20 J1772 plugs at Disneyland California!

[hill]

California's backwards legislation only allows authentic utility companies to charge for electricity.

Not true, since July 2010.

AH! thanks for the update. I missed that ... but it explains how the payola infrastructure can now work independent of parking lot fees.

 

[TomT]

By the way, the Disneyland employees parking lot DOES have multiple J1772 EVSEs... Something like 8 or so...

 

[Leland]

We trickle charged the ActiveE for about four hours today in the Mickey & Friends parking structure. When we returned to the car to leave, there were two security guards checking out the car and the OEM L1 EVSE. We chatted with them for at least 10 minutes answering the usual cost, charge time and range questions. The security guards were very friendly and had no problem at all with us plugging in.

 

[CWO4Mann]

[

Next, suppose Disneyland offered no EV charging but Universal Studios and Knott's Berry Farm did offer charging as above. Which theme park would you visit most often?

I know many who'd never grace the door of 6 flags, as often their customers feel like they just entered gangland. On the other hand ... high prices tend to keep the riff raff from ever entering a theme park.

.

I get it that you live in southern OC and talk about riff raff passes for polite cocktail party chatter, but i expect to read that kind of remark at breitbart's site or michelle malkin's cesspool. Here it seems a tad out of place.[/quote]
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I just read this comment about using the descriptor "Riffraff" -- e.g. " ... Riffraff is a term for the common people or hoi polloi, but with negative connotations. The term is derived from Old French 'rif et raf' meaning 'one and all, every bit' ..."

Is this expression now in the same forbidden zone as the various racial descriptors which we all have heard, which pejoratively describe Black People (that may be a banned term too, not sure, perhaps "African -American" is used?), People of Hispanic Decent (not sure where people from Spain, Portugal, Cape Verde Islands fit in here other than they speak a version of Spanish), People who originally came to the USA from various countries in the Far East or Pacific area, Japanese, Korean, Filipino, the Hmong, Vietnamese, Lao, Thai, Cambodia, Meo (oh wait, Meo comes from the Mandarin Chinese "mei-ow" which is a bad word to a, well, a Meo Tribes-person). Man, we have so derned many "bad words" in the English language these days. Even words which "sound" like bad words are banned, such as the word which starts with an "N" and ends with a "y" which means in modern English "a cheapskate" and the word which starts with "S" and ends with "g" which means a person quietly laughing in a cynical or sarcastic manner.

Well, by Golly (which may offend Xians since "Golly" is a loan-word which stands in for "God" which may offend pious Jews because "God" is a word never spoken or written except as "G-D" which may offend some because it is a literary device to conceal the curse "God Damn" in bowdlerized texts, which may offend Librarians because bowdlerizism is antithetical of their ethics ...

OMG! and all this time I thought "Riffraff" was a character in "The Rocky Horror Picture Show" movie.

 

[hill]

I just read this comment about using the descriptor "Riffraff" -- e.g. " ... Riffraff is a term for the common people or hoi polloi, but with negative connotations. The term is derived from Old French 'rif et raf' meaning 'one and all, every bit' ..."

Is this expression now in the same forbidden zone as the various racial descriptors which we all have heard, which pejoratively describe Black People (that may be a banned term too, not sure, perhaps "African -American" is used?), People of Hispanic Decent (not sure where people from Spain, Portugal, Cape Verde Islands fit in here other than they speak a version of Spanish), People who originally came to the USA from various countries in the Far East or Pacific area, Japanese, Korean, Filipino, the Hmong, Vietnamese, Lao, Thai, Cambodia, Meo (oh wait, Meo comes from the Mandarin Chinese "mei-ow" which is a bad word to a, well, a Meo Tribes-person). Man, we have so derned many "bad words" in the English language these days. Even words which "sound" like bad words are banned, such as the word which starts with an "N" and ends with a "y" which means in modern English "a cheapskate" and the word which starts with "S" and ends with "g" which means a person quietly laughing in a cynical or sarcastic manner.

Well, by Golly (which may offend Xians since "Golly" is a loan-word which stands in for "God" which may offend pious Jews because "God" is a word never spoken or written except as "G-D" which may offend some because it is a literary device to conceal the curse "God Damn" in bowdlerized texts, which may offend Librarians because bowdlerizism is antithetical of their ethics ...

OMG! and all this time I thought "Riffraff" was a character in "The Rocky Horror Picture Show" movie.

funny you should mention things misconstrued there CWO:
Chief Web Officer (corporate title)
Chief Warrant Officer
Cash With Order
Clockwork Orange (Anthony Burgess book and film)
Cadet Warrant Officer (Air Training Corps)
Conservative Women's Organisation (UK)
Cable & Wireless Optus (Australian telecommunications company; now SingTel Optus)
Communications Watch Officer
Court Welfare Officer (UK)
Communist Workers' Organisation (Sheffield, UK)
Commissioned Warrant Officer
Climate/Weather/Ocean Modeling and Simulation
Chief Wine Officer (US and UK)
Championship Wrestling Organization (est. 1995)
Contract Work Order
Combat Wing Organization
Construction Work Order
Custom Work Order (Sprint)
Chief Watch Officer
Cadet Watch Officer
Capital Work Order
Conversion Work Order
Corvallis Workstation Operation
Creative Work Order (advertising creatives)
Cancel When Out (stock scheduled for deletion)
Community Welfare Officer (Health Service Executive; Ireland)

I certain someone here will find cause to get inflamed over at least one theoretical meaning.

 

[CWO4Mann]

I just read this comment about using the descriptor "Riffraff" -- e.g. " ... Riffraff is a term for the common people or hoi polloi, but with negative connotations. The term is derived from Old French 'rif et raf' meaning 'one and all, every bit' ..."

Is this expression now in the same forbidden zone as the various racial descriptors which we all have heard, which pejoratively describe Black People (that may be a banned term too, not sure, perhaps "African -American" is used?), People of Hispanic Decent (not sure where people from Spain, Portugal, Cape Verde Islands fit in here other than they speak a version of Spanish), People who originally came to the USA from various countries in the Far East or Pacific area, Japanese, Korean, Filipino, the Hmong, Vietnamese, Lao, Thai, Cambodia, Meo (oh wait, Meo comes from the Mandarin Chinese "mei-ow" which is a bad word to a, well, a Meo Tribes-person). Man, we have so derned many "bad words" in the English language these days. Even words which "sound" like bad words are banned, such as the word which starts with an "N" and ends with a "y" which means in modern English "a cheapskate" and the word which starts with "S" and ends with "g" which means a person quietly laughing in a cynical or sarcastic manner.

Well, by Golly (which may offend Xians since "Golly" is a loan-word which stands in for "God" which may offend pious Jews because "God" is a word never spoken or written except as "G-D" which may offend some because it is a literary device to conceal the curse "God Damn" in bowdlerized texts, which may offend Librarians because bowdlerizism is antithetical of their ethics ...

OMG! and all this time I thought "Riffraff" was a character in "The Rocky Horror Picture Show" movie.

funny you should mention things misconstrued there CWO:
Chief Web Officer (corporate title)
Chief Warrant Officer
Cash With Order
Clockwork Orange (Anthony Burgess book and film)
Cadet Warrant Officer (Air Training Corps)
Conservative Women's Organisation (UK)
Cable & Wireless Optus (Australian telecommunications company; now SingTel Optus)
Communications Watch Officer
Court Welfare Officer (UK)
Communist Workers' Organisation (Sheffield, UK)
Commissioned Warrant Officer
Climate/Weather/Ocean Modeling and Simulation
Chief Wine Officer (US and UK)
Championship Wrestling Organization (est. 1995)
Contract Work Order
Combat Wing Organization
Construction Work Order
Custom Work Order (Sprint)
Chief Watch Officer
Cadet Watch Officer
Capital Work Order
Conversion Work Order
Corvallis Workstation Operation
Creative Work Order (advertising creatives)
Cancel When Out (stock scheduled for deletion)
Community Welfare Officer (Health Service Executive; Ireland)

I certain someone here will find cause to get inflamed over at least one theoretical meaning.

"Chief Wine Officer" ... now there is one that I really like and I will bet that CWO doesn't serve the Château Lafitte Rothschild 1886 to the Riff Raff, either!


Dave

 

[Devin]

We went to Disneyland yesterday for a few hours as we had to be in Anaheim for other reasons and had a different experience at the Mickey & Friends structure. When pulling up to the available parking spaces I rolled down my window and asked one of the parking guys if they by any chance had any places I could plug in. I then got a lecture about how that's theft of electricity and they've had a number of people cited and that what I'm talking about doing is committing a crime! He went on and on, and instead of just saying "no we don't offer that" felt it important to belittle me - I got the sense he was anti-EV and excited at the opportunity to voice it since he was grinning throughout his lecture.

Needless to say I was surprised to get that response, especially from a Disney employee who are bound to certain standards of customer service (my GF's mom works at California Adventure, so we know the rules). The irony of it all is of course that Disneyland doesn't pay for their electricity - it is provided to Disney by the City of Anaheim at no charge.

Anyways, I spoke with guest services about the incident and they actually broke out into laughter when I told them how this guy had acted. Hopefully that'll mean a change in attitude but just bear this in mind if you're going to Disneyland. Thankfully Mitsubishi is close by.

 

[JustinC]

Are you serious? As you said, that is quite the opposite of how a Disney employee is trained to treat customers. They are supposed to be opinion-less automatons created to meet your needs with a smile.

He really deserves to be fired. And then thrown in jail for stupidity.

 

[Valdemar]

Likely it was his annual opportunity to feel he was important and he just couldn't miss it. I'd write his name down and filed a formal complaint about him ruining your day, it sounds like he was asking for this anyways.

 

[Devin]

Likely it was his annual opportunity to feel he was important and he just couldn't miss it. I'd write his name down and filed a formal complaint about him ruining your day, it sounds like he was asking for this anyways.

That's exactly what I did. Guest services indicated they'd have a chat with his manager right away.

 

[baronvonshush]

We went to Disneyland yesterday for a few hours as we had to be in Anaheim for other reasons and had a different experience at the Mickey & Friends structure. When pulling up to the available parking spaces I rolled down my window and asked one of the parking guys if they by any chance had any places I could plug in. I then got a lecture about how that's theft of electricity and they've had a number of people cited and that what I'm talking about doing is committing a crime! He went on and on, and instead of just saying "no we don't offer that" felt it important to belittle me - I got the sense he was anti-EV and excited at the opportunity to voice it since he was grinning throughout his lecture.

We had nearly the same experience this morning, although without the belittling. We asked the parking attendant if we could park by an outlet to charge, and he simply said no, we couldn't do that. When pressed, he said that he used to be ok with it (as if he has the authority to make that decision??) but they were recently told that it is illegal for customers to use the outlets. He kind of phrased it to sound as if Disney would be breaking the law by allowing outside people to use their electricity, which sounded like BS. Although if what you say is true about Anaheim providing free electricity, maybe there is something to that??

Unfortunately this jibes with what we heard yesterday from a Disney employee who was at the So Cal meetup. He said he'd heard of parking attendants periodically walking through and unplugging anyone who was plugged in. So it seems like Disney has changed from no official policy, where the answer you get varies wildly depending on who you ask, to an official policy of disallowing all charging.

It's unfortunate that it seems like Disney's park management has their collective heads up their you-know-what on this issue. For a dollar or two per car AT MOST they could get all kinds of positive green cred and corresponding public image. Especially if they paint the parking spaces next to existing outlets so everyone knows they are for EV charging.

I don't even expect free charging, and if there really is a legal issue with the city providing free electricity to the park but not to customers, then charging a fee and sending that back to the city could cover that, no? Even if existing regulations don't allow for this, Disney ought to be proactive and work on an arrangement for it.

I'd be perfectly happy paying an extra $5 at the front gate for a special pass allowing me to park and use designated charging spots. We live close enough that we can make the round trip on one charge, but it would be nice to have the option (officially supported) to charge there if we're going somewhere else later on.

Instead of seizing a perfect opportunity, Disney seems to be trying their best to squander it so far. I wonder if a letter writing campaign, outlining all the positives without sounding demanding or entitled, would help.

 

[91040]

Not in the outdoor lot I was allowed to use. I scouted it and found a number of L1 plugs on the periphery but they all required the electric cord crossing a sidewalk.

Finally got permission to park behind CA Adventure to plug in with the golf carts.

By the way, the Disneyland employees parking lot DOES have multiple J1772 EVSEs... Something like 8 or so...

 

[planet4ever]

I'd be perfectly happy paying an extra $5 at the front gate for a special pass allowing me to park and use designated charging spots. We live close enough that we can make the round trip on one charge, but it would be nice to have the option (officially supported) to charge there if we're going somewhere else later on.

Instead of seizing a perfect opportunity, Disney seems to be trying their best to squander it so far. I wonder if a letter writing campaign, outlining all the positives without sounding demanding or entitled, would help.

I really like this idea. It is easy to implement, easy to monitor, and demonstrates that we are willing to pay for what we use. I think we should be willing to go higher than $5 for a space we are likely to be using for 12 hours or longer. 120v * 12A * 12hrs could well be over 15kWh. I have no idea what their electricity costs them, but $0.33/kWh might be low, especially for peak summer rates.

Ray

 

[EricH]

The irony of it all is of course that Disneyland doesn't pay for their electricity - it is provided to Disney by the City of Anaheim at no charge.

Is this a guess, or something you feel you know? It seems incredible that Anaheim's municipal utility could do this. Sure, the bed tax at Disney hotels is a nice cash stream for the city, but the pumping and A/C load from those parks would support the rest of Anaheim, most likely.

 

[smkettner]

Does not seem like theft if you ask and permission is granted :roll:
I would be curious what exactly that citiation said for violation code and if it required bail or a court hearing.

 

[TomT]

I don't know exactly where it physically is - Disney has many employee lots down there - but an acquaintance is a Disney employee and showed me a picture of his employee lot with a number of EVSEs along one wall... The lot appeared to be covered. I asked if one could get special disposition to charge there and he said no, they were being enforced strictly to Disney employees only. He also said that Disney has done an investigation in to the possibility of offering public charging and it was nixed at a high level, at least for the immediate future... He didn't know why.

Not in the outdoor lot I was allowed to use. I scouted it and found a number of L1 plugs on the periphery but they all required the electric cord crossing a sidewalk.
Finally got permission to park behind CA Adventure to plug in with the golf carts.

By the way, the Disneyland employees parking lot DOES have multiple J1772 EVSEs... Something like 8 or so...

 

[JPVLeaf]

This particular employee parking area appears to allow access to 120v outlets -- I see a few OEM EVSEs plugged in -- but not to wall-mounted EVSE with J1772s:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=160825#p160825

 

[hill]

Yep - that's me there in the basement, along w/ my co-workers.

 

[TomT]

Hmm... I took a closer look at her picture and, while I am not sure it is the same employee parking area, I can't be sure from it that there ARE any EVSEs there... She does not have an EV and may have misconstrued 120V outlets as EVSEs... But they at least do have SOMETHING there for employees, unlike for the paying masses...

This particular employee parking area appears to allow access to 120v outlets -- I see a few OEM EVSEs plugged in -- but not to wall-mounted EVSE with J1772s:
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=160825#p160825

 

[hill]

The same thought cames to me from time to time as I read certain threads. Some posters do recognize that innovators who are 'ahead of the curve' may have to wait awhile for things to catch up with them. Others seem to think that everything should change to accomodate them post haste.

As for Disney, a theme park is a big operation. Big Big. Big BIG BIG, big - big Big BIG .... Even for one that puts being 'green' high on their priority list, there are many things to do in their operations that have a bigger impact on improving their 'green footprint' than providing charging stations for the negligible number of visitors who might arrive in EVs.

I continue to be puzzled why so many EV drivers expect free charging stations everywhere.

Months ago, the comment to this post's question (why do EV's expect free charging) was , "entitlement". That just sat wrong with me ... that it's us EV drivers that have an "entitlement" mentality. Entitlement? Really? You mean the way ICE cars feel entitled to freely dump their gasoline exhaust in the air forever? ... You mean the same way ICE car drivers expect our government to grab all the oil in other countries (to the point they hate us and want to kill us), and then subsidize its cost ... so that U.S. ICE drivers don't have to pay $6 ... $7 a gallon ... and more ... the way much of the rest of the world has to pay? You mean as ICE drivers feel entitled to continue status quo as cheep fossil fuel reserves forever spiral downwards? That kind of entitlement? Thank you for letting me clear that up ... as to exactly WHO has entitlement mentality ... just checking.