Capacity Loss on 2011-2012 LEAFs

[Wennfred]

C: 41.51 H: 42.0

Took Leaf in today to Mossy Nissan in Chula Vista. They ran the test. Nissan approved the Battery replacement.. Approx wait time is 4 to 6 weeks. They will keep the ticket open as the warranty expires in March. Also they have another leaf right now in the back getting a battery installed.

4 to 6 weeks out, hopefully sooner.

* I always charge to 100%

Fred

 

[redLEAF]

I can't imagine any Nissan dealer has not done a battery swap yet.

I'd be very surprised if my NH dealer has. They still seem a bit befuddled by the annual battery check.

Or IL for that matter either ... of course the first few model year '12 LEAF's were delivered here in the late November, early December of 2011 time frame so most of the early ones have just recently passed their 4 year anniversary. Never asked how many LEAF's my particular dealer sold but at my 4 year battery check up this past December he had NOT yet had anyone in for a replacement battery --- my car sits at just under 37K miles and only a single bar lost so quite doubtful if I'll get a new one under this warranty; we do have a few owners in Chicagoland with higher miles so we'll see ...

 

[twingo]

Fred,
I also live in the area - Escondido - and have had a 2011 Leaf since May of 2011 with 48K and it just lost the 4th bar a few days ago. Almost identical to your situation. I charged to 80% for the first 4 years and then switched to 100% when the range declined. I am ignorant about replacing the battery but have started to think about it since I can only go about 44 miles now. Am I eligible for a replacement under warranty? How much will it cost me? Can I instead get a discounted 30KwH version?

Any info is much appreciated.

 

[arnis]

Delivery Date: 07 May 2011

You literally have 2 weeks to visit any Nissan dealer to verify that you lost the 4th bar.
If you do it you will get a new battery absolutely free of charge.
If you won't make it you will never receive battery replacement. Ever. New battery will cost you 6000-8000$.
As soon as they verify that you are eligible for battery replacement take your time.
It will take some weeks until new battery arrives.

No you can not swap to 30kWh version.

Thanks for information about charging.
When did you start charging to 100%?
Before you began to end with low battery warning
when you arrived between low and very low
or after you got to very low too often?

California average temperatures:
http://pics2.city-data.com/w1q/lhaq1918.png

San Diego average temperatures:
http://pics2.city-data.com/w1q/lhaq2447.png

Therefore charging to 100% instead of 80% wears down battery as 10F extra degrees would do.

Was Leaf parked in sun or in shade during midday? Both of you!
Excellent data to analyze.

 

[twingo]

I had a dealer appointment for service a few weeks ago, but had to work instead and cancelled. I'd better get back there.

I don't have the exact date I switched from 80% to 100%, but it was very close to the 4-year mark, so I've been charging continuously at the 100% level now for about 9 months. I switched because I was ending the day at low too often. My definition of low is less than 10 miles left.

During the week, my car is parked in the full sun every day at work and has since I took delivery.

 

[Evoforce]

Fred,
I also live in the area - Escondido - and have had a 2011 Leaf since May of 2011 with 48K and it just lost the 4th bar a few days ago. Almost identical to your situation. I charged to 80% for the first 4 years and then switched to 100% when the range declined. I am ignorant about replacing the battery but have started to think about it since I can only go about 44 miles now. Am I eligible for a replacement under warranty? How much will it cost me? Can I instead get a discounted 30KwH version?

Any info is much appreciated.

Yes, get it to the dealer soon. You said you got your car in May. If that is your (in service Date) you have until May, not 2 weeks.

 

[davewill]

Congratulations!

Indeed!

I can't think of any other car where people actually celebrate the failure of a major component within the warranty period :lol:

I was pretty happy when my Prius' battery gave up the ghost at 128k miles. I hope to get to 300k now.

 

[Bufordleaf]

With new battery start charging to 80% (and avoid getting VLBW, it is better to go over 80% than below very low).
This should prolong life. So you can expect it will last longer than 50 000 miles (70%SOH limit).

I thought most people agreed now that charging to 80% (instead of 100%) had little if any impact on degredation? I'm no Leaf battery expert but that was my interpretation of what I have read on this forum and other online sources. So I'm asking, is there a measurable benefit to the 80% charge?

 

[dhanson865]

With new battery start charging to 80% (and avoid getting VLBW, it is better to go over 80% than below very low).
This should prolong life. So you can expect it will last longer than 50 000 miles (70%SOH limit).

I thought most people agreed now that charging to 80% (instead of 100%) had little if any impact on degradation? I'm no Leaf battery expert but that was my interpretation of what I have read on this forum and other online sources. So I'm asking, is there a measurable benefit to the 80% charge?

They do agree it has little affect, but Arnis has refused to read any of the old threads I've linked to that discuss that. He seems to prefer to spout theoretical knowledge and ignore actual observed data specific to the Nissan leaf as used here in the US.

The reality is temperature and time are the primary two factors and SOC% doesn't matter much at all in hot climates. It's certainly a measurable factor but in practice it's swamped by the heat factor.

 

[LeftieBiker]

Charging to 80% when the car is going to sit for days undriven is still better than charging to 100% and leaving it. This is true for pretty much all lithium batteries - it isn't Leaf-specific.

 

[cwerdna]

Indeed!

I can't think of any other car where people actually celebrate the failure of a major component within the warranty period :lol:

I was pretty happy when my Prius' battery gave up the ghost at 128k miles. I hope to get to 300k now.

Heh. Yeah, that can happen for Prius batteries in hot climates and/or w/hilly commutes.

Unfortunately, my 06 Prius just semi-recently passed the 10 year mark, so the 10 year/150K mile HV battery warranty is over.

 

[arnis]

Charging to 80% when the car is going to sit for days undriven is still better than charging to 100% and leaving it. This is true for pretty much all lithium batteries - it isn't Leaf-specific.

Exactly.

Plus we have two 2011 Leafs here with slightly different average climate temperature, same mileage.
One always charged to 100% and another one stayed at 80% for as long as recommended.
Few days before running out of warranty they both lost 4th bar.
100% charged Leaf degraded as fast as 80% Leaf in more moderate climate (10F difference mostly).
Can't we draw any conclusions out of that :roll:

Also I should mention again that calendar aging happens faster at higher temperatures.
And this is not only lithium battery specific, this is not even battery specific.
Therefore in cold weather difference between 80% and 100% is not that noticeable as in this topic.


Also owners should not assume they get 2016 brand new lizard pack if eligible for swap on 2011 Leaf.
Nissan did not promise that. They did not even promise brand new pack though mostly they are.
Connector on the battery does not tell what's inside.

 

[keydiver]

Nissan approved the Battery replacement.. Approx wait time is 4 to 6 weeks.

When I was approved last month for a new battery, they were told "6-8 weeks" to get one in for me. But, they called earlier this week and it was in already, just a hair over 3 weeks! I dropped my Leaf off this afternoon for replacement next week while I am out of town.

 

[Wennfred]

Awesome, call 1-800-NO-GAS-EV and Nissan will check your warranty status and also transfer you over to the Nissan dealership of your choice.

I will always charge to 100% and do DCQC if needed, I prefer to use the Leafs full potential and drive at 65 mph.

Seems like the 4th bar is constant in San Diego with our nice climate weather. The lizard packs should go further.

I am still getting 177 GIDS and I am still able to make my round trip to work and back with some good hills with around 53 miles. My commute is 42 miles round trip @ 60mph average.

Will keep you posted.

Fred

 

[Evoforce]

Awesome, call 1-800-NO-GAS-EV and Nissan will check your warranty status and also transfer you over to the Nissan dealership of your choice.

I will always charge to 100% and do DCQC if needed, I prefer to use the Leafs full potential and drive at 65 mph.

Seems like the 4th bar is constant in San Diego with our nice climate weather. The lizard packs should go further.

I am still getting 177 GIDS and I am still able to make my round trip to work and back with some good hills with around 53 miles. My commute is 42 miles round trip @ 60mph average.

Will keep you posted.

Fred

I'm glad you qualified and got it sooner than what we had to wait (6weeks). As far as it lasting longer (lizard) that Wennfred suggests, don't count on it. IMO it will last as long (or short) as the last one but you will enjoy the new one!

 

[DiamondDan73]

Well it finally happened! I started up my Leaf this morning and my 9th bar was nowhere to be found. On February 14th I dropped below 42.50 AHr and dropped every single day. I already did the P3227 update so I should be good to go when I go the the dealer on Monday.

 

[Evoforce]

5 months and about 3 weeks. You will enjoy your new one. Post all of your numbers for the day of the drop. Glad you qualify!

 

[DiamondDan73]

Thanks I can wait!!!!

Here are the numbers:
Odometer 47,973
AHr 43.30
SOH 66%
Hx 44.91
390.23v
Max GIDs 184

 

[DiamondDan73]

I went to Empire Nissan of Ontario and got my battery check. The whole thing took about 20 minutes. Everything was A-Okay. They said I should get a call in about six weeks so they can install my new battery.

 

[Stanton]

They said I should get a call in about six weeks so they can install my new battery.

Looks like the wait times for new packs are getting longer and longer (mine was ~4 weeks). Imagine what it will be like when everyone starts dropping their bars this summer.
Congrats and enjoy your free battery (I know I do)!