Tesla Supercharger Network

[Randy]

But there are a lot of other ADA requirements in addition to that "path of travel" requirement, such as 2% grade limitations for the parking area, van accessibility (takes almost 2 parking spaces), and more...

These requirements have been part of the holdup on other sites getting built (because of the cost and effort to comply)...

 

[davewill]

But there are a lot of other ADA requirements in addition to that "path of travel" requirement, such as 2% grade limitations for the parking area, van accessibility (takes almost 2 parking spaces), and more...

These requirements have been part of the holdup on other sites getting built (because of the cost and effort to comply)...

But the van thing wouldn't come up since the stations can only be used by one of Tesla's vehicles.

 

[Randy]

You would think that, but I've seen L2 jobs here locally in certain jurisdictions that required van access per those requirements. And who even makes a handicapped EV van? I guess someone will someday....

 

[Zythryn]

You would think that, but I've seen L2 jobs here locally in certain jurisdictions that required van access per those requirements. And who even makes a handicapped EV van? I guess someone will someday....

I don't think ADA even applies.
The rules and guidelines are full of statements such as "Accessible parking spaces must be located on the shortest accessible route of travel from the parking to an accessible building entrance."
or
"The American with Disabilities Act is a federal mandate for handicap parking space requirements at buildings open to the public."

There is no building, much less building entrance.
Are there handicapped parking spots by gas pumps?

Sure, the parking lot that the superchargers are a part of require handicapped spots (if there are other publically accessible commercial buildings). But not the superchargers themselves.

 

[Randy]

Your arguments make plenty of sense.

all I can tell you is that a big part of the challenge of permitting and building these stations is working through all of these issues. Some officials are more reasonable than others to deal with...

 

[Zythryn]

Your arguments make plenty of sense.

all I can tell you is that a big part of the challenge of permitting and building these stations is working through all of these issues. Some officials are more reasonable than others to deal with...

That, I can certainly agree with!

Whoever thought "Big Oil" was the biggest hurdle never met government level red tape:roll:

 

[GlennD]

ADA makes no sense at all. It just is. Live with it as a fact of life.

At our signal hill radio site we had to add a handicap parking spot and there is wheelchair turn arounds on all of the equipment rows. Never mind that even though a lot of jobs can be done by the handicaped, this is not one of them and it is a controlled access site.

 

[GRA]

Your arguments make plenty of sense.

all I can tell you is that a big part of the challenge of permitting and building these stations is working through all of these issues. Some officials are more reasonable than others to deal with...

That, I can certainly agree with!

Whoever thought "Big Oil" was the biggest hurdle never met government level red tape:roll:

I'm reminded of a story told to me by a NPS ranger. They needed to make some repairs and improvements to a building, and sent all the plans off to the district office for approval. They came back a week or so later stamped "Not Approved" with no explanation other than a cryptic reference to some code or other. She called up the office to see what the problem was, and got the person who'd reviewed the plans on the phone. She asked him just what the problem was, and he shuffled some papers and said, in a very self-important tone, "You didn't make the bathroom wheelchair accessible, in accordance with the ADA."

She took a very deep breath and (asking herself for patience), said "did you happen to read the section that described this building's location and access?" No, he hadn't. In her most polite voice, she asked him to do so. Silence for a minute or so, followed by "I'll send you the form asking for a waiver."

The building in question was a backcountry ski hut, used only in winter and requiring a six mile cross-country ski with 3,000 feet of climb to get to it.

 

[derkraut]

Pardon the off-topic, but I just have to share:

When a new FAA Air Traffic Control Radar facility was constructed in the SAN area a few years back, The builder was required to put Braille signage on the doors to the Radar Operations area. That way, when blind Air Traffic Controllers assumed their duties directing aircraft to keep them from colliding with each other, they knew which room to go to. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[GRA]

Pardon the off-topic, but I just have to share:

When a new FAA Air Traffic Control Radar facility was constructed in the SAN area a few years back, The builder was required to put Braille signage on the doors to the Radar Operations area. That way, when blind Air Traffic Controllers assumed their duties directing aircraft to keep them from colliding with each other, they knew which room to go to. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Reminds me of a similar story. A former girlfriend was working on her master's in Human Factors Engineering at San Jose State. Her class was assigned a project to design a parking meter that would accept smart cards, credit cards etc. (this was twenty-some years ago). They were doing fine until they hit an intractable problem, which they wrestled with for several hours to no avail, despairing of a solution. She came home and told me about it in frustration.

You see, they couldn't figure out a way to fit the Braille instructions onto the meter, per the ADA, along with everything else. I said, "Uh, Babe, why do you need . . . ?" We both spent much of the next five minutes rolling on the floor, laughing hysterically.

Sometimes you can be a little too close to the problem.

 

[GeekEV]

While these stories are funny and I enjoy them, they're taking the thread dangerously off topic. Might I suggest a "Stupid ADA Stories" thread?

 

[smkettner]

You see, they couldn't figure out a way to fit the Braille instructions onto the meter, per the ADA, along with everything else. I said, "Uh, Babe, why do you need . . . ?" We both spent much of the next five minutes rolling on the floor, laughing hysterically.

Sometimes you can be a little too close to the problem.

Yes the problem is deferred until self driving vehicles are publically available.

 

[jkirkebo]

It seems that they are aiming for 8 plugs as a "standard" install. It seems they only install fewer when space prevents it, and then they end up with two separate locations close together (see a couple installs in the north east).

Yep, 8 seems to be the standard. Tesla is opening 6 SuperCharger sites in Norway next friday, most of those have been reported having 8 spaces (though one of them has 4 and one might have 10).

 

[TonyWilliams]

It seems that they are aiming for 8 plugs as a "standard" install. It seems they only install fewer when space prevents it, and then they end up with two separate locations close together (see a couple installs in the north east).

Yep, 8 seems to be the standard. Tesla is opening 6 SuperCharger sites in Norway next friday, most of those have been reported having 8 spaces (though one of them has 4 and one might have 10).

Could you get the KVA rating of the transformer for the sites (so we can guess the kW into the car)?

 

[Randy]

At Folsom, where there are 4 charging bays being fed by 2 superchargers and expansion stub-ups for an additional supercharger (feeding 6 charging bays total), the setup is fed by a 500 kVA transformer. Not sure you can read too much into that, though, because transformer standard sizes probably step up from 300 to 500 kVA.

There is power sharing going on when two cars share the same supercharger and natural tapering occurs, but when one car is connected solo, the current generation of Model S software is supposed to allow it to draw 90 kW max before tapering. There is supposed to be a software update coming that will allow a maximum of 120 kW...

 

[GRA]

You see, they couldn't figure out a way to fit the Braille instructions onto the meter, per the ADA, along with everything else. I said, "Uh, Babe, why do you need . . . ?" We both spent much of the next five minutes rolling on the floor, laughing hysterically.

Sometimes you can be a little too close to the problem.

Yes the problem is deferred until self driving vehicles are publically available.

At the risk of being OT, I expect them to use voice command and/or wireless from the cars, which will be able to pick up/drop off passengers right at the entrance and then park themselves elsewhere. I imagine they'll use inductive charging and some kind of transponder in the parking space, which the car will link to so that a credit card can be debited for parking (and charging if wanted). For more on how this is likely to work, see:

"Reinventing the Automobile: Personal Urban Mobility for the 21st Century"; Mitchell, William J; Borroni-Bird, Christopher E.; and Burns, Lawrence D.; 2010. Describes how urban cars can be transformed by a combination of four ideas: transforming the DNA (i.e. design principles) of autos, via electric drive and wireless communications; The Mobility Internet, data sharing between vehicles, parking spaces, roads etc. to minimize congestion and travel time; integration of EVs with a Smart, clean grid; real-time controls for urban mobility and energy systems, i.e. dynamic pricing for electricity, roads, parking, and shared vehicles. Burns was VP of R&D at GM from 1998-2009, Borroni-Bird was Director of Advanced Technology Vehicle Concepts, also at GM; Mitchell is a professor at MIT, and head of the Smart Cities Group there.

 

[GRA]

Since nobody's mentioned it yet:

http://insideevs.com/teslas-next-supercharger-station-to-open-in-oregon-on-thursday/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[KJD]

Did you see that the map of Europe is online with 6 stations installed ?

http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[davewill]

While these stories are funny and I enjoy them, they're taking the thread dangerously off topic. Might I suggest a "Stupid ADA Stories" thread?

Another reason to stop is that they are ignorant.

Pardon the off-topic, but I just have to share:

When a new FAA Air Traffic Control Radar facility was constructed in the SAN area a few years back, The builder was required to put Braille signage on the doors to the Radar Operations area. That way, when blind Air Traffic Controllers assumed their duties directing aircraft to keep them from colliding with each other, they knew which room to go to. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Ha. Ha. Ha.
Did you never think that anyone besides an Air Traffic Controller might need to find that damned room? Ever think there might be some job a sight impaired person could do in the building? The point of the law is open up possibilities, even ones that may not be obvious. I get really tired of people who think it's funny to ridicule the ADA.

Sorry for being so blunt, but it's a sore spot with me.

 

[GRA]

Did you see that the map of Europe is online with 6 stations installed ?

http://www.teslamotors.com/supercharger" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Four now, the other two are supposed to open on the 30th.