New Leaf Owner Checking In

[Temilotzin21]

Hello All,

Just got a Leaf this last Thursday. I love not having to get gas!

 

[TonyWilliams]

Hello All,

Just got a Leaf this last Thursday. I love not having to get gas!

Where are you, how far do you drive, etc?

 

[Temilotzin21]

Hello All,

Just got a Leaf this last Thursday. I love not having to get gas!

Where are you, how far do you drive, etc?

Boulder Creek CA (Santa Cruz Mountains). I drive 50-70 miles a day over a mountain.

 

[TonyWilliams]

Boulder Creek CA (Santa Cruz Mountains). I drive 50-70 miles a day over a mountain.

70 miles over mountains (I assume that means the hills between the coast and SF Bay) will be tough.

The battery will degrade, so even if it's possible now, it will be increasingly more difficult in cold weather. Seasonally the capacity of the battery deflates (about 10% loss at freezing temp), and in addition, the heater will consume an additional load on an already diminished battery.

In the summer, you'll get that back. However, over time there will be permanent degradation. Probably about 10% the first year, then 20%-30% in 5 years.

So, a freezing cold battery in year two will have about 20% reduced capacity, before you ever turn the heat on. Every winter, it will get worse. I hope you factored that all into your ownership/lease period.

 

[Becky50]

Welcome! I just drove my LEAF back from a weekend at the beach. The LEAF does a great job over Highway 17. It is fun watching the GOM decrease on the way up and then increase on the way back down.

 

[planet4ever]

Boulder Creek CA (Santa Cruz Mountains). I drive 50-70 miles a day over a mountain.

That sounds like Bear Creek Road/17 to some place in Silicon Valley. If so, at least half of your drive is likely to be on San Jose area freeways (including 17). I hope you can find some place to charge at work - even a 120v plug would be fine. I'd hate to hear that you got stranded 10 miles from nowhere out on Bear Creek in a storm next winter.

(There are charging stations near the intersection of 17 and Hwy 9 that you could use before starting up the hill if you were low, but no Quick Charge in the area, so it would be likely to delay your trip home by an hour or more.)

Ray

 

[Temilotzin21]

Boulder Creek CA (Santa Cruz Mountains). I drive 50-70 miles a day over a mountain.

That sounds like Bear Creek Road/17 to some place in Silicon Valley. If so, at least half of your drive is likely to be on San Jose area freeways (including 17). I hope you can find some place to charge at work - even a 120v plug would be fine. I'd hate to hear that you got stranded 10 miles from nowhere out on Bear Creek in a storm next winter.

(There are charging stations near the intersection of 17 and Hwy 9 that you could use before starting up the hill if you were low, but no Quick Charge in the area, so it would be likely to delay your trip home by an hour or more.)

Ray

Thanks for the heads up Ray! You are correct, I drive Bear Creek every day. I will keep an eye out for charge stations along the way.

 

[Temilotzin21]

Welcome! I just drove my LEAF back from a weekend at the beach. The LEAF does a great job over Highway 17. It is fun watching the GOM decrease on the way up and then increase on the way back down.

Yes, I noticed that too. I hope my battery does not loose too much charge-ability in the years to come. I would imagine that is covered in the 100K battery warranty though, right?

 

[Temilotzin21]

Boulder Creek CA (Santa Cruz Mountains). I drive 50-70 miles a day over a mountain.

70 miles over mountains (I assume that means the hills between the coast and SF Bay) will be tough.

The battery will degrade, so even if it's possible now, it will be increasingly more difficult in cold weather. Seasonally the capacity of the battery deflates (about 10% loss at freezing temp), and in addition, the heater will consume an additional load on an already diminished battery.

In the summer, you'll get that back. However, over time there will be permanent degradation. Probably about 10% the first year, then 20%-30% in 5 years.

So, a freezing cold battery in year two will have about 20% reduced capacity, before you ever turn the heat on. Every winter, it will get worse. I hope you factored that all into your ownership/lease period.

Does my 100K battery warranty cover that loss in use?

 

[TonyWilliams]

However, over time there will be permanent degradation. Probably about 10% the first year, then 20%-30% in 5 years.

Does my 100K battery warranty cover that loss in use?

Absolutely not; famously so. Battery degradation is specifically excluded.

There are NUMEROUS threads on these issues.

Click here to read about atest we performed in Phoenix with cars with degraded batteries. (NOTE: your car will not degrade as fast as the hot weather places like Phoenix)

My summary of degradation issues.

 

[mkjayakumar]

Nissan and the dealers should stop this nonsense of spouting hundred miles range, and they should also clearly explain that there is no warranty on the battery capacity. No prospective customer should leave the dealership without an understanding of what the range will be, and what is and what is not warranted in the battery.

This is out right unethical practice and should be stopped. I am sure there is some agency out there that might be interested in looking into this. If I had not read this forum before I bought my Leaf, I also would have been under the impression that the capacity is warranted by Nissan.

 

[Herm]

This is out right unethical practice and should be stopped. I am sure there is some agency out there that might be interested in looking into this. If I had not read this forum before I bought my Leaf, I also would have been under the impression that the capacity is warranted by Nissan.

+10 to MNL

 

[Deleted member 3147]

As far as I remember, the paperwork that you have to sign before taking delivery of a new Leaf says that it is not covered. However, this doesn't help the new owner who didn't notice that, nor the second-hand buyer, it only helps protect Nissan!

I agree, Nissan is just digging itself into a deeper hole and angering its customers, many of which a new to Nissan and will never return, not to mention bed-mouthing to all their friends!

 

[mrdcmills]

After week one I'm not rushing out to buy the Level 2 charger. We have been running a/c and blitzing all over town. Just plug in soon as we get home. Average 71 miles per day. The lowest "guessometer" reading has been 23 miles when I got home.

 

[mkjayakumar]

I have been happy with my L1 charging so far, 7 months and 7.5k miles. Though there have been a few instances on the weekend when I missed the L2 and had to take the ICE because there wasn't enough range..

My problem is that pulling a wire from my panel and installing a Nema plug would set me up by a grand, and then the EVSE upgrade, all told atleast a little over a thousand to get L2 up and running.

 

[Temilotzin21]

However, over time there will be permanent degradation. Probably about 10% the first year, then 20%-30% in 5 years.

Does my 100K battery warranty cover that loss in use?

Absolutely not; famously so. Battery degradation is specifically excluded.

There are NUMEROUS threads on these issues.

Click here to read about atest we performed in Phoenix with cars with degraded batteries. (NOTE: your car will not degrade as fast as the hot weather places like Phoenix)

My summary of degradation issues.

Wow, that's a bummer. What can I do when my 100 mi car can no longer make my 50 mi commute? Do I have any recourse? I gotta say I'm feeling like I was mislead at the dealership if what you say is indeed the case in terms of long term charge-ability.

 

[abasile]

What can I do when my 100 mi car can no longer make my 50 mi commute? Do I have any recourse?

Battery capacity loss is simply a fact of life for any rechargeable battery. Unfortunately, Nissan has made some design trade-offs that are proving to be especially bad for battery life in hot climates, but thankfully your climate is relatively temperate.

Probably the best you can do is try to make arrangements to use an outlet at work to charge your LEAF. Workplace charging can make a huge difference. With that in place, and only 25-35 miles to drive between charges, your LEAF could potentially last you many, many years, likely well past ten years. Even 50 miles you should be able to do for quite a few years.

There should be clearer disclosure at dealerships, but the trouble is, most dealership employees are clueless about even the basics of the LEAF such as not leaving it sitting at 100% charge for long periods of time.

As an aside, many of us appreciate Tesla as a company because all they sell is 100% electric cars. So you would naturally expect their people to be more knowledgeable about EV's. At the same time, I do appreciate that Nissan brought the LEAF to market, even though most Nissan dealerships are probably not truly ready for it.

 

[planet4ever]

Does my 100K battery warranty cover that loss in use?

Absolutely not; famously so. Battery degradation is specifically excluded.

Wow, that's a bummer. What can I do when my 100 mi car can no longer make my 50 mi commute? Do I have any recourse? I gotta say I'm feeling like I was mislead at the dealership if what you say is indeed the case in terms of long term charge-ability.

Tony knows whereof he speaks. Believe it. All batteries wear out. Quite a number of LEAF owners are discovering theirs are wearing out faster than they imagined possible. Nissan undoubtedly believes, and with some justification, that they cannot guarantee a minimum battery life, because it depends so heavily on where you live and how you drive, factors that are outside their control. Being misled is another matter, and some people are pushing Nissan very hard on that. But before you jump on that bandwagon, be sure you go back and read the four page document you had to sign, affirming that you had read it, before you were allowed to take possession of the car.

As to what you can do, there are any number of things, not all practical for you. Among other possibilities, you can:

• charge while at work, as we have discussed.
• simply slow down. (If it makes sense, for example, try San Tomas Expressway instead of the freeways.)
• carpool with someone who lives somewhere (such as Los Gatos) between your home and work location.
• find a new job, or a new home, to reduce your commute.
• trade the car in on something different that fits your needs.
• hang on long enough that a "battery transplant" becomes available.

The first four things I listed are proactive steps; the sooner you take any of them the longer your battery will last. But don't agonize too much. Temperatures in the Santa Cruz mountains will be kind to your car in the summer, and while parts of the Silicon Valley are significantly warmer then, our friends in Phoenix who are having the worst battery problems would laugh at them. If you are kind to your battery it should last you quite a few years. Above all, enjoy the car for what it is and does that is unique.

Ray

 

[Temilotzin21]

Tony knows whereof he speaks. Believe it. All batteries wear out. Quite a number of LEAF owners are discovering theirs are wearing out faster than they imagined possible. Nissan undoubtedly believes, and with some justification, that they cannot guarantee a minimum battery life, because it depends so heavily on where you live and how you drive, factors that are outside their control. Being misled is another matter, and some people are pushing Nissan very hard on that. But before you jump on that bandwagon, be sure you go back and read the four page document you had to sign, affirming that you had read it, before you were allowed to take possession of the car.

As to what you can do, there are any number of things, not all practical for you. Among other possibilities, you can:

• charge while at work, as we have discussed.
• simply slow down. (If it makes sense, for example, try San Tomas Expressway instead of the freeways.)
• carpool with someone who lives somewhere (such as Los Gatos) between your home and work location.
• find a new job, or a new home, to reduce your commute.
• trade the car in on something different that fits your needs.
• hang on long enough that a "battery transplant" becomes available.

The first four things I listed are proactive steps; the sooner you take any of them the longer your battery will last. But don't agonize too much. Temperatures in the Santa Cruz mountains will be kind to your car in the summer, and while parts of the Silicon Valley are significantly warmer then, our friends in Phoenix who are having the worst battery problems would laugh at them. If you are kind to your battery it should last you quite a few years. Above all, enjoy the car for what it is and does that is unique.

Ray[/quote]

Thanks Ray. Sounds like sage advice. I'll keep you guys posted on how things go. Gotta say so far I'm loving my leaf. I've been going to and from work and my gage is saying I got 20-30 miles left.

 

[Transtead]

Agreed. We're in "GenOne" of the Leaf. The tech is new, and there will be issues. In fact, there may be issues we don't even know of until we've all been driving these for a few years. I guess this is why I decided to lease rather than buy. When Leaf G2 comes out, I'll just flip it.