Research Data on 2011-2015 Leaf Range/ Battery Health

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liz333

New member
Joined
Feb 5, 2021
Messages
4
Hi All,

I’m Liz, an atmospheric scientist who is working with folks at a new company in Seattle, Recurrent, with a goal of helping electric vehicle (EV) buyers understand the battery health and range of used electric cars (www.recurrentauto.com). We are developing machine learning algorithms to predict future battery life and range across all major EV models.

Here’s where I need your help. At the moment, over 2500 EV drivers and enthusiasts have volunteered to (anonymously!) share their battery health and range data, but we are lacking data from older Leaf models (2011-2015) because there is no way to remotely collect info.

If you have a Leaf with a 24 kWh battery (model years 2011-2015, including some 2016’s) and want to share some data to help us ground-truth our range estimates then you’ll be first on the list to get member battery reports when we start supporting them for these model years.

If you’re interested in sharing data, please charge your car to 100% and then record/take photos of the following data and send to [email protected]:

  • Date/time of observation
  • Zipcode where you most frequently drive or park (this is to pull weather data)
  • Model year and trim of your Leaf (trim options: S, SL, SV)
  • Photo of the dashboard showing the current range estimate at 100% state of charge and the odometer reading
  • It would be useful if you can take this dashboard photo on the screen that also shows your recent energy efficiency in miles/kWh. If you’re on that screen then one photo includes all three of these data points.
  • Optional but very helpful: manufacture date (you can find this as the “DATE:” field in the sticker in the driver-side door jamb). If it is easiest to just send us a photo of this sticker that works.
  • State of Health (SOH) as reported by Leafspy. A photo/screenshot of the first page of your LeafSpy app that shows the SOH is acceptable for this, or if you want to share the entire CSV file, that's cool, too.

Again, please send data to [email protected].

I am happy to answer and questions about how we use the data or our company. If you want a referral link to sign up newer EVs, comment below!

Thanks!
 
Having owned a 2011 SL, 2015 SL, and now a 2019 SL+ (all purchased new without sitting on dealer lots), I can say that the dashboard range estimate at full charge is not accurate enough to provide meaningful data. I can also say that the original battery in the 2011 lost useable capacity much faster than the 2015. It is too soon to know for sure, but the 2019 appears to be maintaining useable capacity better than the 2015.
 
Photo of the dashboard showing the current range estimate at 100% state of charge and the odometer reading

Gerry is right, and he's understating it. The 'Guess O Meter' as it's called, is utterly worthless as a means of showing battery capacity, or even state of charge, as it just extrapolates from the last few minutes of driving. That can range from 'cruising the neighborhood at 10MPH' to "Finally lost those cops!"
 
Liz,
You may know this but the '11 and '12 model year Leafs lack the SOC% meter and as the battery degrades as mine is, even fully charged the battery never makes it up to 100%, mine stops at anywhere near 89-92%. Note you can get(and I do) get SOC% from add-on devices like a LeafDD or Leafspy and an OBDII adapter but you won't get SOC% from the factory and most people probably don't have aftermarket devices to get it.
Also, the efficiency reading can vary quite a bit as some people might reset it frequently(say in the winter when you might get a low number) and others may never reset it, so summer and winter readings get all averaged out.
Lastly, your wanting SOH, this requires Leafspy or again something like LeafDD, do you only want responses from people that can provide that number?
 
liz333 said:
[*]Photo of the dashboard showing the current range estimate at 100% state of charge and the odometer reading
[*]It would be useful if you can take this dashboard photo on the screen that also shows your recent energy efficiency in miles/kWh. If you’re on that screen then one photo includes all three of these data points.
Just before I sold my 2013 I had day where the GOM said 140 miles and I'd gamed my avg efficiency to show 15mi/kWh. I should have saved a picture of that.
 
@JJeff - I'm happy to get any and all data, even if you don't have LeafSpy or the like. Any observational stats are helpful. I'll ask about and confirm the 100% SoC part - thanks for the very clear explanation of what you experience with your battery.

I hear what everyone is saying about the on-board range being quite unreliable - we'd still be interested in the data because ultimately we hope to understand the on-board bias and correct for it, but I'm also interested in anecdotal methods for range estimates!
 
jlv said:
liz333 said:
[*]Photo of the dashboard showing the current range estimate at 100% state of charge and the odometer reading
[*]It would be useful if you can take this dashboard photo on the screen that also shows your recent energy efficiency in miles/kWh. If you’re on that screen then one photo includes all three of these data points.
Just before I sold my 2013 I had day where the GOM said 140 miles and I'd gamed my avg efficiency to show 15mi/kWh. I should have saved a picture of that.

wow :eek:
 
liz333 said:
jlv said:
Just before I sold my 2013 I had day where the GOM said 140 miles and I'd gamed my avg efficiency to show 15mi/kWh. I should have saved a picture of that.

wow :eek:
I should have added: my real world range was 65 miles (summer; 55 miles winter) and my normal efficiency near the end was 4.1mi/kWh.

The things you are asking for as data inputs are not necessarily useful metrics.
 
liz333 said:
ultimately we hope to understand the on-board bias and correct for it,
Not going to happen. The bias occurs because the read-out is heavily weighted towards most recent fuel consumption rate. E.g., I live about 1000 feet higher than our usual destinations. The return drive home has triple the Wh/mile than the drive away from home. The range meter does not come anywhere close to the average complete trip consumption; it reflects the drive home.

I am happy to share data* with you, but I respectfully suggest you reconsider your methods or suffer Dante's version of Stats hell.

Good luck !

*
2013 LEAF
Complete zip code history
~ Monthly Leafspy readings in Google Sheets for past 4 years that includes SOH, Ahr, Hx and battery temperature
Leafspy screen captures for every data collection point
 
Liz,

I could share data from Leaf Spy that I recorded while driving my 2011 and 2015, but the data is old. I am also very concerned about conclusions/observations you will make based upon the data you will receive by asking drivers for dashboard information. I know how much the estimated range number varies (although the 2011 was somewhat accurate after the last software update). As others already noted, the 2011 and 2012 models did not have percentage display for state of charge (and the 12 bar graphical display of charge level accuracy changed when software was updated two or three times). I found the estimated range number to be quite optimistic on the 2015 at full charge (was disappointed that it was not as accurate as the 2011). The 2019 is also very optimistic at full charge and gets somewhat more accurate by the time the battery is down to 50% SOC.
 
GerryAZ said:
Liz,

I could share data from Leaf Spy that I recorded while driving my 2011 and 2015, but the data is old. I am also very concerned about conclusions/observations you will make based upon the data you will receive by asking drivers for dashboard information. I know how much the estimated range number varies (although the 2011 was somewhat accurate after the last software update). As others already noted, the 2011 and 2012 models did not have percentage display for state of charge (and the 12 bar graphical display of charge level accuracy changed when software was updated two or three times). I found the estimated range number to be quite optimistic on the 2015 at full charge (was disappointed that it was not as accurate as the 2011). The 2019 is also very optimistic at full charge and gets somewhat more accurate by the time the battery is down to 50% SOC.

I definitely hear your concerns about accuracy (echoed by all the replies to this thread) and just had a long chat with our data science team about it (one of whom owns an older leaf, in fact). It sounds like GoM inaccuracies notwithstanding, the data is still useful in terms of understanding battery degradation with time/use.

In short, please do send over the old data at your convenience. It will be used only with heavy caveats and understanding of its limitations: [email protected]

I'll update with any interesting findings if and when we have them.
 
jlv said:
liz333 said:
It sounds like GoM inaccuracies notwithstanding, the data is still useful in terms of understanding battery degradation with time/use.
:cry:
This is my reaction also.
I think I'll send her the LeafSpy data and screenshots but I'm not going to send any GOM garbage
 
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