derkraut
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 6:59 am

Very interesting; THANKS for sharing! :) 8-)
Derkraut
Color: Cayenne SLE, ETEC trim
reserved: 5/15/2010
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Skywagon
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 7:20 am

I took some quick photos in my parking spot at work once the sun came up this morning. If the tire sidewalls were stiffer, and not so protruding past the wheel edge, then they would be completely flush. You can see that the tread is plenty flush to clear the fender lip if the car was lowered. Of course, the offsets I used for these particular wheels would not be the same if different wheels were selected. They are not the most desirable as far as spoke position vs. offset but they work just fine and are some of the lightest wheels around in this size (10.5 lbs each).

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You can see in this photo that only the sidewall protrudes past the top edge of the fender just a little, stiffer/flatter sidewalls would not protrude at all:
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Nader, you can see that they don stick out as one would think. The fenders on the LEAF are such that I can get by with this offset. Again, had it not been for such extremely light wheels, I would have chosen a different wheel design to run a little larger offset. At least that was my thoughts originally... after seeing them on the car now I am very happy with my choice. I am wanting to lower the car 1.5" or so, just enough to not affect camber too much and help cut down on the fender gap. The concept versions of the LEAF were about that low and I would just like to match that ride height/wheel gap:

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IBELEAF
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 7:24 am

I have doubts that shaving off 40 pounds will have any noticeable benefit which is 0.02% weight difference from the overall car weight, but the wheels do look nice.
Currently: '12 Volt (12k) since 7/2012
Previously: '11 Leaf SL (w/ 12k miles & 16 month ownership)

greenleaf
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 7:32 am

IBELEAF wrote:I have doubts that shaving off 40 pounds will have any noticeable benefit which is 0.02% weight difference from the overall car weight, but the wheels do look nice.
The wheels on a moving car have both linear momentum and angular momentum (more energy needed to accelerate). So saving 40 pounds off the wheels will provide more benefit than say lightening 40 pounds from trunk. The question of "how much better" is harder to quantify though.
2011 Leaf: reserved 4/2010, delivered 3/2011 (VIN 9XX), sold 2/2014.
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Skywagon
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 7:43 am

IBELEAF wrote:I have doubts that shaving off 40 pounds will have any noticeable benefit which is 0.02% weight difference from the overall car weight, but the wheels do look nice.
You cannot group sprung and unsprung (rotating inertial) masses into the same category for looking at it from an efficiency standpoint. Inertia directly effects the torque required to get a wheel moving; the power required to get the car moving. Dropping the inertia for each wheel can help with this. If someone cruises on the freeway all the time then there is less of a gain to be had. I am mainly a city driver, and do experience stop and go traffic daily, so each restart will require less power to get the car accelerated to speed, therefore, will help a little with range. The same can also be said for why you would not want to go with the same weight in a larger diameter wheel. The majority of the mass is in the rim and moving it outwards from the axle centerline only increases the inertia of that particular wheel over a smaller diameter one. I am expecting a 5-8% gain in efficiency/range, which is not a lot, but every little bit helps.

And like greenleaf said, it will be difficult to put an exact value on the gain. I will just look at range trends over time to see a shift from the consistent numbers I have been seeing with the car.

My LEAF rolled over 3000 miles exactly as I was pulling it in my shop to pull the wheels to get them swapped over... that was kind of cool.

And thanks, the look is another benefit.

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TomT
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 9:56 am

However, unlike an ICE car, it should also be pointed out that you get some of that energy input from heavier wheels back in the form of regenerative braking...

greenleaf wrote: The wheels on a moving car have both linear momentum and angular momentum (more energy needed to accelerate). So saving 40 pounds off the wheels will provide more benefit than say lightening 40 pounds from trunk. The question of "how much better" is harder to quantify though.
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davewill
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:03 am

mogur wrote:However, unlike an ICE car, it should also be pointed out that you get some of that energy input from heavier wheels back in the form of regenerative braking...
Sure, but better to never have to spin that larger mass up in the first place since you can never get it all back.
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DaveEV
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:08 pm

Thanks for all the pics. The production Leaf is definitely riding a good deal higher than the concept car where the stance looks so much better, IMO.

I would have preferred to keep the wheels closer to the stock offset - but as you said - the wheels were a very good deal! I have to wonder if having them stick out a bit more will affect aero noticeably. Would be interesting to compare the track with the stock wheels with similar pics.

How are you planning on lowering the car? Ground-control sleeves? Or are you going to try to get someone to make a replacement spring? Either way, I'm definitely interested once I get my Leaf.

The Miata looks great, BTW! What suspension bits are you running on that?

Cutting 40 lbs from the wheels is HUGE. I'd bet that some Nissan engineer has numbers somewhere on how wheel weight affects range of the Leaf under various test cycles...

IBELEAF
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:16 pm

When I replaced stock wheels with bigger and heavier ones on my ICE car I did not notice any change and even if there was it was quite small to notice, but the price you pay for a new set of rims and tires is unlikely to pay off soon... So I am sure Nissan Engineers weighted every combination with wheels and did not see any benefit going with something lighter...
Currently: '12 Volt (12k) since 7/2012
Previously: '11 Leaf SL (w/ 12k miles & 16 month ownership)

nader
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Re: Forged Rays Volk Wheels installed - stock wheels are HEAVY!

Fri Apr 01, 2011 2:35 pm

Skywagon wrote:
Image
Thanks for the pics. What's the strategy for camber adjustments in the rear since it's a twist axle? Is there a camber plate you can use to shim the spindle?

The photo of the preproduction leaf looks like it has 17" wheels ont just a lower stance.

Nader

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