Enphase field MTBF: M190: ~36 Years M215: ~316 Years M250: >357 Years

[RegGuheert]

Your note says that I report a failure in January 2015. I think the failure was actually August 2014. I tried looking it up, but my contractor removed the old microinverter from the list and I'm having a hard time figuring out exactly when it happened.

Fixed.

Others have tried to come up with a way to clear snow off the panels, but it just isn't worth it to me.

I try to clear mine, but the climate is much different here. We often get above freezing during the day, so if I can get even a portion of the panel showing, the rest will typically either melt or shed.

I get the impression your roof is fairly flat. Do you know the tilt angle (elevation) of your array? (If not, you can easily measure it using an iPad or iPhone or Android by using a clinometer app.)

 

[GetOffYourGas]

My house is a split-level, so the roof is in fact flatter than most. The elevation angle is only 19 degrees - ideally this angle would be your latitude, which for me is 44.5 degrees. The plus side is that at 160 degrees Az, it's only 20 degrees off from due south.

Regarding snow, Syracuse NY is the snowiest city (over 100,000 people) in the US. Our average snowfall is just under 10'/year. A few years back, we got nearly 15' (178")! All thanks to the Lake Effect. Basically, the prevailing western wind picks up moisture from the Great Lakes (all 5 of which are upwind of us) and dumps it on us daily. During the months of December-February, snow falls literally almost every day. There is no thaw in between, so I feel that cleaning off panels around here (even though mounted on the ground) is just futile.

 

[pclifton]

How about a round of reports on failures/non-failures out in the field? If we get enough reports with no M215 failures, the MTBF for those units should go beyond 1000 years!

RegGuheert,

Another M190 failed yesterday. This one was strange. It was reporting "DC Power Too Low." I suspected a failed Sharp 235w PV module, but that was not the case. Swapping the DC leads to another PV module did nothing for the inverter. A quick measurement with the DVM showed the PV Module producing 32.3 Volts.

I called Enphase today. They tried to get the inverter to take a last chance firmware update, but it refused the update. At least that got the RMA process started during the same phone call.

Ken Clifton

 

[RegGuheert]

RegGuheert,

Another M190 failed yesterday. This one was strange. It was reporting "DC Power Too Low." I suspected a failed Sharp 235w PV module, but that was not the case. Swapping the DC leads to another PV module did nothing for the inverter. A quick measurement with the DVM showed the PV Module producing 32.3 Volts.

I called Enphase today. They tried to get the inverter to take a last chance firmware update, but it refused the update. At least that got the RMA process started during the same phone call.

Ken Clifton

Thanks, Ken. I have updated your M190 entry. I also took the liberty of updating the M250 entry to indicate no failures. Please let me know if that is correct.

 

[pclifton]

I also took the liberty of updating the M250 entry to indicate no failures

Correct. No failures on the seven M215s, and no failures on the twelve M250s. Of course none yet on the one M190-IG replacement that was installed either.

Ken Clifton

 

[Nekota]

The system for M215 with 20 inverters in Sunnyvale has no failures to report.

I have a spreadsheet with the monthly outputs of each of the panels. I will link the sheet here so anyone with the link can view. It's an excel spreadsheet and the google docs doesn't show the embedded graphs very well. So download into excel to see a the monthly performance data. I have one panel/inverter ending in 419 that is showing more decline than it's adjacent panels. This system has some shading in the winter months so that also contributes to panel differences. I compare the panel outputs for each month so there are 12 comparison graphs showing the year to year performance for each of the 20 panels.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/16MX4a20GUNLaXkDfNGvOF_bu-5PIJxc1W-AuBd0aZNo/edit?usp=sharing

 

[TonyWilliams]

Interestingly, most of the M190 microinverters...
So, here are some current MTBFs for members here (only counting replacements, not limp-along firmware);

M190s:
Tony Williams: over 114 years (No failures and still counting. BTW, do you have the 225Wp Sunpower panels as I indicated in the spreadsheet?)

I have 35 SunPower Serengeti 228w panels.

No failures with M190 inverters, but the Envoy stopped reporting because we are moving it.

Need to add 6-8kW more production.

Maybe LG315's with M250's.

 

[RegGuheert]

pclifton PMed me to let me know that Enphase had just updated all of his M190s to firmware to version 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01. I told him that mine had not yet been updated to that version. When I looked again today, I learned that what I told him was only partly true. In reality, it appears that Enphase has been updating each inverter to that version as soon as they start having issues and reporting "Grid Gone" events. As a result, all of the inverters shown in this picture have that version of the M190 firmware:

For reference, here is a plot of the last eighteen days of production for my system (the longest period available since part of the array was disconnected for upgrades):

For completeness is the list of those inverters and the date they were updated with the new firmware:

121045415714 - Wed Apr 29, 2015 06:45 PM EDT
121045414066 - Sun May 24, 2015 06:50 PM EDT
121045415533 - Tue Jun 02, 2015 06:55 AM EDT
121045414856 - Tue Jun 09, 2015 06:58 PM EDT
121045414916 - Thu Jun 18, 2015 06:06 AM EDT
121045415731 - Fri Jun 26, 2015 06:35 AM EDT
121045414905 - Sun Jul 19, 2015 06:09 PM EDT

Since that time, one more M190 has become a "Grid Goner":

121045414859 - Fri Aug 21, 2015 06:50 AM EDT

It seems that my Envoy has made an approximate record of when each of my microinverters started acting up this year. I guess that reporting will end when I receive the same update that pclifton recently got.

 

[billg]

pclifton PMed me to let me know that Enphase had just updated all of his M190s to firmware to version 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01.

Where do you see the firmware version of the M190's?

 

[RegGuheert]

Where do you see the firmware version of the M190's?

Directly from the Envoy. If you look at the Envoy, it shows its IP number. To access it, simply type the following into your web browser:

http://192.168.1.150
(That's for my Envoy. You need to use your Envoy's IP number.)

Once you are in the Envoy, click "Inventory" to see a list all the details for all of your inverters. You can change the number you see from 25 to a larger number, if needed.

 

[pclifton]

More information: I believe what triggered my inverter updates was my user initiated upgrade of the firmware on my two Envoy(s). Within 24 hours of the new Envoy firmware's installation, every inverter's firmware was updated. The Envoy update is done through Enlighten.

Here are the firmware versions that I have at this point:
M190 Firmware: 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01
M215 Firmware: 520-00040-r01-v03.41.05 (Different Envoy)
M250 Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.20.00

I was not receiving any "Grid Gone" events, and everything seemed to be running fine after the replacement of a M190 failure that I posted in this thread.

Ken Clifton

 

[RegGuheert]

Here are the firmware versions that I have at this point:
M190 Firmware: 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01
M215 Firmware: 520-00040-r01-v03.41.05 (Different Envoy)
M250 Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.20.00

For comparison, here are the firmware versions that I have at this point:
M190 Firmware: 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01 (Eight units which give daily "Grid Gone" events. 56 months old.)
M190 Firmware: 520-00008-r01-v01.08.00 (29 remaining M190s which are not currently having any issues. Also 56 months old.)
M190-R Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.19.01 (Only one of these new-style (M215IG-style) M190 replacements. 12 months old.)
M215-IG Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.19.01 (12 units installed 14 months ago.)
M250 Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.18.00 (4 units installed 2 months ago.)

 

[Weatherman]

Of my ten, remaining, original m190s, the five with 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01 are the only ones producing grid gone. I really wish Enphase had not updated things to that level. Three of those five were working fine on the older version (520-00008-r01-v01.08.00).

To summarize where my system is at, right now... Out of thirty, original, m190s, twenty have been replaced, and one of the replacements has been replaced. Of the remaining ten, five are dropping power on grid-gone events. Only five of the original thirty are still working ok after a little over three years.

 

[billg]

Here are the firmware versions that I have at this point:
M190 Firmware: 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01
M215 Firmware: 520-00040-r01-v03.41.05 (Different Envoy)
M250 Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.20.00

For comparison, here are the firmware versions that I have at this point:
M190 Firmware: 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01 (Eight units which give daily "Grid Gone" events. 56 months old.)
M190 Firmware: 520-00008-r01-v01.08.00 (29 remaining M190s which are not currently having any issues. Also 56 months old.)
M190-R Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.19.01 (Only one of these new-style (M215IG-style) M190 replacements. 12 months old.)
M215-IG Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.19.01 (12 units installed 14 months ago.)
M250 Firmware: 520-00044-r01-v01.18.00 (4 units installed 2 months ago.)

My remaining 11 original M190's (from 2009) are running: 520-00006-r01-v00.01.09
3 of my oldest replacements are running: 520-00044-r01-v01.20.00
6 more replacements are running: 520-00008-r01-v01.08.01
The 3 most recent replacements are running: 520-00044-r01-v01.19.01

I don't think I'll try forcing an update to the Envoy, though. All my panels are producing this week.

 

[RegGuheert]

It appears I had a fifth inverter failure in my system on Tuesday. Interestingly this inverter, located at the top left of the field array, was NOT one of the inverters reporting "Grid Gone" events daily. I had one fail last September in a similar fashion (no "Grid Gones" in advance). It seems there are at least two different failure modes for these M190 inverters.

I informed Enphase of this failure this morning. We'll see how long it takes to receive a replacement. Last time took a month.

I still have eight inverters reporting "Grid Gone" events. This failure brings the MTBF of the M190s in my system down to 40 years.

 

[RegGuheert]

The short Envoy warranty is one of my concerns about an Enphase system, especially given the price of them - around $500 retail.

I'm on my second Envoy, the first one was proactively replaced by Enphase when it was about 2 years old with the current one about 3 years old (yay, my system is just over 5 years old!).

The part really should have a 5 year warranty instead of the 2 year warranty it currently has. Or the price of the Envoy should be reduced significantly. It certainly can't cost them more than a hundred dollars or so to manufacture.

You have been heard. The new Envoy-S has a 5-year warranty. Now I wonder how much it costs.

Since it worked so well for you, I'll now state the following: The Envoy really should have a 25-year warranty instead of the 5-year warranty it currently has.

 

[pclifton]

It appears I had a fifth inverter failure in my system on Tuesday. Interestingly this inverter, located at the top left of the field array, was NOT one of the inverters reporting "Grid Gone" events daily. I had one fail last September in a similar fashion (no "Grid Gones" in advance). It seems there are at least two different failure modes for these M190 inverters.

I informed Enphase of this failure this morning. We'll see how long it takes to receive a replacement. Last time took a month.

RegGuheert,

My M190 replacement this month arrived 13 days after calling Enphase. Hopefully you will see similar service. The replacement M190IG-R looks different from the previous M190IG-R. The latest replacement has a cast aluminium inverter body, whereas the previous one looked exactly like a M215 (black body).

FYI: My logic for updating the firmware on all the units was simply that any time I have called Enphase for warranty replacement the first thing they try is to update the firmware, then they want to "watch" the unit for a few days. If, however, I am already running that firmware, then I might eliminate that 3-7 day waiting period. Of course the last M190 failed differently (as did yours). In that case the failed M190 refused to take the latest firmware they were trying to send it, so my RMA process started with my first call.

Regarding the Envoy-S, I hope it is available sans the enclosure and bus bar, etc. For those of us with installed systems, it would be a shame to have to pay for all that stuff that we are not going to use.

Ken Clifton

 

[RegGuheert]

My M190 replacement this month arrived 13 days after calling Enphase. Hopefully you will see similar service. The replacement M190IG-R looks different from the previous M190IG-R. The latest replacement has a cast aluminium inverter body, whereas the previous one looked exactly like a M215 (black body).

That's interesting! Perhaps that is the result of a cost-take-out exercise since they are now moving away from the M215IGs and M250s.

If I get the same type replacement as you, I will then have five different types of Enphase microinverters installed in my system.

FYI: My logic for updating the firmware on all the units was simply that any time I have called Enphase for warranty replacement the first thing they try is to update the firmware, then they want to "watch" the unit for a few days. If, however, I am already running that firmware, then I might eliminate that 3-7 day waiting period. Of course the last M190 failed differently (as did yours). In that case the failed M190 refused to take the latest firmware they were trying to send it, so my RMA process started with my first call.

Enlighten says my Envoy is up-to-date and I don't even know how to update microinverters without calling Enphase.

In any case, they have not yet updated the firmware on the failed inverter (or taken any other action of which I am aware).

Regarding the Envoy-S, I hope it is available sans the enclosure and bus bar, etc. For those of us with installed systems, it would be a shame to have to pay for all that stuff that we are not going to use.

Yes, the Envoy-S Standard does not include the enclosure and comes with a 120-VAC power cord.. You can see the options at this link: Enphase Envoy. Unfortunately, the new Envoy does not include the display, so you cannot simply walk up to it and see what is going on (actually, there are some blinky status LEDs). Hopefully that has allowed them to lower the purchase price, but I wouldn't bet on it.

BTW, that last link also indicates that the old Envoy will not support the S230 or S280, so we will not be able to add those into our systems until we upgrade (or replace because of failure) our Envoys. I suspect that this might cause problems for Enphase, as there will likely be MANY instances where owners add microinverters to their system but are unaware of this limitation. I wonder if Enphase will end up upgrading the firmware in the old Envoys to support the S230 and S280 before all is said and done.

 

[DaveEV]

Since it worked so well for you, I'll now state the following: The Envoy really should have a 25-year warranty instead of the 5-year warranty it currently has.

LOL! - It probably wouldn't be hard to get it at least to 10 years - would just need to conformal coat it or pot it like they do the inverters and perhaps up the voltage rating or change the type of electrolytic capacitors.

At some point I'd like to see them reduce the price of the Envoy - when they ditched the subscription fees they hiked up the price of the Envoy which makes the Enphase system a lot less cost effective for small systems, when small systems ought to be Enphase's strongest market.

Perhaps shifting some of the cost of monitoring into the cost of the inverter would be a reasonable compromise - obviously the cost of monitoring is a mix of a per-customer and per-inverter costs.

 

[RegGuheert]

It appears I had a fifth inverter failure in my system on Tuesday.

We had a bit of sun today for the first time since this inverter failed. Since this unit is in the field array where I can easily reach it, I did a simple "first-hand" test to see if I could feel a temperature difference compared with its neighbors. Sure enough, this unit felt cool to the touch while the neighboring inverters which are working properly felt warm to the touch.

I also felt the associated panels to see if I could detect a difference. I thought perhaps I could, but it wasn't obvious since one was "hot" and the other was "slightly hotter". I decided to get an IR thermometer to try to detect the differences. Here are the readings I saw:

- Failed microinverter: 83F
- Working microinverter: 88F
- PV module connected to failed microinverter: 100F
- PV module connected to working microinverter: 95F

(Those are all approximate temperatures, but I didn't put a tilde in front of them since it looks just like a minus sign on this forum.)

Interestingly, the light on the side of the failed microinverter was flashing green just like the other inverters which are working properly.

I informed Enphase of this failure this morning. We'll see how long it takes to receive a replacement. Last time took a month.

No action from Enphase on this failure that I can detect (other than the automated assignment of a case number immediately upon receipt of my email).