Need Help New Leaf Pre-owned owner

[TimLee]

...
I'm quite happy arriving at a destination with 1kWh remaining (assuming I can charge there). I will, however, be watching close once I get down to less than 3kWh. This functionally means that I'm routinely driving in the LBW range and frequently hit VLBW.

But that is MUCH more zealous than most people are willing to do.
You will likely hit Turtle by 0.6 or 0.5 kWh, and be dead in the water unable to move the vehicle at 0.3 kWh.
Even if you are acieving 4.5 miles per kWH, extremely efficient, you find it acceptable to arrive at your destination where the EVSE may not be working, with around three miles of driving range till you are stranded unable to move the LEAF till you put 2approximately 2 kWH of power into the battery :?:

My definition of extremely zealous.

 

[TimLee]

...
And it's not just range for me as I look at it, but range as a percentage of "full".

I do understand.
That is my point that you and some others have substantially revised their perspective from what most drivers expect.

I think the vehicle manufacturers actually have gotten more conservative with low fuel warning lights in the past two decades.
I ran a an ICE out of fuel late at night on mountainous stretch on Interstate in South Carolina when I spotted the low fuel warning light back in the early 1980s.

With more conservative fuel warning lights, with a current ICE the light probably would have come on before the ten miles apart exits.

LEAF LBW would have been marginal.
Using VLBW as the warning standard, I would have been sitting on the side of the road waiting a very long time.

 

[Slow1]

To tolerate driving to VLBW, where you might be hard pressed to drive eight more miles, as being OK reflects a substantial change in perspective that only the more zealous electric vehicle drivers have come to find acceptable and normal.

Have to laugh here - My wife is FAR from a "zealous electric vehicle driver" - aggressive driver perhaps, but... Anyway, she has no problem driving to VLBW now as she has learned that she can 'make it' if it comes on after a particular point away from the house (that point is slowly moving farther away I think...).

However your point is well taken - this is a significant mental shift from driving an ICE where you can comfortably drive for years and never drop below 1/4 tank (which could be more range than we start out with in the Leaf).

The down side of the Leaf for us has been that we do think about range more than we EVER did with our ICE vehicles. Not really anxiety; rather we consider it before driving significant distances. Fortunately for us that is not a very common thing as we generally drive less than 60 miles in a given day (more than enough time overnight to recharge). IF we had a 200 mile range, then we'd only think about it once or twice a year which would be rather nice....

 

[Slow1]

...
I'm quite happy arriving at a destination with 1kWh remaining (assuming I can charge there). I will, however, be watching close once I get down to less than 3kWh. This functionally means that I'm routinely driving in the LBW range and frequently hit VLBW.

But that is MUCH more zealous than most people are willing to do.
You will likely hit Turtle by 0.6 or 0.5 kWh, and be dead in the water unable to move the vehicle at 0.3 kWh.
Even if you are acieving 4.5 miles per kWH, extremely efficient, you find it acceptable to arrive at your destination where the EVSE may not be working, with around three miles of driving range till you are stranded unable to move the LEAF till you put 2approximately 2 kWH of power into the battery :?:

My definition of extremely zealous.

Fair point - my "destination" here has almost aways been home where I am very confident of both the EVSE working and having good alternative options even if it isn't working. (It is almost all downhill from my home to the Nissan dealership which has 2 L2 and a DCQC station - I can get there on less than 1/2kWh, yes I have measured this).

IF I were traveling farther away to unknown territories then yes, I'd want to maintain sufficient charge to get to the 2nd choice location... which frankly could mean maintaining 50% charge... thus I don't travel that far. Our longest 'normal' trip comes to just under 80 miles r/t and only has a couple 'out of the route' options to charge in case of emergency. We drive the ICE during winter as it is too far for our comfort but we did drive the Leaf well into the fall until VLBW was happening uncomfortably far from home.

All about planning, confidence, and having the necessary information to make good choices; I would likely be much more conservative if I couldn't see the actual kWh remaining via leafspy....

 

[TimLee]

...
All about planning, confidence, and having the necessary information to make good choices; I would likely be much more conservative if I couldn't see the actual kWh remaining via leafspy....

Yes :!:
I agree completely.
Effective use of the LEAF requires planning to have the confidence you can get where you planned.

I have had much more knowledge to plan well and have confidence since getting a Note 3 and LEAF Spy Pro in January 2014.
I recommend it highly to anyone driving a LEAF :!:

 

[davewill]

The fact remains that if you are NOT willing to venture down to LBW or lower, the range of the car is so short that we get people crying that they only get 35 miles or so. On a car that's only good for 60-70 miles total, leaving 15-30% as a reserve just doesn't work well.

 

[flipnotize21]

Thank you for all the great feedback, im a noob leaf driver venturing out into the electric phase, to answer some questions yes 100% all freeway test 58-60mph with a hill climb of aproxx 2000ft in a 5-6mile stretch, im so used to driving ICE on a full tank and never see gas warning light, I drive a lot some days 60miles a day with some area like santa clarita CA without QC, I wish to not go VLBW because I only have a trickle charger at home and take me 12hrs or even more to charge, some days I come home by 12am and I have to drive my wife by 6am then do some errands in the am, I love the leaf its a lot cheaper than ICE, daily driving range from 30-70miles per day. and yes im down by 10 bars.

 

[desiv]

I wish to not go VLBW because I only have a trickle charger at home and take me 12hrs or even more to charge, some days I come home by 12am and I have to drive my wife by 6am then do some errands in the am,

This is the main reason I upgraded at home to an L2 EVSE. (Well, the time. I generally avoid VLBW. But LBW is no biggie to me anymore... It REALLY helped when I got an OBD2 adapter and Leaf Spy to see the actual battery %)
There were times when I'd get home, and it was 12 hours or more to charge...

If I were you, I'd start looking at actual costs for an L2. I figured I paid for my L2 setup in the first few months of owning my Leaf (I drive a lot.. and my install was pretty simple).

desiv

 

[davewill]

... I wish to not go VLBW because I only have a trickle charger at home and take me 12hrs or even more to charge, some days I come home by 12am and I have to drive my wife by 6am ...

Well that's a completely different kettle of fish than some who cry that the car CAN'T go farther when it's just anxiety. You could always fix the problem with a better EVSE if it became too much trouble.

 

[flipnotize21]

hey people im back, still waiting for my OBD11 reader china is taking so long :lol: well I have access to QC here 2 miles away but most of the time its TEMP Error by the time I use it, a lot of people here use the QC so I will do a 20 min charge then top off at home. but again I have to almost do this every day, it would be nice if I hade LVL 2 at home. hope by next month I can estimate the price of both LVL 2 charger and install. if not ill go for turbocord.

 

[desiv]

it would be nice if I hade LVL 2 at home. hope by next month I can estimate the price of both LVL 2 charger and install. if not ill go for turbocord.

The price estimate for the LVL2 is pretty straight forward.
The EVSEupgrade is around $287 and really all you'd need for a 2012 with it's 3.3kW charger.
(Or you can go $380 for a nice wall mounted LCS-20 at about the same amperage)
You can, of course, get a nicer unit that won't charge your current leaf any faster, but will be nice if you plan on getting another Leaf later...
Those tend to start around $400 and go up from there..
As for the install, you'll need a quote..
Basic installs can be under $200 (mine was.. Not sure you can get an electrician to say "HI" for under $100 nowadays ).
But that's usually a pretty basic install, very short run to a plug. In my case, where I wanted my plug was about 3 feet from the box and there weren't any complications (although they did have to add a tandem breaker to free up space in my box).
Longer runs or (<insert deity> forbid) needing a service upgrade to the house can significantly affect prices.
The latter is more rare.. Most people seem to have the space/AMPS available...

The Turbocord looks to be a decent device, but for the faster charging, you still need a new 240v plug as you would with the EVSEUpgrade.
So if you're looking for cost savings, the upgrade is probably your best bet..

Good luck..

desiv

 

[flipnotize21]

it would be nice if I hade LVL 2 at home. hope by next month I can estimate the price of both LVL 2 charger and install. if not ill go for turbocord.

The price estimate for the LVL2 is pretty straight forward.
The EVSEupgrade is around $287 and really all you'd need for a 2012 with it's 3.3kW charger.
(Or you can go $380 for a nice wall mounted LCS-20 at about the same amperage)
You can, of course, get a nicer unit that won't charge your current leaf any faster, but will be nice if you plan on getting another Leaf later...
Those tend to start around $400 and go up from there..
As for the install, you'll need a quote..
Basic installs can be under $200 (mine was.. Not sure you can get an electrician to say "HI" for under $100 nowadays ).
But that's usually a pretty basic install, very short run to a plug. In my case, where I wanted my plug was about 3 feet from the box and there weren't any complications (although they did have to add a tandem breaker to free up space in my box).
Longer runs or (<insert deity> forbid) needing a service upgrade to the house can significantly affect prices.
The latter is more rare.. Most people seem to have the space/AMPS available...

The Turbocord looks to be a decent device, but for the faster charging, you still need a new 240v plug as you would with the EVSEUpgrade.
So if you're looking for cost savings, the upgrade is probably your best bet..

Good luck..

desiv

Thanks Desiv for that hopefully our family electrician can hook us up on the cost ill update on whats going to happen, as for now im doing a QC 2 miles away then top off at home it cuts the time but I hate doing it almost every other night. another thing is I want to take the turbocord with me my relatives in Santa Clarita CA have a 220 in the garage so I can charge when I hang out there or even just for emergency I have a 120/220 turbocord in the trunk. still waiting for my OBD2 reader dang china post but today I did some calculations and I came up with 4.5 miles per bar from 12 to 2 bars the calculation is 4.5 miles per bar at a rate of 4.3 average driving.....

 

[flipnotize21]

weird thing happened this morning.... I charged last night at QC and top off the charge (since no one was waiting behind me) top till it switched off.. then drove it this morning to work took me 7.5 miles took 2 bars off 12, then I just recently plugged here at work with L1 and it shows 4 bars gone out of 12?????? wth is going on???

 

[GerryAZ]

You may want to check with your dealer to see if the P3227 software update has been done. The instrumentation (and the CAN bus data) in my 2011 became more erratic as I lost more capacity in the original battery. When it was down to 8 capacity bars (4 lost), I sometimes used 9 state of charge bars during my 26-mile morning commute (slightly downhill) and made it home in the evening (uphill with heavy A/C use) on the remaining 3 bars. The instrumentation and data from the CAN bus was much more stable and consistent after the software update.

Gerry

 

[TimLee]

But P3227 may reduce your regeneration.

 

[GerryAZ]

But P3227 may reduce your regeneration.

I disagree--loss of regeneration in cooler temperatures is related to battery condition whether or not you have the software update.

I lost regeneration on my 2011 when the ambient temperature dropped suddenly in November 2012 (long before P3227). Regeneration returned when temperatures warmed back up. I had the software update in the summer of 2013 and got the new battery in October. I had full regeneration even at high state of charge during the "winter" of 2013-2014. After the summer temperatures caused some battery deterioration, I again lost regeneration when the ambient temperature dropped in November 2014.

Gerry

 

[flipnotize21]

Gerry thanks for that info, i can ask if the software was updated in my nissan appointment this next week, how did u like the replacement battery and did it also came with a warranty? I know you lost the car from an accident was the new battery a lizard version or it was a regular 11-12 battery? Thanks again

 

[TimLee]

I disagree--loss of regeneration in cooler temperatures is related to battery condition whether or not you have the software update.

I lost regeneration on my 2011 when the ambient temperature dropped suddenly in November 2012 (long before P3227). Regeneration returned when temperatures warmed back up. I had the software update in the summer of 2013 and got the new battery in October. I had full regeneration even at high state of charge during the "winter" of 2013-2014. After the summer temperatures caused some battery deterioration, I again lost regeneration when the ambient temperature dropped in November 2014.

Gerry

Although what you said is correct, what you did not address was what P3227 does to the indicated battery condition.
Many have reported a substantial drop in the battery condition indicator Hx when they had P3227 done.
And that drop does cause a substantial reduction in available regeneration.

Now whether the drop in Hx is accurate, or whether it is an error in the P3227 software change, is a point of some debate.
As more people with 2013 and later LEAFs get to more capacity loss and report their Hx values we will have something to compare the 2011 and 2012 post P3227 software change vehicles against.
Not many have done that.
But from the limited input most say 2013 forward LEAFs regeneration does not fall off a cliff like the P3227 software change LEAFs, and that the P3227 software change is defective.

 

[flipnotize21]

Tim leee what are my benefits on upgrading the software? And is this an option or when i take my car in they will automatically do it? Can i opt not to get ot installed if the negative outcome weights more than the posetive?

 

[HighDesertDriver]

Ed,

If you're inclined, I can meet you in Santa Clarita at the Nisssan dealer and measure your battery capacity on our meter. We'll need to add some charge to get back over the hills to Palmdale and you can choose to recharge there or (slower) at your family's home. There are other nearby charging locations (no DCFC that I know of, however) if you'd prefer. Chick-Fil-A, our usual food target for this particular drive, is a short walk.

Bob