2012 Leaf 4BL replacement vs remaining battery at 100%.

[fooljoe]

Loss of the 12th capacity bar represents approximately 15% degradation, while each subsequent bar is supposed to be roughly 6.25%. 17 kWh available after a full charge is very much in the expected range for an 11 bar car.

 

[BrianX]

If 21.5 is considered full then 15% is 18.275 kwh and the next bar would be 16.93 kwh. You may be right soon.

 

[fooljoe]

If 21.5 is considered full then 15% is 18.275 kwh and the next bar would be 16.93 kwh. You may be right soon.

Except that the bar loss doesn't happen exactly at the "published" 15%, 21.25%, 27.5%, 33.75%, ... thresholds - there's some mysterious delay before it drops. So you might be at something like 16.5 kWh before you get to 10 bars.

 

[GerryAZ]

Part of the problem is I baby the car. I get 4.5 miles per kwh. I may start charging at work and home. I have 14 months left to 5yr 60k. Im just not getting the range I used to and will be forced to charge at work. Daily commute < 50 miles.

With only 1 capacity bar loss (2nd bar loss may be soon) and averaging 4.5 mi/kWh, you should have no problem making your 50-mile commute. As others have already noted, there is a significant portion of charge still available when you get the low battery warning (LBW) and several miles of range still available when you get the very low battery warning (VLBW).

My commute is 52 miles round trip (mostly freeway) and I typically average 3.9 or 4.0 mi/kWh (on the display in front of the steering wheel). I had no trouble making my round trip commute when my 2011 was down to 8 capacity bars before Nissan replaced the battery. I would hit VLBW 2 to 5 miles from home, but I always made it and always kept the car comfortably cool with A/C. I could not let the heat run in cold weather once it was down to 10 capacity bars and it lost most regeneration. I recommend that you get the P3227 software update performed if it has not already been done. I had the update done after the battery was down to 8 capacity bars because the dashboard instrumentation (and CAN bus information available to Leaf Spy) became very erratic. The update greatly improved the accuracy of the instrumentation and CAN bus data, but it did not change the amount of energy the battery could store. Here is some data for energy from the wall (L2 charging at 240 volts nominal, measured with revenue accuracy meter) from shutdown to full charge:
18.29 kWh at 27190 miles on 8/8/2013 (173 Gids, 40.06 AHr)
Software update (P3227) at 27201 miles on 8/9/2013
18.68 kWh at 27277 miles on 8/9/2013 (209 Gids, 48.50 AHr after charging)
17.73 kWh at 29265 miles on 10/2/2013 (193 Gids, 44.67 AHr after charging)
18.22 kWh at 29357 miles on 10/3/2013 (194 Gids, 44.79 AHr after charging)
Battery replaced at 29370 miles on 10/4/2013 (65.60 AHr immediately after picking up car from dealer)
24.96 kWh at 29427 miles on 10/4/2013 (266 Gids, 62.10 AHr after charging)
24.66 kWh at 29507 miles on 10/5/2013 (268 Gids, 62.52 AHr after charging)

Gerry

 

[BrianX]

Thanks for the data.

I am going to try to improve driving efficiency. Today I was able to hit 5.0 miles per kWh.

I agree I was leaving more energy than I thought in the last two bars but I didn't expect to only have 17.0 kwh left this early. The warning for me was how fast the charging time has become. I still have an open case with Nissan about this. I think I stumped him a bit because he can't explain it and only wants to talk bars and miles.

Regardless who pays I would not replace my battery yet but I can tell it will need to be done before 8 years. I think my strategy will be to replace it and fight for some compensation through BBB or small claims. When I bought my car Nissan did not have a separate degredation warranty so it will be easy to say "Why did I have to buy a new battery if it was covered under warranty?". Realistically if they paid 50-75% of replacement that would be fair.

At this point even more efficient use of the battery is the answer. Tire pressure, cruise control, pre heat and cool on the charger, ECO city, D on highway, etc.

 

[BrianX]

Nissan scheduled an appointment for me to meet a regional technical specialist. We'll see.

 

[Tyger]

Thanks for the data.

I am going to try to improve driving efficiency. Today I was able to hit 5.0 miles per kWh.

I agree I was leaving more energy than I thought in the last two bars but I didn't expect to only have 17.0 kwh left this early. The warning for me was how fast the charging time has become. I still have an open case with Nissan about this. I think I stumped him a bit because he can't explain it and only wants to talk bars and miles.

Regardless who pays I would not replace my battery yet but I can tell it will need to be done before 8 years. I think my strategy will be to replace it and fight for some compensation through BBB or small claims. When I bought my car Nissan did not have a separate degredation warranty so it will be easy to say "Why did I have to buy a new battery if it was covered under warranty?". Realistically if they paid 50-75% of replacement that would be fair.

At this point even more efficient use of the battery is the answer. Tire pressure, cruise control, pre heat and cool on the charger, ECO city, D on highway, etc.

Does D on highway really make a difference? I just leave it eco the whole time (Well, B/eco on 2015MY). As I understand it, eco effects the pedal response curve (IE you push further to get more power) and regen response; but if you've got cruise control set, or are otherwise going a constant speed, it doesn't matter what mode you're going. It's only the accel/decel that eco vs D changes. Am I wrong?

 

[GetOffYourGas]

Thanks for the data.

I am going to try to improve driving efficiency. Today I was able to hit 5.0 miles per kWh.

I agree I was leaving more energy than I thought in the last two bars but I didn't expect to only have 17.0 kwh left this early. The warning for me was how fast the charging time has become. I still have an open case with Nissan about this. I think I stumped him a bit because he can't explain it and only wants to talk bars and miles.

Regardless who pays I would not replace my battery yet but I can tell it will need to be done before 8 years. I think my strategy will be to replace it and fight for some compensation through BBB or small claims. When I bought my car Nissan did not have a separate degredation warranty so it will be easy to say "Why did I have to buy a new battery if it was covered under warranty?". Realistically if they paid 50-75% of replacement that would be fair.

At this point even more efficient use of the battery is the answer. Tire pressure, cruise control, pre heat and cool on the charger, ECO city, D on highway, etc.

Does D on highway really make a difference? I just leave it eco the whole time (Well, B/eco on 2015MY). As I understand it, eco effects the pedal response curve (IE you push further to get more power) and regen response; but if you've got cruise control set, or are otherwise going a constant speed, it doesn't matter what mode you're going. It's only the accel/decel that eco vs D changes. Am I wrong?

That's my understanding too. I personally find it easy to coast in either ECO or D. What's more, ECO also tones down the heater, so I drive almost exclusively in ECO for at least 5 months of the year when the kids need heat.