Help me spread the word about Nissan's unethical battery warranty program.

[OrientExpress]

The biggest issue for the 1st Generation LEAF batteries is that Nissan stopped making them a long time ago. There simply aren't any to be had. This is why Nissan is offering buyouts on these cars. Take the buyout and buy yourself a newer BEV.

 

[knightmb]

The biggest issue for the 1st Generation LEAF batteries is that Nissan stopped making them a long time ago. There simply aren't any to be had. This is why Nissan is offering buyouts on these cars. Take the buyout and buy yourself a newer BEV.

Given how well the Leaf community can put 40 kWh batteries into the Gen 1 Leaf, it's sad that Nissan could not do the same given they certainly have the technical ability to do this (they already do it with the 30 kWh battery pack replacements). Nissan would have scored much better PR for it, but I suspect that Dealership mistrust and government recertification for the battery stopped that when one pile of money was smaller than the other.

 

[timgross]

I recently accepted Nissan's offer to buy back my 2016, and immediately purchased a 2021 Leaf Plus. I think they treated me very fairly and have no complaints. Maybe some owners have not had such a good experience, but overall I think Nissan is acting in good faith. For me, that fosters some loyalty. Oh, and they were the first legitimate car manufacturer to deliver a BEV.

BTW, the title of this thread got my attention but the word "unethical" should be replaced with "ethical". Moderator, what do you think?

 

[cornbinder89]

What strikes me, is that Nissan designed a built the battery pack to be repairable, then abandoned that approach when it came to dealing with warrantee problems? May be the need to train and certify employees to work in a HV environment or the liability in doing so stopped them. IDK, but that is where I see the ball being dropped.
I can see where high voltage DC and gasoline repairs in the same building may cause some to question the wisdom of having a dealership doing the repairs, but if this is the wave of the future, than the infrastructure needs to be built to repair.
I saw the same thing in heavy truck repair, Natural gas powered trucks were not allowed in the truck-stop repair bays due to the risk of a leak of NG, even if the truck was just looking to have a oil change.

 

[OrientExpress]

Given how well the Leaf community can put 40 kWh batteries into the Gen 1 Leaf, it's sad that Nissan could not do the same given they certainly have the technical ability to do this (they already do it with the 30 kWh battery pack replacements). Nissan would have scored much better PR for it, but I suspect that Dealership mistrust and government recertification for the battery stopped that when one pile of money was smaller than the other.

Unfortunately there just isn't a business case for Nissan to offer upgrades for the older "obsolete" LEAFs. This is an age old issue with all sorts of electronic or leading-edge products with support after the warranty periods, especially if the product is a low volume one as the LEAF is. This makes it a 3rd party opportunity, but even then the market is small and the costs are high.

 

[SageBrush]

Unfortunately there just isn't a business case for Nissan to offer upgrades for the older "obsolete" LEAFs.

This isn't 24 kWh to 40 kWh after warranty end. This is during warranty, for 30 kWh and 40 kWh LEAFs for which Nissan has already done warranty replacements in other cars.

The 'business case' here is that Nissan would rather put a 40 kWh pack in a new car than in a warranty vehicle. Seems odd, but I presume the market is being distorted by CAFE and/or CARB

 

[OrientExpress]

This isn't 24 kWh to 40 kWh after warranty end. This is during warranty, for 30 kWh and 40 kWh LEAFs for which Nissan has already done warranty replacements in other cars.

The 'business case' here is that Nissan would rather put a 40 kWh pack in a new car than in a warranty vehicle. Seems odd, but I presume the market is being distorted by CAFE and/or CARB

The issue is that the replacement parts are no longer available (someone at Nissan underestimated how many to make at the final production run)

Sure there were other 30kWh cars that have had a replacement pack, but that was then, and now the parts are no longer available. This is why Nissan is offering the buyout.

 

[SageBrush]

The issue is that the replacement parts are no longer available (someone at Nissan underestimated how many to make at the final production run)

They are not 'available' because Nissan prefers to divert the packs to new car production. You do realize that the 40 kWh LEAF is still being made --- right ?

Which is kind of amazing in its own right. How many LEAFs are involved here. Hundreds ? Thousands ? Tens of thousands ? If a low number then I don't understands why Nissan would choose the bad PR over pennies. If tens of thousands, then Nissan has a massive QA/QC problem on its hands.

I've recognized for a long time that Nissan battery pack QC is inconsistent but now I'm wondering if it is the defining feature of the LEAF

 

[Dooglas]

I've recognized for a long time that Nissan battery pack QC is inconsistent but now I'm wondering if it is the defining feature of the LEAF

As compared to the Bolt for instance?

 

[SageBrush]

As compared to the Bolt for instance?

Not at all. You are confusing a manufacturing defect that escaped sigma 6 QA (LG) with disregard for QA (Nissan.)

 

[sokoloff]

** I'm talking about general pack degradation, not the cases of single cell manufacturing defects. The latter cases are being handled in a criminal way by Nissan and are a poster child for why I cannot imagine buying a new Nissan for anything over 50% of msrp

I had a defective module replaced by Nissan under warranty and would describe how they handled it “excellent” rather than “criminal”.

I wrote it up here on the forum.

 

[SageBrush]

I had a defective module replaced by Nissan under warranty

You are not the only one. Then there are the unlucky owners.

 

[Franxou]

(edited to add some timeline precision)
Well, after almost a month and a half of waiting, I phoned Nissan Canada to learn of any news, and after learning that "batteries are back ordered, we can't know when they come in, we have no information" and all that, I complained for a while that I could not go visit my family since my Leaf does not have enough range for me to actually leave the city and they eventually (about two months after the warantied trouble was discovered) lent me a car, a Nissan Versa. It feels a bit smaller and very cheaper than a Leaf (Qashqai is almost exactly the same size and the same form factor, would have been nicer) and they are supposed to reimburse me for gas, but that I will believe when I actually get reimbursed. And if I wanted to drive a Versa, I would have saved about 20k$ over my Leaf years ago...

The flawed battery pack was not enough anymore, so it was great to get this small car because there have been health problems in my significant other's family and had to travel a couple times. If not for this lent car, we would have had to take the bus (kinda insulting when you are still making payments on a new car).

I am a broken record from my January 19 post, but the most insulting in all that is that we all can see new Leafs arriving into dealerships and getting sold, but no batteries for those who already paid. My guess is that when a new battery for a new car only hits 90% of predicted power out of the assembly line, instead of going into the refuse bin, it gets sent to the warranty department to install in an old car. So it's good for Nissan to have so few of those, but for us waiting months and months (and years for some, apparently) being told "your battery is covered by the waranty, don't worry, but we do not have it and we cannot fix your car... Tough luck, eh?", how is this experience encouraging any of us affected to ever go back to buy another Nissan?

In all honesty, I just want my Leaf back and fixed, I love this car so much I wanted to drive this car to the ground, we both like driving it. Just fixing the cars when they came in and nobody would ever have heard about pissed Leaf owners.