Gen 1 GM Volt Plug-In Hybrid (2011-2015)

[evnow]

Ever since GM announced that it would essentially match Nissan's lease deal I have been puzzled as to how they could do that with an MSRP that was more than $8,000 higher. A big part of the explanation came out on gm-volt yesterday. Like Nissan they take the $7,500 off the top, but unlike Nissan they add it back in to the residual value to give a "Contract Residual Value" (i.e. what you have to pay to keep the car) that is more than $25K even for the base trim level.

Wow! Thanks for that clarification. I was kind of curious how they could do it too. For the LEAF, I received a quote for the residual around $15K .

I've to warn here that it is not clear. Nobody on gm-volt was clear on this and none of my questions were answered. So, I'd hold off on what "Contract Residual Value" really meant ....

 

[LEAFer]

By that formula it seems they want to have the cars back in their possession in three years.

Hmmm ... by that "formula" ... it sounds eerily déjà vu ! :roll:

 

[TomT]

If you are not planning to buy out the lease and keep the car at the end, though, it is academic and definitely works in your favor.

Ever since GM announced that it would essentially match Nissan's lease deal I have been puzzled as to how they could do that with an MSRP that was more than $8,000 higher. A big part of the explanation came out on gm-volt yesterday. Like Nissan they take the $7,500 off the top, but unlike Nissan they add it back in to the residual value to give a "Contract Residual Value" (i.e. what you have to pay to keep the car) that is more than $25K even for the base trim level.

 

[garygid]

Do the echos of "Nobody wants our car, so we are CRUSHING them." ring in anybody's ears?

 

[evchels]

I can certainly see how this reads as them really wanting the cars back after 3 years- the same thought occurred to me. But in fairness, they wouldn't have tried to get the payment that low unless they were trying to get them out there in the first place, and knew that the MSRP would be a deal-breaker for many. The way to get the payment down is to raise the residual value, and in a new vehicle like this the residual value is a little arbitrary anyhow given the lack of precedent. We did exactly the same thing on EV1 (yes, even though you couldn't buy the car at the end, we still had to have a residual value) to get the monthly payments we did.

 

[TRONZ]

The Volt could be getting staged for a VERY public slaughter. The top brass at GM have always had a very different agenda than their employees and the American people. Most on the board hate the Volt and hope it can be made into a spectacular failure. It is clear they have taken a "short" position on the Volt program. The fly in the ointment is the LEAF, high demand for EV's and increasing gas prices.

 

[mitch672]

I see the high residual value as GM hedging their bets; most will NOT buy out a lease in 3 years with such a high residual, and if the Volt never really "catches on", they will have far fewer to support after 3 years. I doubt they will crush them, but they may end up recycled anyway, as they are given back to GM after the 3 year lease.

This again calls into question their real commitment to EV's and PHEVs.

 

[evnow]

I see lots of conspiracy theories floating around

Funny thing with life is - things never turn out the same way. Companies learn from PR mistakes - they don't make the same PR mistake again. That ofcourse doesn't preclude something we haven't thought of yet ...

 

[smkettner]

The low lease allows profit and executive bonus to continue. Then GM can write down the take back inventory in three years. These dliberate swings in profit allow for a depressed stock so at the time of reduced bonus the executives can get favorable stock incentives awarded instead. Writing down the excessive R&D at the same time should really give a pop to the downside to take advantage of.

 

[lne937s]

Ever since GM announced that it would essentially match Nissan's lease deal I have been puzzled as to how they could do that with an MSRP that was more than $8,000 higher. A big part of the explanation came out on gm-volt yesterday. Like Nissan they take the $7,500 off the top, but unlike Nissan they add it back in to the residual value to give a "Contract Residual Value" (i.e. what you have to pay to keep the car) that is more than $25K even for the base trim level.

There are also differences in the leases. Volt requires $500 more up front. Volt is a 12,000 mile lease (which kind of undermines its range argument), whereas LEAF is 15,000. Volt has more options that can be tacked on and is less likely to sell as the base model, due to the differences in buying process (options tend to be tacked on to lease price). And it doesn't include dealer markup. If you were to get a comparable lease (same down, same mileage) on typically equipted model, you will pay more than the advertised lease price for the Volt. I would figure around $500/mo.

 

[garygid]

I think GM is committed to making it look like they tried.

 

[AndyH]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3hn6fFTxeo[/youtube]

 

[baltobernie]

I drove a Volt the other day; only a few miles, and under battery power only. Some impressions:

For the life of me, I don't see the market for the Volt. With only 35 miles available on electric drive, what's the point? One of the two "evaluation drivers" who've had Volts for 6 weeks bragged how he's only used 2 gallons of gasoline in that time. Well, I have a vintage car, and I can authoritatively state that 10% ethanol gasoline should not be kept more than 60 days without Sta-Bil or other treatment. Of course, the Volt "exercises" the gasoline engine occasionally if you don't otherwise trip it into use, but I don't think that's enough. I think they should run an algorithm to determine one's driving style, and run the gas engine enough to consume the tank in 60 days, regardless. Nine gallon tank won't get used up in 60 days if the typical route is all- or mostly-battery.

Other impressions: Plenty of zip in Sport mode. Easily capable of Beltway entrances without endangering yourself or other drivers. Braking was only "Fair". Some confusion in the computer whether to use regen, hydraulic, or both. Car creeps at "idle" ... why? Maybe a "safety" issue, they want drivers to always have a foot on the brake. I think it's dumb. Why waste juice pushing the car against the brake when stopped? Doors don't open much past 60°, so ingress and egress is not great. And it's a small car. If the Leaf is this size, I may not get it. The center stack must be 20" wide, so driver and passenger knee room is poor. Conventional shift lever buried in this enormous stack. Of course, with an 111kW motor, generator, 12v battery, LiOn battery pack and 4-cyl ICE engine (and radiator, catalyst, exhaust system, etc.) they've got to put all this stuff somewhere. Just doesn't make sense when you look at it; dragging all this stuff around to get about the same mileage as a Cobalt, at twice the price?

I'm calling the Volt "the SUV of hybrid cars" because it tries to do all things for all drivers, and ends up doing nothing particularly well.

Halogen headlights; obviously they're not concerned with energy consumption. Regular Goodyear tires; nothing weird or unobtainable. Did not drive far enough to engage the gas engine. Two TV commercials shown, and Chevy is pushing "car", not "electric". "Freedom to Roam" and all that.

Charging port near drivers o/s mirror in an inconvenient spot, as pointed out earlier.

One useful Leaf competitive info: I publicly asked what the failure mode was for the battery pack, and was told 70%. Let's hope that Nissan uses that figure (or better).

I'm a member of the Washington Automotive Press Association. This was a WAPA event, not open to the public.

 

[cdub]

Car creeps at "idle" ... why?

So does the LEAF. Nissan did it to mimic the way an automatic transmission works. I'm sure it's the same here. But in the LEAF it doesn't push the car forward until you release the brake.

 

[Coffee_Slurry]

My theory is that they don't do this to simulate an automatic, even though they'll probably say that.

They need some amount of "pre-tension" stress on the driveline for when you whack the accelerator. The mild pull when you release the brake takes the slack out of the geartrain lash and reduces the stress of starting.

I intend to sit and play with the brake a bit.. I suspect that when you are full-stop locked brakes, it's NOT actually, really, pulling. The motor is probably not applying any force at all. When you release the brake pressure, it might start in then. I'm curious to see how this really works. I wonder if you can tell from the kW consumption?

 

[evnow]

For the life of me, I don't see the market for the Volt. With only 35 miles available on electric drive, what's the point?

You can greatly reduce oil consumption. That is the point.

 

[Train]

For most people, this car would provide electric propulsion for most work commutes and most daly driving. It would also have the flexibity of a longer drive without the need to plug in to charge immediately.

I see the Volt as a very viable option.

 

[AndyH]

For the life of me, I don't see the market for the Volt. With only 35 miles available on electric drive, what's the point?

You can greatly reduce oil consumption. That is the point.

I can do that by walking!

 

[ERG4ALL]

Have you seen the latest commercial for the Volt? At the end when it is shown to be hooked up to a plain old wall outlet the voice over says that "the Volt is more than a LEAF blower". I must admit it made me laugh.

 

[evnow]

I can do that by walking!

Yes - and also by biking or using public transport. But they aren't practical for everyone.