the Bay Area to fair better than 80% given their cooler climate than Los Angeles. However, it appears that unless you live in San Francisco itself and very close to the water, your battery is losing capacity at a much faster rate. It appears that only people who live in Portland or cooler climates will see Nissan's estimates.

Frankly, Nissan's estimate should have been extremely conservative knowing human nature. Nearly everyone is going to assume that they are "average" or better and when they find out the hard way that they aren't, they are going to be upset.

Nissan is going to have a big PR issue on their hands next summer when the 2nd bar starts to fall on a large number of California LEAFs and start seeing capacity loss at 3 years in that Nissan said to expect at 5 years.

 

[bobsfreeleaf]

Just turned 10,000 miles on the odometer, and mine is still driving like new. I have had the car for 10 months and in San Diego, I still "bank on" 85 miles. The range is between 75 and 100 with the major contributing factor being elevation change. Surprisingly, there is more of that in San Diego than you might think. While I have had a service call for a busted A/C unit, I still love the car. I really only need 53 miles on an ongoing basis, so I don't fear a range loss too much. The Leaf is so friggin cheap to drive it is unbelievable! The HOV stickers are saving me hours of time. The new electric rate structure with SDGE is saving me hundred's of dollars a month. Still glad I leased; it was just too cheap not to.

Things I would do differently:
1) In addition to the EVSE upgrade, buy a second trickle charger for the car right off the bat. (sell it when you sell the car)
2) Be sure to hook your EVSE by a separate hook, not just by the plug. (It will unplug and fall off the wall)
3) Take off the rear headrests to improve visability through the back
4) Add blind spot mirrors to your side mirrors. (this will save your life. This car is one giant blind spot)
5) Never proceed with a left or right turn without giving an extra second. The front pillars obscure vision, if you catch a moving vehicle just as it enters the piller block area.)
6) Check the tire pressure immediately after recieving the car. (The dealer may not do it, so don't spend the first 3,000 miles on underinflated tires.)



Take care, and charge on!

 

[XeonPony]

brand new with 800Km on it now, I drove from pangman sask to regina and had 17% battery to spare, on the way back 102Km less then 7%, going at an average of 85Km p H

 

[rodkar]

Just turned 10,000 miles on the odometer, and mine is still driving like new. I have had the car for 10 months and in San Diego, I still "bank on" 85 miles. The range is between 75 and 100 with the major contributing factor being elevation change. Surprisingly, there is more of that in San Diego than you might think. While I have had a service call for a busted A/C unit, I still love the car. I really only need 53 miles on an ongoing basis, so I don't fear a range loss too much. The Leaf is so friggin cheap to drive it is unbelievable! The HOV stickers are saving me hours of time. The new electric rate structure with SDGE is saving me hundred's of dollars a month. Still glad I leased; it was just too cheap not to.

Glad to hear it's running strong. I live in San Diego as well. I'm hoping the climate conditions here (as it never gets as cold as other cities) helps preserve the battery life a bit longer.

 

[wlegro]

2012 SL - about 4K miles, averaging 3.5kW in Los Angeles city street traffic. For an 18-mile RT from Silver Lake to Mid-Wilshire and back takes about 40 miles on the GOM, or about half the charge. Constant stop-and-go because LA doesn't know how to time signals, and it's gradually uphill on the return trip. BUT - before we got the software upgrade earlier this year, the car used to charge until the GOM read 100 miles/full charge. Now it reads 80 miles max on full charge. I think I read the upgrade was to make the GOM more accurate. In any case, I think the mileage is pretty bad, but we're driving in awful conditions - and after all, no more gas stations! (And our other car is a Prius.)

I can make a 40-mile RT from Silver Lake to Arcadia on a full charge, freeway speeds (60-65) and arrive home with more charge left than that 18-mile RT on city streets because I can coast more and there are long downslopes (I've learned to love watching the GOM add miles!). Once I drove the 40-mile RT from SL to Santa Monica on the 10; left with the GOM at 95, arrived in SM with 90 (it was slow and go almost all the way), arrived home at 50. But now that we can't get the GOM above 80 or so, it makes me nervous to drive that distance on the freeway, esp. since the return is a 20-mile gradual uphill, not so easy to coast. I wish there were a reliable charging station in SM near Lincoln and Wishire - I saw online there was one at 1294 6th St., but the street-level photo showed just a storefront. I don't belong to Chargepoint - I'm still stuck on not paying for electricity "at the pump," and besides I read constantly that people just block the EVSEs or stay way beyond the time it takes to charge their cars and nobody else can use them, and meanwhile you've paid to enter the parking structure. So now I carry the 120v with me just in case. When I go to SM tomorrow, I'll return on SM Boulevard, see if it's any better than the freeway, or maybe Wilshire or Olympic since they're more lanes=less congestion and sometimes the lights do seem a little bit timed. Sure could use some cross-city driving tips for LA.