Inside the NA spec L1 EVSE

[RJSC]

Now that's bad news for the DIY electronics repair people like myself. If some simple electronic component fails on that board it won't be possible to replace it because of that black resin.
It's basically trash it, save the expensive SAE J1772 Plug and do an EVSE signal board yourself (or buy it from one of those EV clubs you have on the USA).

There is one cheap and readily available 20V power supply that would take anything between 100V and 240V, a generic replacement laptop power supply.
Every one of them here in Europe are 100V~240V (and made in China :lol: ), so I think they are the same in the USA.
Most of them are to big to fit inside the EVSE though... You'd have to find another enclosure to the hole contraption to fit in.

 

[EVDRIVER]

Yes, the unit was made far larger than needed. As far as 120V charging goes I would just feed a pilot signal off the AC with a basic circuit and skip the rest, easy to do if it failed. One could also gut the inside and use the box and cord to make a 120/240 basic EVSE as well. My inclination is to do that and make some adaptors rather then buy a cord. The downside is that someone may want the original when it comes time to sell the car.

 

[DarkStar]

oltage drop across a resistive load is dependent on the current being pulled through the load.

Well, then all we need to do is calculate the resistance on the transformer and adjust the resistance as necessary through the light. I doubt much current is being pulled at all, so maybe even a simple resistor might be possible.

No way to know for sure until we hook it up!

 

[RJSC]

It's funny how you are not afraid of handling 120V and fear 240V...
We at Europe handle 230V every day, get a few shocks during our lifetime and basically respect it as much as you respect 120V.
Many people here handle live wires with bare hands just picking up the insulated part during experiments, yet a 240V circuit in the USA is seen as a big deal requiring all sort of protection devices... :lol:

I don't want to see you on Europe near some 400V 3-phase rusty water pumps at the small European type farms...
400V 3-phase power is fairly common at Europe, I'd say at least about 30% of the households have 3 phase power installed, mainly because if you want anything more than 10 kW, they force you to go 3-phase.
All the grid is 3 phase, and some household are only connected to one of the phases.

Although we do have a little more care with our wiring, every household at Europe is required to have a GFCI breaker at the entrance point.

It's a shame that Nissan didn't thought about the Europen market when designing the LEAF's charger, it it could make use of 3-phase power it would have 10 kW available almost everywhere, being single phase, it has 3.6 kW guaranteed at every outlet.

The US may be great at many things, but your electrical grid is not one of them...

Greetings from Portugal, where last year 53% of the total electrical power consumed came from renewable energy sources!

 

[EVDRIVER]

Yes it's dumb here, and we spend more on copper as well. 240 is not a big deal for me, I've had my share of 240V shocks and a direct hit to the face off a 260V pack. I just replaced three switched today on 120V and never turn the power off unless its a mess of wires. I run 240 in my house to isolation transformers that convert to clean 120V for audio equipment, this also allows for a single 4kw circuit on lower gauge wire.

 

[RJSC]

One thing I didn't quite understand is why they let you install a 240V outlet to power HVAC ou a clothes dryer without any inspection and installing a 240V circuit to an EVSE requires license and inspection.
It's the same sort of hazard, and Tesla Roadsters owners were charging from 240V NEMA outlets at home and RV parks and no one was prosecuted. :roll:
Maybe it's just so that AV can charge you those insane amounts of money to install their EVSE...

 

[EVDRIVER]

One thing I didn't quite understand is why they let you install a 240V outlet to power HVAC ou a clothes dryer without any inspection and installing a 240V circuit to an EVSE requires license and inspection.
It's the same sort of hazard, and Tesla Roadsters owners were charging from 240V NEMA outlets at home and RV parks and no one was prosecuted. :roll:
Maybe it's just so that AV can charge you those insane amounts of money to install their EVSE...

Because they want extra protection on the long cord. Dryers are stationary and no cords. It's an extra measure of safety and another key feature in the EVSE is the pilot signal, however they should all be made to plug in, that part is stupid as it gets.

 

[RJSC]

One thing I didn't quite understand is why they let you install a 240V outlet to power HVAC ou a clothes dryer without any inspection and installing a 240V circuit to an EVSE requires license and inspection.
It's the same sort of hazard, and Tesla Roadsters owners were charging from 240V NEMA outlets at home and RV parks and no one was prosecuted. :roll:
Maybe it's just so that AV can charge you those insane amounts of money to install their EVSE...

Because they want extra protection on the long cord. Dryers are stationary and no cords. It's an extra measure of safety and another key feature in the EVSE is the pilot signal, however they should all be made to plug in, that part is stupid as it gets.

I wasn't talking about the cord that plugs in to the car. The signaling is a good thing.
I was talking about the house wiring from the breaker pannel to the EVSE itself.

If you bought a certified EVSE, than you shouldn't need to have an inspection to some house wiring that is the same as your clothes dryer wiring.

Maybe thats about to change now that it seems that portable 240V EVSE's will be allowed.
They had to allow it anyway because Tesla's owners already have a portable 240V EVSE and that shouldn't be a 100.000$ sports car exclusive. :lol:

 

[GeekEV]

I, for one, had my electrician install a 240v NEMA 6-50 outlet and wired a plug to the Nissan/AV EVSE instead of hard wiring it. Neither he, nor the city inspector had any problem with that.

 

[RJSC]

I, for one, had my electrician install a 240v NEMA 6-50 outlet and wired a plug to the Nissan/AV EVSE instead of hard wiring it. Neither he, nor the city inspector had any problem with that.

To me, that's yet another reason why you shouldn't need the inspection. The wiring is not the problem, the EVSE is a self contained UL approved unit, why the inspection? :roll:

 

[garygid]

Normally, all power wiring changes to a home require inspection, no matter what you might plug in. There are some limits by the PUs and cities on what you can plug in (electric kiln). Things hardwired often require inspection of the connection (A/C, pool, etc.).

So, the inspection has very little to do with the EVSE, but a lot to do with the "safety" (conforming to codes and regulations) of the new wiring.

 

[LTLFTcomposite]

One thing I didn't quite understand is why they let you install a 240V outlet to power HVAC ou a clothes dryer without any inspection and installing a 240V circuit to an EVSE requires license and inspection.
It's the same sort of hazard, and Tesla Roadsters owners were charging from 240V NEMA outlets at home and RV parks and no one was prosecuted. :roll:
Maybe it's just so that AV can charge you those insane amounts of money to install their EVSE...

Like Obamacare, it's government deciding for you what's best. Mandatory broccoli purchases are next.

 

[smkettner]

One thing I didn't quite understand is why they let you install a 240V outlet to power HVAC ou a clothes dryer without any inspection and installing a 240V circuit to an EVSE requires license and inspection.
It's the same sort of hazard, and Tesla Roadsters owners were charging from 240V NEMA outlets at home and RV parks and no one was prosecuted. :roll:
Maybe it's just so that AV can charge you those insane amounts of money to install their EVSE...

Air conditioner and clothes dryer circuit additions do require a permit. Not all contractors pull a permit.
Usually these circuits are standard in a newer home and were inspected along with the entire house before the occupancy permit is issued.

I agree many get all wierd when it comes to 240v but it is really no different.

I have long thought the Leaf (and other EVs) should have just had a cord with NEMA 6-20p on the end. The evse is a complete waste IMO but there is no stopping it now.
I think the obsession with an evse comes from trying to replicate the fuel hose of a gasoline car. :roll:

 

[johnr]

Thanks mwalsh for the insides pics! I wonder if that transformer supplies all the power to the circuit board. Quite possibly, substituting that transformer for a 220V::20V unit could be all that's necessary to make it 220V-capable. Such transformers are readily available, how about this one: http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Triad-Magnetics/VPS20-8800/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMv4oUrzpPKU3L%2f5yU3dLXrlN5DCKup8Ab4%3d

Of interest is the fact that the wires coming out from the transformer are fairly heavy-duty. Clearly it powers more than just the signal generator - maybe it powers a contactor or relay too.
Also, an unused 3-pin connector is clearly visible next to the yellow wires that emerge from the vicinity of a radial electrolytic capacitor.

 

[garygid]

The transformer you reference is much larger than the one in the EVSE, I think.

Most likely it is used to create +12v DC and a less powerful -12v DC, which power the logic, the Control Pilot, and the relays.

PROBABLY the 120v is not used or tested elsewhere, but we DO NOT KNOW.

WARNING: Experimenting, as suggested above, can easily "let out the magic smoke" that makes it work.

 

[tps]

I, for one, had my electrician install a 240v NEMA 6-50 outlet and wired a plug to the Nissan/AV EVSE instead of hard wiring it. Neither he, nor the city inspector had any problem with that.

So long as the L2 EVSE is securely fastened to the wall, there should be no problem with a short cable with NEMA plug on the input. The secure fastening is so that if the EV somehow pulls away with the cord attached, the cord will break away cleanly from the EVSE, deenergizing the EVSE before the power conductors separate. They defined it this way since L2 is defined for up to 80A 240V supply.

The L1 EVSE doesn't have to be securely mounted. It will probably pull out of the 120V outlet, breaking the circuit under load if the EV somehow pulled away. I guess the NEC folks decided that, because of the "emergency use" utility of L1 as well as the lower power they could relax the mounting requirements.

 

[Coffee_Slurry]

There is one cheap and readily available 20V power supply that would take anything between 100V and 240V, a generic replacement laptop power supply. Every one of them here in Europe are 100V~240V (and made in China :lol: ), so I think they are the same in the USA.

They're large, and they're DC. The transformer in the EVSE is AC-to-AC.

 

[Smidge204]

One thing I didn't quite understand is why they let you install a 240V outlet to power HVAC ou a clothes dryer without any inspection and installing a 240V circuit to an EVSE requires license and inspection.
It's the same sort of hazard, and Tesla Roadsters owners were charging from 240V NEMA outlets at home and RV parks and no one was prosecuted. :roll:
Maybe it's just so that AV can charge you those insane amounts of money to install their EVSE...

It's in the NEC. The way I interpret it, if the EVSE is listed as a portable unit (as in specifically designed to be carried around) then you're allowed to use an outlet plug. Clothes dryers could technically be considered portable perhaps? Unfortunately the NEC has a section specifically for EVSEs but not dryers.

Contrast to something like an electric stove, which must be hardwired. I think the real distinction is the design and certification of the appliance.

Like Obamacare, it's government deciding for you what's best. Mandatory broccoli purchases are next.

Except the NEC is written and published by the NFPA - a private industry group founded by insurance companies... not the government. But hey it's not like facts ever got in the way of pseudopolitical commentary before, right?
=Smidge=

 

[EVDRIVER]

One thing I didn't quite understand is why they let you install a 240V outlet to power HVAC ou a clothes dryer without any inspection and installing a 240V circuit to an EVSE requires license and inspection.
It's the same sort of hazard, and Tesla Roadsters owners were charging from 240V NEMA outlets at home and RV parks and no one was prosecuted. :roll:
Maybe it's just so that AV can charge you those insane amounts of money to install their EVSE...

Air conditioner and clothes dryer circuit additions do require a permit. Not all contractors pull a permit.
Usually these circuits are standard in a newer home and were inspected along with the entire house before the occupancy permit is issued.

I agree many get all wierd when it comes to 240v but it is really no different.

I have long thought the Leaf (and other EVs) should have just had a cord with NEMA 6-20p on the end. The evse is a complete waste IMO but there is no stopping it now.
I think the obsession with an evse comes from trying to replicate the fuel hose of a gasoline car. :roll:

We have discussed this is detail before. A NEMA 6-20 plug will not last and the outlets at public stations would fall apart regularly, this is not an RV with low cycling. In addition, you need a pilot signal for the various current loads in public charging locations, you can't do that with a NEMA plug. The EVSE is needed for those that charge in public areas.

 

[johnr]

Clothes dryers could technically be considered portable perhaps? Unfortunately the NEC has a section specifically for EVSEs but not dryers.

Contrast to something like an electric stove, which must be hardwired. I think the real distinction is the design and certification of the appliance.

LOL - never considered a clothes dryer to be portable, but then I'm not the NEC either.
My electric stove has a plug. I don't think stoves are required to be hardwired either.
(But then, that topic of course has been beaten to a pulp already.)