Lost Battery Capacity and Range / Autonomy, Page 2

[GeekEV]

I've been visiting Sacramento and the temp pegged out at 111 F today. the AC in the house we are staying in can't keep up. the other night, at 9pm it was still 91F outside. This, IMHO, does not bode well for the Leaf without TMS and or a more robust battery and it's happening in quite a few places across quite a few states. I think it's time for Nissan to stop the press and find a fix before cranking out lots more cars to be sold in locals all across the south where it gets hot and may get even hotter in coming years, cars that ultimately will disappoint buyers in the not so long run.

I dunno. I'm in Sacramento and this is now my second summer with my LEAF. While we don't get as hot as Pheonix, we get a few weeks a year well in excess of 100 and temperatures of 110 are not uncommon. No capacity bar loss so far (I don't have a gid meter)...

I'll be interested to see if you make it through to fall (post Indian summer) without losing one.

I think I cursed myself. I lost my first bar this morning. Oh well.

 

[TonyWilliams]

I think I cursed myself. I lost my first bar this morning. Oh well.

Sorry to hear. I hope it doesn't impact your daily life much.

Somebody suggested that things might be tapering down a bit, but I think we've got many months of extreme heat in the desert areas.

 

[GeekEV]

I think I cursed myself. I lost my first bar this morning. Oh well.

Sorry to hear. I hope it doesn't impact your daily life much.

Nah, I'm still good. I'd have to lose much more before it starts to crimp my style. I just found the timing ironic! :lol:

 

[RegGuheert]

I am most concerned that Nissan might alter future BEV sales plans, after concluding that American BEV buyers simply are incapable of understanding the trade-offs, in battery life, and battery use, of vehicle batteries, and cannot exercise judgement in their driving and charging habits, to get their own particular optimum use from their batteries.

Nissan and other BEV manufactures may even move to "idiot-proof" future EV designs for the American market, and take much the same approach GM did with the Volt.

Clearly Nissan thought Americans were idiot enough to believe their public statements about how long the LEAF batteries would last in hot climates like Phoenix.

Perhaps what they haven't figured out is how much we "idiots" hate corporations which tell us untruths that end up costing us thousands of dollars when we believe them.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

i also fear all this will result in less choices and ultimately a vehicle that does not fit my needs as well as the current LEAF.

the MiEV had a good idea but the lack of range ultimately did not work for me. like thankyouOB i would gladly trade the bells for a few $$ (actually a lot of $$) that is why i dont drive a Volt. in reality, the Volt's EV range covers 75% of what i would use it for. add in the public charging and now its 90%. i know i would be in the "getting gas annually" crowd, but it was too much money. the LEAF is expensive for me and a sacrifice to buy but its benefits far outweigh the cost but it was close. the Volt? not even close

as far a K-F?? why are we mentioning, fire and batteries in the same sentence? it is simply a car fire issue. the fact that it plugs in has nothing to do with it. it is simply another of one of 250,000-300,000 car fires annually and nothing more. its simply pathetic of any reputable news agency to link the fires to EV technology the car happens to have.

 

[GeekEV]

I am most concerned that Nissan might alter future BEV sales plans...

i also fear all this will result in less choices and ultimately a vehicle that does not fit my needs as well as the current LEAF.

+1 Me too.

Nissan, if you're reading all this chatter, please be sane and resist the urge to make a knee-jerk reaction. Please recognize that although you have a very active and vocal set of users here you need to keep the big picture in mind. Statistically speaking, those suffering extreme capacity loss are in the minority. All you have to do is address it in a fair manner and we'll be happy. We'd like an explanation (being the engineers and enthusiasts we are), but I'd understand if you're hesitant to reveal your 'secret sauce'. Do you need more time to figure it out? Fair enough - just talk to us. Something frank and forthright. "We recognize some owners are experiencing issues and are actively researching the issue, when we have a solution we will work with you to reach a satisfactory resolution", would probably do the trick. I never understood why so many companies are so tight lipped...

 

[Stoaty]

I think I cursed myself. I lost my first bar this morning. Oh well.

It would be helpful to have:

VIN
Months owned
Date of manufacture
City, State

Once you file a case with Nissan, please leave case number for the Wiki and date case filed.

One of us will update the Wiki, or you can add your own entry.

Thanks.

 

[FairwoodRed]

Fair enough - just talk to us. Something frank and forthright. "We recognize some owners are experiencing issues and are actively researching the issue, when we have a solution we will work with you to reach a satisfactory resolution", would probably do the trick.

Perhaps you missed THIS but Nissan already said

Recently, we learned from the Nissan LEAF community—and specifically from some Phoenix-area LEAF owners—of a growing concern about battery capacity loss with their electric vehicles.

and

Nissan engineers from our Arizona Testing Center and around the world will study each customer case, work to discover the root cause and will determine next steps to satisfy our customers. While we do this, we pledge to provide an update to our customers as soon as possible.

It's been three weeks, but I'm expecting that they have some follow up by the end of week 4.

 

[edatoakrun]

="GeekEV"
...I think I cursed myself. I lost my first bar this morning. Oh well.

How's your driving range holding up?

Are you getting the smoke from the forest fires down there?

I last drove to Redding on Saturday.

It was like descending to hell, 109 and choking, acrid smoke. I've been more or less "sheltering in place" at home with the AC on, ever since.

I was planning a trip to town today, as it's supposed to be a few degrees cooler than yesterday (112).

Back on topic, I would think Central Valley LEAFs might show about the same bar behavior this August that Phoenix LEAFs did last spring. The problem is, I don't think we have a very precise idea of the proportion that lost a bar then, so I don't know what the odds of losing a bar on my LEAF are, yet.

I wouldn't be too surprised, either way.

On the bright side, a cooling trend is forecast, and looks like the Valley floor might see two-digit temps again...by next weekend.

 

[GeekEV]

Perhaps you missed THIS but Nissan already said ...

Indeed I did. Easy to do with the large fast moving threads. Thanks!

Kudos to Nissan for that. It's exactly what I would have hoped for.

It would be helpful to have: ...

My partial VIN is on my profile, everything else should be in that master spreadsheet collected oh-so-long-ago...

Once you file a case with Nissan, please leave case number for the Wiki and date case filed.

I have no intention of filing a case with Nissan. I don't feel 1 bar loss after 18 months and 20,000 miles is unreasonable. If I loose another one in short order, mind you, that will be a different story...

EDIT: Changed "8%" to "1 bar" since I had just done basic math instead of going with what the service manual says...

 

[surfingslovak]

I don't feel 8% loss after 18 months and 20,000 miles is unreasonable. If I loose another one in short order, mind you, that will be a different story...

15% per Nissan's 2011 Nissan Leaf shop manual. You would be well advised to conduct a range test to confirm your available usable capacity.

 

[GRA]

Perhaps you missed THIS but Nissan already said ...

Indeed I did. Easy to do with the large fast moving threads. Thanks!

Kudos to Nissan for that. It's exactly what I would have hoped for.

It would be helpful to have: ...

My partial VIN is on my profile, everything else should be in that master spreadsheet collected oh-so-long-ago...

Once you file a case with Nissan, please leave case number for the Wiki and date case filed.

I have no intention of filing a case with Nissan. I don't feel 8% loss after 18 months and 20,000 miles is unreasonable. If I loose another one in short order, mind you, that will be a different story...

Sorry to hear about your losing the first bar. I expect you will be the leading edge of an ever increasing number of Central Valley Leaf owners, trailing the Az. /Tx. /Desert Ca. group but preceding those in more temperate climates, although I won't be very surprised if certain parts of the Bay Area (Tri-Valley, SJ, Sonoma/Napa) start checking in with their first bar gone not too long after the Central Valley people.

BTW, if you're referring to capacity, the first bar is 15% loss.

 

[GeekEV]

15% per Nissan's 2011 Nissan Leaf shop manual. You would be well advised to conduct a range test to confirm your available usable capacity.

Hmm. I'd just assumed those saying 15% had lost two bars. So the bars are non-linear then? I just did 100% / 12 = 8%...

In any case, I'm fine with it for now.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

15% per Nissan's 2011 Nissan Leaf shop manual. You would be well advised to conduct a range test to confirm your available usable capacity.

Hmm. I'd just assumed those saying 15% had lost two bars. So the bars are non-linear then? I just did 100% / 12 = 8%...

In any case, I'm fine with it for now.

you are closer to your range loss estimate than you think
mine was 2% when charging at night. i just did a "warm weather" charge and it jumped to 5% and was going to do a "hot weather" charge but now i am kinda chickening out on that. expected to be mid to upper 90's here on thurs.

the warm weather charge was done with ambient temps between 88-90. not sure i want to risk a charge where ambient will be 105+ in the name of science

 

[GeekEV]

you are closer to your range loss estimate than you think

??? What range loss estimate? Did I make an estimate somewhere I forgot about?

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

you are closer to your range loss estimate than you think

??? What range loss estimate? Did I make an estimate somewhere I forgot about?

oh sorry. capacity loss i meant. (range has less letters and i am a lazy typist)

 

[GRA]

15% per Nissan's 2011 Nissan Leaf shop manual. You would be well advised to conduct a range test to confirm your available usable capacity.

Hmm. I'd just assumed those saying 15% had lost two bars. So the bars are non-linear then? I just did 100% / 12 = 8%...

In any case, I'm fine with it for now.

Yes, the bars are non-linear. The first is 15%, the second and third bars are each 6.25%. People in Phoenix have been losing the second bar in as little as 6 weeks after the first one, but yours should take considerably longer (we think/hope).

 

[GeekEV]

you are closer to your range loss estimate than you think

??? What range loss estimate? Did I make an estimate somewhere I forgot about?

oh sorry. capacity loss i meant. (range has less letters and i am a lazy typist)

Are you suggesting that my original 8% swag (100/12) is probably more accurate than the 15% that others are telling me 1 bar is?

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

Are you suggesting that my original 8% swag (100/12) is probably more accurate than the 15% that others are telling me 1 bar is?

yes!! just a vain attempt at generating groundswell for my TTID theory (Temporary
Temperature Induced Degradation)

now, if i could somehow generate enough courage to charge when my LEAF on Thurs when it will be over 100ºF...

i feel real weak right now

 

[vrwl]

yes!! just a vain attempt at generating groundswell for my TTID theory (Temporary
Temperature Induced Degradation)

now, if i could somehow generate enough courage to charge when my LEAF on Thurs when it will be over 100ºF...

i feel real weak right now

C'mon Dave, man up! Those of us in AZ and TX and OK do it all the time. :twisted: