Regular maintenance @ Dealership? Critical milestones?

[OldManCan]

Hi,

My new LEAF is nicely maturing and about to reach 7500 miles in couple weeks. Looking at the service schedule I don't see anything critical that need to be done at the dealership so I'll probably just go to a local tire shop and get them to rotate tires for me. Main issue here is not only the higher cost at dealership but also the wait time being more. Tire shop in and out in 15 minutes vs couple hours affair to get to dealership, wait there etc etc.

Anyways, point of my post is... Which milestone maintenance should I make sure to get at the dealership? I am aware of the yearly battery check need & benefits and potentially having the reduction gearbox oil changed at some point soon. Beside that is there anything I should pay attention to and make sure to get serviced at the dealership?

Thanks for all your inputs. Cheers

 

[Nubo]

I recommend following the 2-year brake fluid replacement schedule. As some members have discovered, replacing the intelligent brake unit costs an absolute fortune. Though you don't necessarily need Nissan for this, at least I do not for my 2015. The only thing that's actually required Nissan's attention was the yearly battery check because it's mandatory to keep the warranty in effect. That's why it's free.

 

[OldManCan]

Thanks for that suggestion. Anything to do with safety, brakes etc I certainly would want the dealer to tackle and have it on the record. Since I'll take it to the dealer for the yearly battery check at the very least, the brake flush can be done there on my 2nd anniversary visit then. Noted!

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Just started Month 29 of Plussing and no maintenance other than DIY tire rotations every 5K. There has been a lot of discussion as to just how needed the Brake fluid change is and several tested for YEARS in the Pacific Northwest and to my knowledge, none found any evidence of a need for annual or even biennial need to change the fluid.

Because of that and my rare use of brakes, I am planning on a 5 year flush unless something happens to change my mind. I do test my brakes by doing emergency stops from ~ 40 mph every so often (probably not as much as I should) and so far so good.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

I recommend following the 2-year brake fluid replacement schedule. As some members have discovered, replacing the intelligent brake unit costs an absolute fortune. Though you don't necessarily need Nissan for this, at least I do not for my 2015. The only thing that's actually required Nissan's attention was the yearly battery check because it's mandatory to keep the warranty in effect. That's why it's free.

Free for two years you mean. The other issue is has anyone not done the tests "religiously" and been denied a warranty exchange because of it?

We also have the likelihood of a warranty exchange. The range has grown but the warranty parameters have not moving a "vital" service to the status of "feel good but worthless" peace of mind. To date, 5 have lost bars on the Gen 2;

One was a well known abuser and lost his first bar around 30K last summer. I didn't feel the need to track his progress so who knows where he is at now.

2 lost theirs at 87,000 and 98,000 so "pretty" sure they won't lose 3 more before 100K

2 were over 100,000 miles when they lost theirs. These are all 40 kwh. With the Plus packs, expect even lower odds of qualifying.

Finally; its not a battery test and I am at a loss as to understanding why people continue to refer it as such. It is an evaluation of your charging/driving habits...nothing more. There is essentially no information at all on it.

It is only fair to mention that the Gen 2 40's are seeing cell failure requiring cell replacement (which has become VERY rare lately) to whole pack replacements. I know two who have had this done including one who just got their car back in January.

Now they were an interesting case. Worked for Boeing in WA State, took a job in Jersey and in the process of moving which took several weeks, the car died. So it went into the shop in September. Well, they obviously couldn't wait around due to job start so they left carless.

Initially they were several $$ out of pocket for rental fees, etc. Then Nissan finally started covering their rental fees (the out of pocket was pending as of mid Feb) Approved a new battery pack (over cell repair) on 11/5. Was fixed just before Christmas then shipped to him on their dime. So he did very well considering he now has a brand new pack with 86,636 miles on the clock.

iirc, he only got the battery report once (when getting the axle clink thing fixed) so....

 

[Nubo]

Just started Month 29 of Plussing and no maintenance other than DIY tire rotations every 5K. There has been a lot of discussion as to just how needed the Brake fluid change is and several tested for YEARS in the Pacific Northwest and to my knowledge, none found any evidence of a need for annual or even biennial need to change the fluid. ...

It's difficult to define a basis for "need". Sure you can measure moisture and/or metal ions, but we're back to opinions when trying to correlate measured values with system longevity. What I can say from experience is that when I DIYed my brake flush, the old fluid was noticeably darker even after 2 years. That is metal ions and particulates liberated by water corrosion. This roughens surfaces over which seals must pass, and decreases the lubricity of the fluid. A small amount but still I consider it cheap insurance to slow down the process, considering the complexity of this brake system. Also DIY allows you to chose a premium fluid. I chose Bosch ESI6.

 

[LeftieBiker]

Given the lack of a correlation between brake unit failures and neglected fluid flushes, I'm going to keep recommending one every three years, more often in damp climates, less often in dry. I think that two years is more like the "severe" conditions interval.

 

[OldManCan]

Good point about location and humidity. Points noted. Thanks once again.

Anything else to think about?

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Just started Month 29 of Plussing and no maintenance other than DIY tire rotations every 5K. There has been a lot of discussion as to just how needed the Brake fluid change is and several tested for YEARS in the Pacific Northwest and to my knowledge, none found any evidence of a need for annual or even biennial need to change the fluid. ...

It's difficult to define a basis for "need". Sure you can measure moisture and/or metal ions, but we're back to opinions when trying to correlate measured values with system longevity. What I can say from experience is that when I DIYed my brake flush, the old fluid was noticeably darker even after 2 years. That is metal ions and particulates liberated by water corrosion. This roughens surfaces over which seals must pass, and decreases the lubricity of the fluid. A small amount but still I consider it cheap insurance to slow down the process, considering the complexity of this brake system. Also DIY allows you to chose a premium fluid. I chose Bosch ESI6.

True and wishing I would have taken a pix of the fluid in the reservoir when it was new but back then it was "just a lease" :lol:

But something I have been wondering about for a while and having exhausted most of my mechanic contacts, I rarely use my brakes. I tend to coast a lot, only use E Pedal for dramatic slowdowns or complete stops, etc. so wondering am I preserving the brake pads at the expense of the system?

What is the ramifications of a system that is very lightly used? I do do the emergency stop test every other month or so (more in Summer for what reason I am not sure? Drier pavement a better evaluation of a straight stop??) but hate to think I should exercise the system more?

 

[OldManCan]

What is the ramifications of a system that is very lightly used?

I recall reading that the brake calipers moving less than a typical car in some LEAFs were causing some rust, grit buildup in the mechanism leading to some noise when brakes were actually used. A yearly cleaning was recommended but not sure where I read it. Probably on this forum.

On a related note to testing brakes, when you say you do emergency brake test how do you do it? Just slam on the brakes? One thing I noticed recently was how weak the brake only scenario is. I was driving on the freeway and wanted to use the switch to N downhill trick to get a little more efficiency out of my pack and realized in this scenario there is absolutely zero regeneration when you touch the brakes. Stopping power was significantly reduced when compared to D mode. The brake pedal felt very spongy and weak. It reminded me to be more careful when coasting down the hill at 75mph in N...

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

What is the ramifications of a system that is very lightly used?

I recall reading that the brake calipers moving less than a typical car in some LEAFs were causing some rust, grit buildup in the mechanism leading to some noise when brakes were actually used. A yearly cleaning was recommended but not sure where I read it. Probably on this forum.

On a related note to testing brakes, when you say you do emergency brake test how do you do it? Just slam on the brakes? One thing I noticed recently was how weak the brake only scenario is. I was driving on the freeway and wanted to use the switch to N downhill trick to get a little more efficiency out of my pack and realized in this scenario there is absolutely zero regeneration when you touch the brakes. Stopping power was significantly reduced when compared to D mode. The brake pedal felt very spongy and weak. It reminded me to be more careful when coasting down the hill at 75mph in N...

No rust buildup. Just rotated tires a month ago and rotors are pretty clean. As far as the test, I get up to around 40 mph and slam on the brakes. Checking mostly for straightness of stop and evenness of the stop. I usually do this 2 or 3 times depending on where I am. Obviously have to find an abandoned stretch of road which isn't too hard with surface arterials but one tends to attract attention if doing this kind of thing more than once or twice...

I have no squeaks, no squeals or grinding so everything "sounds" ok.

 

[goldbrick]

As long as the rotors don't get rusty I'd say the normal act of putting your foot on the brake to start the car should be enough to keep the brakes healthy. The should move the pistons in the calipers enough to keep them lubricated.

As for the fluid, it is a sealed system and I'd guess heat only causes the fluid to deteriorate faster. Some moisture gets in since the seals are not 100% air tight but that is more a matter of time than usage IMO.

 

[bruceha2000]

I took our 2020 Leaf in for service last fall, first time in and around 25K miles. No need for tire rotations since I live where we need to use snow tires. They flushed the brake lines, cost a fortune. and took hours. I just put the summer tires on and looked at the service manual. It says to replace the brake fluid every 15,000 miles! What sort of bullshit is this? Some way to get more money from people since there is little to actually service on an all electric vehicle? Does Nissan use crappy seals that let water in? It is supposed to be a closed system, no? It isn't like the brakes on any regenerative braking vehicle get used much to "wear out" the brake fluid.

I've owned cars since 1974 and have never had a "replace brake fluid" item listed on the service manual. My Prius Prime manual says to inspect the fluid and level at intervals, it has no listed time/mileage for flushing and replacing. This is the first Nissan I've owned, all other cars in the family are Prius, Gen II, III and the Prime.

Are people actually flushing and replacing brake fluid every 15K miles in their Leafs?

 

[Stanton]

Are people actually flushing and replacing brake fluid every 15K miles in their Leafs?

No...about every 20k miles (although the last time I let it run a bit longer).
It's a relatively "cheap" service (~$100) for such an important system (and piece of mind).

 

[jsteve]

Hi,

My new LEAF is nicely maturing and about to reach 7500 miles in couple weeks. Looking at the service schedule I don't see anything critical that need to be done at the dealership so I'll probably just go to a local tire shop and get them to rotate tires for me. Main issue here is not only the higher cost at dealership but also the wait time being more. Tire shop in and out in 15 minutes vs couple hours affair to get to dealership, wait there etc etc.

Anyways, point of my post is... Which milestone maintenance should I make sure to get at the dealership? I am aware of the yearly battery check need & benefits and potentially having the reduction gearbox oil changed at some point soon. Beside that is there anything I should pay attention to and make sure to get serviced at the dealership?

Thanks for all your inputs. Cheers

Thanks for asking this question. I too want to learn about what to use the dealership for and what I can do at a qualified Leaf mechanic in the the future. I have a 2022 Leaf too that I put into service mid December of 2021, so close to when you put yours into service. But mine only cracked the 1000 mile mark last week, but I work from home and don't have a daily commute. My Leaf is an "around town" car.

But that said I did need to use the dealership 2 weeks ago to have warranty replacement of the "reduction gear" which apparently had "infant mortality" in my particular car. But they handled it and it didn't cost me a cent. Was without my car for 8 days and dealing with the dealership was like leaving my car in a black hole, but it all worked out in the end

I too figure I'll rotate the tires with a local tire shop. I already became familiar with one in our new area since my Leaf gained a flat tire once already and I like the shop that did the repair for free no less. I plan to go back to them for future new tires or tire service. I'm sure that's why they offer certain tire repairs for "free".

Cheers,
--jan

 

[Nubo]

I took our 2020 Leaf in for service last fall, first time in and around 25K miles. No need for tire rotations since I live where we need to use snow tires. They flushed the brake lines, cost a fortune. and took hours. I just put the summer tires on and looked at the service manual. It says to replace the brake fluid every 15,000 miles! What sort of bullshit is this? Some way to get more money from people since there is little to actually service on an all electric vehicle? Does Nissan use crappy seals that let water in? It is supposed to be a closed system, no? It isn't like the brakes on any regenerative braking vehicle get used much to "wear out" the brake fluid. ...

Hydraulic brakes are not a closed system. There has to be allowance for expansion/contraction, actuation of the brakes (fluid tranferred into and out of the caliper pistons), and brake wear. So the system remains in communication with the ambient air. The fluid doesn't wear out but it does absorb moisture from the air. This leads to corrosion and ultimately, failure.

We all grew up with never worrying about brake fluid changes, so it sounds "weird" at first, myself included. On the other hand I've had cars where I had to replace every single brake component so I've seen the end result of neglect. With newer cars and ABS systems, the price of replacement components is so high that it becomes well worth the effort to keep the fluid in top condition, imho. With electric cars and "blended" braking and regen systems the parts complexity can be even higher. You can find examples in this forum -- several thousands of dollars just to replace the "Intelligent brake unit".

Are people actually flushing and replacing brake fluid every 15K miles in their Leafs?

My manual recommends every 2 years, but yes. Last time I did it myself and used ESI-6 fluid which promises 50% longer service so it'll be 3 years for this coming flush. I think you'll see brake fluid replacement increasingly become a standard maintenance item, and it's not just a money-grab. Most people recognize the importance of oil changes to protect their investment; this is much the same. And of course your life depends on this system.

 

[LeftieBiker]

OTOH, it really does depend a lot on where you live. In drier, cooler climates, I think that three years would be a better interval, and I waited for 4 years with my 2013 Leaf with no problems. I think that it's a case of using a real, necessary service to get the cars into dealerships for service. When you say it was expensive, how much? $180.00 is reasonable for this service, and it's been done for as little as $100.

 

[SageBrush]

If the timing for preventive brake maintenance can be ascertained by a brake fluid test like those sold as test strips, I would do that.

Opinions on the test strips ?

 

[LeftieBiker]

I used them at year three. They indicated no issues, so I waited another year.

 

[OldManCan]

I'm inclined to head in this direction but have a hypothetical question. I wonder if anyone tested this either way.

What if I do not follow the brake fluid flush guidance on maintenance chart with official receipts to back it up and then have a failure in a costly component. Could / would Nissan throw it back at me and refuse warranty repairs on account of my ignoring their maintenance charts?