Official BMW ActiveE thread

[cwerdna]

Thanks for the heads up! It appears to have no level 3/DC quick charging capability though... This sort of leads back to http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?p=140719#p140719" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;.

 

[Boomer23]

As much as I like BMWs, and I've owned many over the years, I would not consider any BMW EV until they prove to me that it isn't just another scheme on their part to game California and/or the Feds, as with the Mini-E, and that they are actually serious about it... (Oh, and that their pricing is based on reality, unlike the original Mini-E lease...)

Though I've been a critic of BMW's CARB play - I've to say, the program itself has been a +ve. It has turned many people into EV enthusiasts and BMW is investing heavily to make ground-up production EVs. Ofcourse I wish they had their i3 selling already - but they are better than other German auto makers.

+1. Just driving a friend's MiniE in 2009 helped me to decide that I wanted to look closely at an EV for my next car, which lead to reserving a LEAF.

 

[lukati]

Another cynical CARB play by BMW. They did that with Mini-E.

Many in this forum seem to think that BMW is not serious about its EV program. I think this is very unlikely given who BMW actually is. BMW is majority owned and controlled by one family (a widow and her two children). This family has owned and controlled BMW for decades and will do so for decades to come. It is very clear that the family wants BMW to become a greener company. The daughter has recently become a major investor in Germany's premier carbon fibre manufacturer. (And she is currently doing battle with VW over control of the company). She also owns a large share of Nordex, a wind turbine manufacturer. The family has always been strategic in its investments, steadily increasing ownership in companies it wants to control and holding it for decades. (Ironically, the family once owned a battery company!)

As a result of its unique ownership structure, BMW management does not need to constantly adjust their plans based on the market valuation of the company but can maintain a steady and deliberate development program. A key component in their EV (and ICE) program is a lightweight car body made of carbon fibers to compensate for the heavy batteries, hence the investment of their majority owner in that very field. BMWs ambition is not to produce the first mass produced EV, but the best. And they have the resources and the financial backing to do it.

 

[Boomer23]

BMW ActiveE in the RAC Future Car Challenge - In total more than 65 vehicles took part in the Future Car Challenge, representing different manufacturers with a variety of low emission powertrain technologies ranging from diesel to hybrid to electric.

http://www.green-car-guide.com/gree...-activee-in-the-rac-future-car-challenge.html

Results - The Mini-E and ActiveE used less energy than the LEAFs to complete the course

http://www.green-car-guide.com/rac-future-car-challenge---full-results.html

Interesting, since the ActiveE must weigh more than the LEAF, though the difference was only about 12% between the ActiveE and the best LEAF in this particular specialized, short run. I'm sure that the BMW has more aggressive regen, so perhaps that was part of it, on a run that included slow-ish country roads and a lot of stop-and-go as they approached London.

 

[evnow]

Another cynical CARB play by BMW. They did that with Mini-E.

Many in this forum seem to think that BMW is not serious about its EV program.

That comment was from a year ago. You should see my today's comment.

BTW, thx for the interesting insight into the ownership.

 

[tbleakne]

Probably a 6 kW charger?

Keijidosha will be happy. I think I just heard him cancel his LEAF reservation!

I question whether he is that happy, because this new BMW EV seems a come-down relative to the Mini-E. Quite a bit less range, and the mini-E could charge at greater than 10 kW. The Mini-E had the innovative AC Propulsion power electronics, which is now history.

 

[surfingslovak]

Another cynical CARB play by BMW. They did that with Mini-E.

Many in this forum seem to think that BMW is not serious about its EV program.

BTW, thx for the interesting insight into the ownership.

I can second lukati's assessment. I grew up in the vicinity of Munich and actually worked at BMW many moons ago. Although I don't have access to any recent information, I can confirm that the company is very engineering-centric, plans strategically and pretty much everyone I had the pleasure of working with there was a true car fanatic. There was some acquisition chatter few years ago, but the Quandt family apparently pulled through, and continues to control the company. If my recollection is correct, the Quandts hold slightly more than half of all voting shares. There are almost as many non-voting shares, which are roughly comparable to corporate bonds.

Although I have to agree that some of their recent actions seemed cynical, e.g. the hydrogen play from a few years ago, BMW does seem to be serious about EVs. They recently hired Frank Weber, the chief vehicle engineer on the Volt project, from Opel and according to my relatives, they promote their EV program heavily in Germany.

 

[KeiJidosha]

…I'm sure that the BMW has more aggressive regen, so perhaps that was part of it, on a run that included slow-ish country roads and a lot of stop-and-go as they approached London.

I agree. The ActiveE is heavy, and the MINI E is an aerodynamic brick. Regen is the only answer. I think right pedal regen offers better control, hence better efficiency in real traffic.

Probably a 6 kW charger?

Keijidosha will be happy. I think I just heard him cancel his LEAF reservation!

I question whether he is that happy, because this new BMW EV seems a come-down relative to the Mini-E. Quite a bit less range, and the mini-E could charge at greater than 10 kW. The Mini-E had the innovative AC Propulsion power electronics, which is now history.

At AltCar, BMW asked if we had to choose between >3.3kW L2 or DC quick charge, which would we want? I did not have an answer at the time, but after a year of discovery about the difficulties that QC faces, I would answer more L2. In California I have thousands of 30 and 50 amp L2 options, but only 2 QC.

 

[surfingslovak]

I would answer more L2. In California I have thousands of 30 and 50 amp L2 options, but only 2 QC.

Amen.

 

[evnow]

At AltCar, BMW asked if we had to choose between >3.3kW L2 or DC quick charge, which would we want?

Both. They serve different purposes.

 

[KeiJidosha]

At AltCar, BMW asked if we had to choose between >3.3kW L2 or DC quick charge, which would we want?

Both. They serve different purposes.

That seems to be the Tesla S answer. Desirable, but the price premium for same remains unknown. Ideally, Nissan adds a 6.6kW charger to the LEAF, and offers 12kW though nismo. Let owners vote with their wallets.

 

[lukati]

Today BMW announced that it has acquired 15% of SGL Carbon. BMW and its main investor now hold over 41% of the company. It looks like BMW and Volkswagen are in a strategic battle to control Germany's premier carbon fibre manufacturer, with BMW now making a decisive move. BMW wants to substantially lower the weight of its electric cars to compensate for battery weight.

 

[ss0808]

The active e demo models are now at BMW dealerships. Has anyone test drive ? Does anyone know real life range?

 

[muus]

For detailed information on the ActiveE:

http://activeemobility.blogspot.com/

 

[jhm614]

For detailed information on the ActiveE:

http://activeemobility.blogspot.com/

Thanks for that link! I loved reading about his Mini-E experiences, they really made me feel like I could get the Leaf to work with my commute.

One thing I notice is the ActiveE has a sticker range of 94 miles! A 28%-ish increase over the Leaf (of course, the price is about a 62% increase...)

 

[Boomer23]

For detailed information on the ActiveE:

http://activeemobility.blogspot.com/

Thanks for that link! I loved reading about his Mini-E experiences, they really made me feel like I could get the Leaf to work with my commute.

One thing I notice is the ActiveE has a sticker range of 94 miles! A 28%-ish increase over the Leaf (of course, the price is about a 62% increase...)

That's likely due to the 32 kWh battery vs the LEAF's 24 kWh, a 33% larger battery. The sticker shows energy efficiency at 33 kWh per 100 miles. I believe that the LEAF sticker shows 34 kWh/100 mi. My own data after about 9,000 miles of driving shows about 31 kWh/100 mi.

I am quite surprised that the efficiency is as high as it is, given that the car weighs about 4,000 lbs, about 18% more than the LEAF. Could it be the more aggressive regen, as we discussed earlier in this thread?

Regarding the price, I'm rather surprised that the sticker shows a purchase price. Nobody will be able to buy one of these. The lease is $499/mo with $2,250 down.

 

[muus]

Yes the sticker does indicate that the ActiveE is more efficient than the Leaf. (102 MPGe vs 99 MPGe combined) Interesting since the Leaf was a purpose built EV and the ActiveE is a conversion (and heavier). I wonder how much flack Nissan will get over this. The Focus EV, the ActiveE, the Tesla Roadster and the Mitsubishi i are all more efficient than the Leaf (although only marginally). Hopefully this will change in 2013 with a possibly more efficient charger.

 

[ss0808]

For detailed information on the ActiveE:

http://activeemobility.blogspot.com/

Thanks for that link! I loved reading about his Mini-E experiences, they really made me feel like I could get the Leaf to work with my commute.

One thing I notice is the ActiveE has a sticker range of 94 miles! A 28%-ish increase over the Leaf (of course, the price is about a 62% increase...)

The price is very competitive. Only leases are offered. Residual is 84% and money factor is .0024. Unlimited mileage. With no money down, a little more then 600/mos. This package is an incredible deal especially for a 60k car.

 

[evnow]

The price is very competitive. Only leases are offered. Residual is 84% and money factor is .0024. Unlimited mileage. With no money down, a little more then 600/mos. This package is an incredible deal especially for a 60k car.

But ActiveE is an incredibly expensive car compared to Model S

 

[TomT]

If the lease period wasn't extremely limited (2 years), as it initially was with the Mini-E, I very likely would have opted for the BMW over the Leaf...

The argument can be made that one can get a similar range Tesla for near that same price but, for me, the Tesla is just too damn BIG. Plus, it likely will not be available until well after the BMW.

The price is very competitive. Only leases are offered. Residual is 84% and money factor is .0024. Unlimited mileage. With no money down, a little more then 600/mos. This package is an incredible deal especially for a 60k car.