News reports out of Yokohama

[Nubo]

My battery was about 30% discharged at the time I got in to drive. In my 20 minutes of driving the car, my estimated range went from a high of 116 km (72 miles) to a low of 60 km (37 miles). The readout changed every 5 seconds or so to recalculate a new range based on my real time driving conditions. Most drivers are not going to get much out of seeing that their range is fluctuating so much. In fact, that could be a pretty distracting thing.

Yes - they should have that as a special mode - not the standard one. They should give the remaining kwh of the battery all the time ...

I guess I assumed that was what the right side of the battery meter was ( 0 to 1 ) but is it just a static background?

Definitely need the basic state of charge as a prominent full-time display element. The computer may be doing all kinds of fancy computation to estimate your miles remaining, but nowhere near able to match the driver's knowledge of upcoming conditions and intent. The driver needs to be able to process the fundamental unequivocal data of state-of-charge, without having it massaged and filtered. The massaging and filtering is fine as an adjunct, but not as a replacement.

 

[mwalsh]

I guess I assumed that was what the right side of the battery meter was ( 0 to 1 ) but is it just a static background?

You're thinking maybe it only shows the state of charge as of starting the car? That would kinda suck!

 

[sjfotos]

I guess I assumed that was what the right side of the battery meter was ( 0 to 1 ) but is it just a static background?

You're thinking maybe it only shows the state of charge as of starting the car? That would kinda suck!

I think that the SOC charge meter will be visible and with a continuous read-out. That is probably fine for everyone on this forum. The readers here would be making informed judgments on what that means. The indicator that the author was talking about was the range estimation. That is a tool meant for the general public that attempts to ally range anxiety. It is just like the 'cruising range' number on my wife's SUV. It says you have "X" miles left before "empty". I never pay strict attention to it, but it is nice for her, as long as she does not cut it too close! Looking at the fuel gauge (SOC meter) gives you a idea of what is left in the tank and relies on you to not take it to "E"!

I think a gauge in the Leaf that bounces around too much will be irritating and not useful, especially for the general public. Hopefully they smooth that puppy out.

 

[StrangerTides]

I think that the SOC charge meter will be visible and with a continuous read-out. That is probably fine for everyone on this forum. The readers here would be making informed judgments on what that means. The indicator that the author was talking about was the range estimation.
...

I would agree, but he went on to specifically say:

Drivers are used to seeing how much of their gas tank is still full, and the same will go for EV drivers. They’ll want to see how full their battery is. Over time, just as with your fuel gauge in a combustion car, drivers of the LEAF will come to know what 50% battery charge means in terms of range. It is, hands down, the most important thing an EV can display — but the LEAF lacks it.

If it really lacks this, and the "range estimate" is all that's provided, that sounds like a serious issue.

 

[Bicster]

It sounds like there must be a SOC meter somewhere. How else did he know about the SOC when he started out?

My guess is that it's shown on one of the NAV displays. It's possible that it's only available when the vehicle is not "running" but that seems pretty unlikely, right?

 

[EVDRIVER]

Estimating range left on an EV is a bit of a joke unless you are on flat ground at a constant speed with all variables remaining relatively the same. Even metering pack capacity accurately has been a challenge but is now accurate enough for most experienced EV drivers and average drivers using the vehicle within reasonable range expectations, this is likely why Nissan surveyed drivers as to their driving habits.

 

[LakeLeaf]

Crud - more caps! Windshield washer on the passenger side - but what's the one on the driver's side front?

An awful lot of hoses in there - I thought this was basically a fluidless car.

Hmm - wonder how/if these all effect the maintenance schedule.

 

[Frank]

Crud - more caps! Windshield washer on the passenger side - but what's the one on the driver's side front?

An awful lot of hoses in there - I thought this was basically a fluidless car.

Hmm - wonder how/if these all effect the maintenance schedule.

I remember a Nissan rep saying in one of the early videos that the Leaf only had two types of fluid - brake fluid and windshield washer fluid. Does anyone else remember seeing this?

 

[Bicster]

I remember a Nissan rep saying in one of the early videos that the Leaf only had two types of fluid - brake fluid and windshield washer fluid. Does anyone else remember seeing this?

Yes. But pretty clearly, the inverter is liquid cooled... Maybe it will be a sealed system when the car goes on sale, but I doubt it. I think what we see in those recent photos is what we get.

 

[mwalsh]

I guess we've seen just about all we're going to see out of this event now, unless some are saving stories for the Sunday editions of their rags?

I must say that, with the exception of the efforts by Paul Scott and Nick Chambers, I thought the quality of reporting ranged from fair to piss-poor. I don't see any way Nissan could be pleased with what they've managed to get out of what I can only imagine was a very expensive junket to organize.

Next time they need to focus on getting these cars into the hands of real Leaf enthusiasts! :roll:

 

[evnow]

I guess we've seen just about all we're going to see out of this event now, unless some are saving stories for the Sunday editions of their rags?

I must say that, with the exception of the efforts by Paul Scott and Nick Chambers, I thought the quality of reporting ranged from fair to piss-poor. I don't see any way Nissan could be pleased with what they've managed to get out of what I can only imagine was a very expensive junket to organize.

Next time they need to focus on getting these cars into the hands of real Leaf enthusiasts! :roll:

Yes - unless NYT or WaPO will come out with reviews later. Those tend to be repated in local newspapers and will form the main buzz.

I hope they invited hometown newspapers from rollout cities - those would give them max bang for the bucks. Instead of uninterested Aussie journalists we read ...

 

[AndyH]

I remember a Nissan rep saying in one of the early videos that the Leaf only had two types of fluid - brake fluid and windshield washer fluid. Does anyone else remember seeing this?

Yes. But pretty clearly, the inverter is liquid cooled... Maybe it will be a sealed system when the car goes on sale, but I doubt it. I think what we see in those recent photos is what we get.

Both the motor and controller are liquid cooled. If past production EVs (and current coolant tech) is a useful guide, we'll be changing coolant every 5 years or 100,000 miles.

Brake fluid is a given, along with it's every-2-year flush.

The power steering could be hydraulic with an electric pump, or all electric. If hydraulic, there's a fluid.

The gear reduction unit/differential will have gear lube; that'll likely be a lifetime fill.

We've talked about this in another thread - but this car will have much, much less required maintenance than an ICE vehicle. Imagine when the 'high-priority' maintenance items are check tire pressure, check washer fluid, and lube the door hinges once in a while.

 

[DeaneG]

..Imagine when the 'high-priority' maintenance items are check tire pressure, check washer fluid, and lube the door hinges once in a while.

We'll have forum threads devoted to arguments about which type of door hinge oil to use! I'm going to source some synthetic from Redline for peak door hinge performance.

 

[EVDRIVER]

..Imagine when the 'high-priority' maintenance items are check tire pressure, check washer fluid, and lube the door hinges once in a while.

We'll have forum threads devoted to arguments about which type of door hinge oil to use! I'm going to source some synthetic from Redline for peak door hinge performance.

Many ev converters use a low friction, high performance gear oil for efficiency and life. In a high rpm gear reduction this could help.

 

[AndyH]

..Imagine when the 'high-priority' maintenance items are check tire pressure, check washer fluid, and lube the door hinges once in a while.

We'll have forum threads devoted to arguments about which type of door hinge oil to use! I'm going to source some synthetic from Redline for peak door hinge performance.

[mock indifference]yeah, I guess that would work ok.[/MI]

The last thing we need is to introduce 'oil wars' to this otherwise mature board. :lol:

Many ev converters use a low friction, high performance gear oil for efficiency and life. In a high rpm gear reduction this could help.

Yes - and it's a real balancing act as the lighter viscosity fluids that provide max efficiency can't maintain the film strength to protect the gear teeth. The stuff Ford uses in the Ranger's pressure lube system is about the viscosity of automatic transmission fluid. It'll be interesting to see what Nissan uses in 'our' gearbox.

Andy
AMSOIL Direct Jobber

 

[SilverLeaf]

http://gas2.org/2010/06/16/first-drive-nissan-leaf-its-a-zippy-roomy-well-designed-car/

First Drive: Nissan LEAF – It’s a Zippy, Roomy, Well-Designed Car

As one of the first non-Nissan people invited to spend some time behind the wheel of a pre-production Nissan LEAF in Japan this week, I wasn’t sure what to expect. But, the word is in folks, and after having a good amount of time to experience the car from the inside out, my overwhelming feeling is that Nissan has a true winner of a car on their hands.

Even without the electric motor the LEAF would be a great little hatchback. But add that motor in, and now you have a great car with an incredibly compelling reason to buy it.

... click on the link to see the rest of the article

 

[SilverLeaf]

If you click on the link, the article also contains some nice pictures of the LEAF, including under the hood photos. Clicking on the pictures gives you a larger, better image.

 

[evnow]

Merged - the report is already covered here. Also, can you quote a few sentences - I think putting the full article isn't fair (use).

 

[DeaneG]

I'm pretty sure that the reviewer above was looking at the "instantaneous" energy consumption readout, instead of "average", and this was the reason for his complaint about rapidly changing numbers. The Nissan Leaf website spec sheet says the Leaf has both (just like an ICE car).

 

[garygid]

I would expect the SOC (fullness of the e-tank) to be indicated by the "bars" on the right (that has the estimated miles-remaining superimposed over it).

If these bars are not SOC, what do they represent?