Bought a 2011 Leaf on 03/15/2015 with a "new pack", but...

[TimLee]

...
take the pack. trying to get damages from this will take years, tons of money and you do not have a guarantee of any payoff. In fact, I don't see you really having a case.

I agree that getting them to confirm in writing what they are going to do and signed by both parties is correct approach, and doing pre post testing, and hopefully watching the battery change is correct approach.
If they are legally sharp they will expect the OP to sign confirming this resolves the dispute once implemented.

The other woman this happened to that Dave assisted, didn't Nissan get involved in that?

Why not this repeat case?

 

[davewill]

...The other woman this happened to that Dave assisted, didn't Nissan get involved in that?

Why not this repeat case?

Because the dealer is seeing reason without corporate persuasion?

 

[TonyWilliams]

1) Take the new battery.

2) Be gentleman enough to say, "thank you".

3) Trust, but verify. Your GID meter needs to see 284-292 GIDs with new battery. If it doesn't, you're back at square one. Make this clear to the dealer that the this battery deal is contingent on a new condition 2015 battery, that is VERIFIED to have the performance as such.

 

[91040]

It is possible Nissan Corporate was involved. They monitor this forum.

...The other woman this happened to that Dave assisted, didn't Nissan get involved in that?

Why not this repeat case?

Because the dealer is seeing reason without corporate persuasion?

 

[KillaWhat]

I'm glad to hear this is getting resolved in your favor.
I know that a lot of us followed this thread as if we had a vested interest in the outcome.
You have a lot of supporters out here.

Free legal Advice:

Just make sure that they are giving you a 100% new, 2015 model "lizard" pack. There's enough readings on this pack to know what it should indicate at 100% charge. Once they put it in, have them charge to 100% and take a reading. It should indicate 292 GIDS.

They will have to order the New pack.
Insist on copies of that paperwork BEFORE the replacement.
Also, good to have down the line.

Yeah, I already have an email from them GM of the dealership outlining the specific model number of the battery that they will be installing (hence my other thread asking about the model being a "lizard" pack).

Emails are wonderful, but not as good as a real honest to God sit-down-and-signed documents.
Try to getting a contested e-mail accepted into evidence in the real world.


So, like many before me, my advice is take your new Lizard Pack and run like you stole it.
Also, insist on free oil changes for life as a dealer concession, and see how long it takes them to figure that one out.

Congrats.

 

[ishiyakazuo]

Also, insist on free oil changes for life as a dealer concession, and see how long it takes them to figure that one out.

I saw a listing for a LEAF the other day with "fresh oil" listed as one of the ways it was refurbed by the dealer. I mean, I guess they could've oiled up the shocks and struts... or they just say that in every listing they ever post.

 

[RegGuheert]

The other woman this happened to that Dave assisted, didn't Nissan get involved in that?

Why not this repeat case?

This is not a repeat case. In that other case, the vehicle dropped the fourth capacity bar not too long after she purchased it. At that point it was not a big deal to resolve the issue since the replacement was covered under the manufacturer's warranty.

 

[TimLee]

This is not a repeat case. In that other case, the vehicle dropped the fourth capacity bar not too long after she purchased it. At that point it was not a big deal to resolve the issue since the replacement was covered under the manufacturer's warranty.

Thanks.
Repeat in the sense of buyer purchasing LEAF and not getting what was expected due to a Clearing of the Long Term battery data.
But the earlier case was easy for Nissan to resolve.

This case is worse than the earlier one because they were telling the customer it had a new battery.

Nissan has generated a big negative for the LEAF with the ease with which a customer can be misled.

Used LEAF purchasers need LEAF Spy, a lot of knowledge about what to look for, and probably should request a complete listing of any maintenance done on the vehicle.
Hopefully the Nissan database would show the reset.

A real big negative for the LEAF.
Possibly other EVs too.

 

[TomT]

Federal odometer tampering laws need to be updated to cover battery cheating circumstances such as this one...

A real big negative for the LEAF.
Possibly other EVs too.

 

[timhebb]

No brainer for me, take the new battery.

+1. And then, once you've got it and you're clear, you have to tell us which dealer it was.

Alternatively, you could offer the dealership a deal NOT to disclose their name to MNL and the world in exchange for complying with your additional wishes.

 

[jhm614]

Federal odometer tampering laws need to be updated to cover battery cheating circumstances such as this one...

+1 That is very good consumer protection idea.

 

[davewill]

Federal odometer tampering laws need to be updated to cover battery cheating circumstances such as this one...

+1 That is very good consumer protection idea.

Yes, this would force the manufacturers to take engineering steps to assure that the battery health could not be so easily fudged.

 

[mbender]

Nasty idea... I like how you think! ;-) (at least when it comes to dealers)

Oh, and 'irregardless' is a word, even if a nonstandard one.

No brainer for me, take the new battery.

+1. And then, once you've got it and you're clear, you have to tell us which dealer it was.

Alternatively, you could offer the dealership a deal NOT to disclose their name to MNL and the world in exchange for complying with your additional wishes.

 

[DaveinOlyWA]

As Reg stated, this is a different case because this one has not yet reached the warranty stage although I suspect it will but that does not address the inconvenience the OP will have while waiting for that to happen.

Unfortunately, the tech involved has moved to another dealership and NDAs were agreed upon so we can only speculate as to what could have happened if she had not lost that 4th bar so conveniently. There is however a paper trail that the tech can bring up that shows the history of the vehicle and any possible "adjustments" that might have been made.

So any precedence for this issue needs to start now. FYI; this car is probably the 6th or 7th one that I have heard about that has apparently suffered the same "adjustment"

What really needs to happen is the affected needs to start making noise so we can get this added to the consumer protection laws. After all it is falsifying the information the car provides in order to make a sale under false pretenses which is what odometer tampering essentially is. This is no different.

 

[TomT]

The manufacturers also need to add protections against this the ability to do this - with audit trails - just as they currently do for resetting changed odometers. Resetting a BMS ought to set off alarms everywhere!

So any precedence for this issue needs to start now. FYI; this car is probably the 6th or 7th one that I have heard about that has apparently suffered the same "adjustment"

 

[davewill]

The manufacturers also need to add protections against this the ability to do this - with audit trails - just as they currently do for resetting changed odometers. Resetting a BMS ought to set off alarms everywhere!

Resetting the BMS could be OK. The battery health display, however, should not reset unless the BMS has completely "relearned" the battery again.

 

[kuri]

Many many apologies for the long silence. At the advice of my attorney, I was told not to discuss the issue until work had begun.

I just dropped the car off this afternoon and will be picking it up Monday with a fresh 295B0-3NF9E battery and all other required parts installed, *and* a brand spankin' new 60 month, 60,000 mile degradation warranty. Yes, I have this in writing, from both the dealership and Nissan Corporate. At the end of the day, do I think they're getting off the hook a little too easily since I have documented proof that the car had 9 bars on the meter in January of this year? Yeah... but it is what it is.

As soon as everything settles out and I'm sure we're 100% in the clear, I'll post here and probably start up a new thread with a full write up of the issue, including all the recordings and other identifying information so everyone knows how this whole story went down.

 

[dhanson865]

Many many apologies for the long silence. At the advice of my attorney, I was told not to discuss the issue until work had begun.

I just dropped the car off this afternoon and will be picking it up Monday with a fresh 295B0-3NF9E battery and all other required parts installed, *and* a brand spankin' new 60 month, 60,000 mile degradation warranty. Yes, I have this in writing, from both the dealership and Nissan Corporate. At the end of the day, do I think they're getting off the hook a little too easily since I have documented proof that the car had 9 bars on the meter in January of this year? Yeah... but it is what it is.

As soon as everything settles out and I'm sure we're 100% in the clear, I'll post here and probably start up a new thread with a full write up of the issue, including all the recordings and other identifying information so everyone knows how this whole story went down.

If you got Nissan corporate to put it in writing you are my hero. That's a huge win on top of the new battery.

Don't undervalue the documentation you have at this point.

 

[Roadburner440]

Congrats on the new battery! Hopefully I will be able to get a new lizard pack under warranty at some point. Will see though. Have to let us know what the overall range is and all.

 

[epirali]

Congrats and sorry that something that should have been a pleasant experience became this. But hopefully after all is said and done you will enjoy a great car with a brand new battery!