Low Mileage User - Can I save $$ and skip the 240v Charger?

[JayFox]

Hi. If there is a thread on this, please point the way. My typical daily use will be 15 miles and under. I will usually have 10-12 hours a day of 120v charging. I would prefer to skip the cost of the 240v and keep the $$ in my pocket. At worst I will take away the 240v and have my electrician install it. Thoughts? Suggestions? Thanking you in advance. Jay

 

[walter]

I too am in the same situation. I was planning on putting in the 240 line only because the Nissan site made it part of moving forward with the ordering process. I will probably install it later myself at a cost savings of over two thousand dollars, but for now will be happy with trickle charge. I plan on having car in bed by 3 or 4 in the afternoon and charging until at least 9am the next day. This should be more than adequate for my projected needs.

 

[Stoaty]

I did find one thread: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=5771" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Seems like the main concern is the decreased efficiency of L1 charging, but if you are driving that short a distance it wouldn't matter much.

 

[thankyouOB]

if you have time and take trips of limited length, the L1 is fine.
i use it at work to add bars when I am going somewhere other than home afterwards.
it is good and useful but is slow.

 

[ElectricVehicle]

120V charging will give you about 4.5 miles of LEAF mile range per hour of charging. If you plug in at 8pm or earlier and unpplug at 8am, you'll get 12 hours of charge each night, which is 54 LEAF miles. since you usually won't come home empty, you'd start each day with 100% charge, since your typical is 15 miles. Even if you drove 40 or 50 miles, you'd still be at 100%.

A number of us only charge to 80% since that more than covers our needs and extends battery life. You can always install 240V later. There may be some convenient level 2 240V chargers near you, that you could use in the rare event you'd ever need to.

Also check out EVSE Upgrade Fast Low Cost Charging - All EVSE Questions Answered! and http://www.quick220.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . If your skilled in working with electricity, or know someine who is and you can safely operate dryer plugs and other 220V plugs, there are many possibilities. It's not something to be casual about or something for people who are unaware of the hazards of using 220V plugs, but these are commonly used for devices that are left plugged in. You don't want to be mating and unmating these 220V plugs like dryer plugs every day, they're not designed for it. Adapters for Ingineer's L1 to L2 EVSE mod NOW AVAILABLE

 

[ElectricVehicle]

I did find one thread: http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=5771" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Seems like the main concern is the decreased efficiency of L1 charging, but if you are driving that short a distance it wouldn't matter much.

True! I forgot too mention that you will use a little more energy with 120V vs. 240V charging.

 

[dgpcolorado]

I'm not sure where the OP is located but presume that most people on this board are in the sunbelt or mild climate areas. However, I would like to point out why I went with a 240V charger (EVSE Upgrade) in my garage: I live in an area where it will be very helpful to preheat my car in winter, especially when I am pushing the limits of cold weather range. As I understand it, preheating doesn't work well (or at all) with 120V charging. In my snowbelt climate preheating while still plugged-in is a big deal. Hence the 240V, 16A charger.

 

[DesertDenizen]

It is moot for me as I got a free charger as part of the pilot, but if I didn't I could get by without one. Tucson has L2 chargers going up all over, at libraries, in parking garages etc. Plus for the moment anyway there is no charge, pardon the pun.

 

[ebill3]

IMO you will be fine with L1 charging. That is what I do mainly because I rent and don't care to go through the hassle of management approval, city permit, the cost and etc.

Perhaps there is a significant difference in efficiency, but given your small usage and considering what you will save over wet fuel, it is not that big a deal. My electric provider is one of the highest in the area. I average about 12 cents a kWh and my average cost to drive is just shy of 3 cents a mile.

I have not heard that timed climate control does not work on 120 volts, and have not tried it myself. Perhaps I'll check that out as the weather cools.

Bill

 

[kmp647]

I second the pre heat in the winter

The plugged in pre heat will not work well on 120v

So that may be a big reason to have a 240v evse whatever the type or brand

 

[HighDesertDriver]

We average 45 miles per day just fine on L1. We are, however, getting the EVSE upgrade to give us a bit more capability if we choose to make some 100% --> 10% weekend drives and don't have a long night to charge back to the the desired level on L1.

 

[ebill3]

I second the pre heat in the winter

The plugged in pre heat will not work well on 120v

So that may be a big reason to have a 240v evse whatever the type or brand

Do you have experience with pre-heat on 120 volts? Not trying to be adversarial, just interested in what actually happens with either pre-heat or pre-cool on 120 volts. It would seem that if the climate control was set to start after charge completion, 12 Amps at 120 volts would be ample power.

Perhaps there is a thread on the subject? Or some other reference?

Bill

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

L1 is fine for less than 40 miles per day. i did L1 charging exclusively over 4 months and not spending a grand or 2 on a dedicated 240 volt charger is easy to understand.

but there may come a time when a quicker charge might be needed. i think you will find the Leaf's range adequate for a large part of your driving needs and i would recommend the EVSE upgrade from Phil. for under $300 you can get the option of 240 volt charging flexibility

 

[JustinC]

I'm a similar driver to you - I tend to drive about 50 miles a week, so I opted not to get the L2 charger. I've been enjoying LEAF ownership for about a month now and trickle charging has been more than adequate.

 

[planet4ever]

I agree with everyone else. 120v charging should work just fine for both JayFox and walter. I might extend one comment:

You don't want to be mating and unmating these 220V plugs like dryer plugs every day, they're not designed for it.

The truth is you are not going to want to plug and unplug the trickle charging cord from the wall every day, either. Not only might it be hard on the outlet, but you are likely to get tired of getting it out of the back of the car every night and putting it away every morning. Not to worry, though! It turns out that, especially for those with low mileage, there is no reason to have that in the car at all. Sure, if you are going to go for a longer jaunt on the weekend, you can toss it in the back to keep the wife from worrying, but most of the time you should leave it plugged in in the garage and just pretend it's like having a permanently mounted 240v EVSE.

Ray

 

[smkettner]

I have averaged close to 50 miles per day since purchase last May. Very few times I come up short. 15 miles per day would be easy. Even if you eventually get the L2 you can do it at your leasure in the next year or two.

 

[smkettner]

I too am in the same situation. I was planning on putting in the 240 line only because the Nissan site made it part of moving forward with the ordering process....... snip

There is no need for any electrical work or home assessment to complete the purchase of the Leaf.
You can easily request a waiver of the whole home electric process.

 

[fooljoe]

There's no doubt that you could get by with 120v charging with low mileage driving, but one thing that hasn't been mentioned thus far is time-of-use (TOU) metering. If you want to make use of TOU to get the lowest rate for charging, then you'll want all your charging done in a relatively short window (for my utility it's 6 hours) that probably can't be achieved using L1.

But anyways, if you're going to spend $30k on the car why not plop down another $300 for the EVSE upgrade? Most houses will already have a 240v circuit of some kind that can be used with it, or it's a pretty simple task to get one installed or do it yourself.

 

[planet4ever]

There's no doubt that you could get by with 120v charging with low mileage driving, but one thing that hasn't been mentioned thus far is time-of-use (TOU) metering. If you want to make use of TOU to get the lowest rate for charging, then you'll want all your charging done in a relatively short window (for my utility it's 6 hours) that probably can't be achieved using L1.

Good point, but overplayed. If you are driving 15 to 25 miles/day you can recharge at 120v in a 6 hour window. Even if that's just your average, and you sometimes drive 40 miles/day, you can still do it, because you are using a third or less of your battery each day. So what if you don't fully charge one night after a long drive? You have plenty of buffer to let you catch up on subsequent nights.

Besides, you are not likely to be stuck with a TOU plan that is 6 lowest-rate hours 7 days a week. I have a choice of two such plans. One (PG&E E9) has 7 lowest-rate hours Monday-Friday, but 20 lowest-rate hours on weekends, when you would be likely to do your most driving if you have a short commute. The other one (E6, which I have, since I also have solar panels) is even better: 13 hours Monday-Friday and 21 hours weekends. And that is just in the summer. Winter E6 has 21 lowest-rate hours/day weekdays and 24 hours/day on weekends!

But anyways, if you're going to spend $30k on the car why not plop down another $300 for the EVSE upgrade? Most houses will already have a 240v circuit of some kind that can be used with it, or it's a pretty simple task to get one installed or do it yourself.

I disagree. The only existing 240v circuit you are at all likely to have in the garage is an electric dryer circuit, and I would guess that only a minority of LEAF owners will have a home designed for a dryer in the garage. Among that minority, a large fraction will actually be using that dryer circuit, and sharing is not recommended. And even that fraction of a fraction assumes you can park your car in the garage, which not everybody can. As to his second point, there are indeed many homes with an electrical panel in an attached garage, and for most of those (if the panel is not overloaded) it is a relatively simple and inexpensive task to add a new circuit.

Also, don't overlook the fact that fooljoe is referring specifically to the EVSE upgrade, though the comments also apply to a couple of other EVSE models which are designed for a lower amperage. The "standard" EVSEs are designed to be able to pull 30A, even though the current LEAF model can't use that much, and those cannot legally or safely be connected to a dryer circuit. A 12A or 16A EVSE like the upgrade will not be able to feed many future EVs at their full rate, and charging times will be much longer than advertised for those vehicles.

Bottom line: Although I myself have gone the route fooljoe recommends, it is nowhere near as obvious as he seems to be arguing that this is the best way for all low-mileage users to go.

Ray

 

[fooljoe]

@Ray - I agree the TOU concern is a pretty minor concern, but I figured I'd bring it up since no one else had yet. Minor as it may be, it could matter to someone deciding whether to rely on L1 or not (it mattered to me.)

My second point was that for as low as $300, it's kind of silly not to at least get the upgrade done so you have L2 capability if you need it, even if you still plan on using L1 most of the time (which the upgraded unit can still do.) I don't know the numbers on how many homes have unused dryer outlets or how many Leaf-ers can park in their garage, etc., but 240v can usually be had one way or another without breaking the bank. And especially if L2 would only be used occasionally, extension cords to far away outlets, quick220-type boxes, etc. can be employed. And the door is always open to eventually getting the wall unit with a hardwired 40a circuit if you want to.

Of course everybody's situation is unique, and OP or anyone else is welcome to share his particulars for advice on how best to set up his own charging situation.

P.S. - Also consider that even if you are using L1-only, it's recommended that you use a dedicated 120v circuit. And if you have one of those available where you'll be parking the car, it's as simple as getting a new breaker and a new outlet to convert that circuit to 240v.