2011 TAX TIME Questions
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Rat
Well-known member
I am interested and a tad concerned that the $7500 credit has been okayed by TT but not the IRS for some people posting here. I filed via TT (purchased version, not online) and it gave me the full credit for the Leaf (form 8936) but disallowed the one for the EVSE (form 8911) based on a tentative income figure on the AMT form. However, I did not have to pay any AMT. I haven't the last few years since I've been retired and my income is lower. My state refund came through already with no issues (so far), but I haven't heard from the IRS. Obviously, I'll be watching this with interest. I had some horrible experience with the H&R Block program a few years back and switched to TurboTax. Since then I haven't had major problems, but you still have to review everything carefully. Last year I discovered that the previous year they had downloaded all my data from Merrill Lynch twice, thus doubling my interest and dividends. I had to file an amended return with a printout of the Schedule B a year later. It's worth going to form view and looking at the actual forms TT is creating to see if they make sense before filing. However, having once worked for an accountant doing tax returns, I don't have confidence they are any better, and several of the stories in this thread confirm that.
My refund status has changed from "March 6th" to "your return is being processed". I know that the IRS has been Royally screwed up this year, so I'm not worried (yet). But TT better gird themselves for a class action if they've screwed up, and I know just the legal team to do it!
oakwcj
Well-known member
mwalsh said:
My status has changed from February 4th to February 14th to processing to the more ominous:
"We have received your tax return and it is being reviewed. You will receive a notice from us requesting additional information from you. When you receive the notice, please provide the requested information within 30 days. You may not receive all or a part of your refund until we receive and review the information we requested from you. If you need more information after you receive our notice, call the number on the notice."
I also used Turbo Tax. I've been in "we're going to send you a notice" status for nearly a month.
That seems right. There are two different issues. One is whether the AMT is greater than your regular tax. Two is whether the AMT will limit credits. The EV credits will always reduce your tax since those credits are not subject to the AMT. However, if your EV credit from form 8936 drops your regular income below the AMT, then you can't take the credits from form 8911. Those credits are subject to the AMT, which means they can't be used to reduce your tax below the AMT. Technically you're not paying any AMT but the AMT is limiting the EVSE credits.Rat said:
It's a multi-step process. First you calculate your regular tax. Then you calculate your AMT. If the AMT is greater then that's your tax. If your regular tax is higher that's your tax. Next you apply the EV credits to the higher tax, which gives your tentative tax. Now you apply credits like the EVSE credits which are subject to the AMT. Since these credits can't reduce your tax below the AMT, if your tentative tax is lower than the AMT then you can't take the EVSE credits. If the tentative tax is higher than the AMT you can take those credits to the extent that they don't lower your tax below the AMT.
I think this is what some others have run into.
redLEAF
Well-known member
As we typically still have enough to itemize (property taxes, charities, etc.) as well as have used the same tax pro for the last 20+ years, we went long form as always but filed electronically and just got our fed refund deposited today -- as we lost our last kid as a deduction (college grad working now) last year we were quite pleased with the refund which set a record (very close to 5 figures). We didn't get the EVSE credit, I see how my guy completed the form and we just didn't qualify for it --- has anyone gotten BOTH the fed tax credit for the EV and EVSE on the same tax return? can't seem to figure out how you could get both?; perhaps by leasing the car which will roll the EV fed tax credit back to Nissan or simply installing the EVSE and taking the credit one year and then buying the EV and taking the credit the following year? My guy always includes the AMT forms for us (think it's required anyway) and we're not even close to getting dinged on that as we pay plenty in taxes as it is ... just waiting for the IL EPA 'cash' rebate which should show up by the end of March; anticipating that it may be listed as income for '12 (like a state income tax refund) but we'll see. If it is, will contact my tax pro and see what we can do to offset it (perhaps sell some losing stocks, etc.).
Make less. Make more. Don't have any preference items. You know, all the things that you can't really control.redLEAF said:
If the IL EPA rebate is not a tax credit then it won't be treated like a state income tax refund. If it is then it will be.
essaunders
Well-known member
WWBD said:Filling out 8936 right now. I don't know what to make of this little square box on line 4 (after the dollar amount for the tentative credit). Is that for cents (i.e., after a decimal point)? Or do I put something else there?
.00
that's my zero cents worth.. anyway.
planet4ever
Well-known member
It's definitely not that simple. Somehow you would have to have your Alternate Minimum Tax calculate to be nearly $8,000 less than your regular tax (before credits). "Make less" certainly isn't going to cut it. "Make more" is very unlikely to cut it either, because then your AMT is probably going up faster than your regular tax.SanDust said:Make less. Make more. Don't have any preference items. You know, all the things that you can't really control.redLEAF said:
RedLEAF has it right. I think the only way to get both is to have leased, or to install the EVSE in a different year from when you got your car (and it's a bit late for that now, since the EVSE credit has expired.) The smart people were the ones who installed an EVSE in 2010.
Ray
Randmac
Active member
There may be a way for some couples to get both credits (EV and EVSE) if you live in a community property state (like CA). The IRS respects community property rules of the states. So, if the couple has a 50/50 community property arrangement and splits the EV credit where each taxpayer claims $3750, then it may be possible to get the EVSE credit by splitting the EVSE credit as well. This is a complicated way to file, may not be accepted by the IRS, could potentially increase income tax liability, and is probably not worth the hassle.
AMT doesn't phase in until $75,000 and it phases out by $500,000. (This is why a "tax hike" on people making over $250,000 will only affect people making over $500,000 -- for those making less than $500,000 the AMT rate is already higher than the proposed tax increase). If you don't have any preference item deductions like interest on second mortgages or state and local taxes then the AMT never comes into play.planet4ever said:
Deleted member 1622
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Apologies if this has been covered already:
Line 13 of Form 8936 has these instructions:
Line 13
Enter the total, if any, credits from Form 1040, lines 47
through 50 (or Form 1040NR, lines 45 through 47); Form
5695, line 14; Form 8834, line 23; Form 8910, line 22; and
Schedule R, line 22.
Then you're supposed to SUBTRACT that amount from the $7,500.
I have run this through Turbotax, and it looks like it is indeed reducing the total credit by these "personal credits" that come from Form 1040. If I read this right, we are really not getting the full rebate if you have ANY other credits to claim, and most of us do. Once you reduce the 7500 by other credits, then subtract any other taxes you owe, many of us may be left with half of what we thought we were getting back on this car.
Am I reading this right, or am I way off? And if that's the case, shouldn't Nissan have been a lot clearer that there was probably no way that someone gets the full $7500 back?
Thanks,
Josh
Line 13 of Form 8936 has these instructions:
Line 13
Enter the total, if any, credits from Form 1040, lines 47
through 50 (or Form 1040NR, lines 45 through 47); Form
5695, line 14; Form 8834, line 23; Form 8910, line 22; and
Schedule R, line 22.
Then you're supposed to SUBTRACT that amount from the $7,500.
I have run this through Turbotax, and it looks like it is indeed reducing the total credit by these "personal credits" that come from Form 1040. If I read this right, we are really not getting the full rebate if you have ANY other credits to claim, and most of us do. Once you reduce the 7500 by other credits, then subtract any other taxes you owe, many of us may be left with half of what we thought we were getting back on this car.
Am I reading this right, or am I way off? And if that's the case, shouldn't Nissan have been a lot clearer that there was probably no way that someone gets the full $7500 back?
Thanks,
Josh
barsad22 said:
I didn't have any personal credits, so I'm not sure what they consist of. (what is an example if you don't mind) I received my return last week, got the full $7500 credit.
I don't think Nissan could have been any more clear on consulting a tax professional to make sure if you would be eligible to receive the entire $7,500 tax credit. They pretty much had the footnote on any publication that mentioned the tax credit.
Deleted member 1622
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Personal credits can be things like Educator's Expenses (up to $250), or student loan interest deduction, etc. There are hundreds of them, and they should appear on Lines 47-50 on your 1040.
It was never a question for me whether I was eligible for the credit, the problem is what is deducted from the credit. Consulting with a tax professional would only have given me the bad news earlier than tax time, it wouldn't have changed the reality. I think Nissan could have provided a one-page sheet that made all this clear rather than the old "consult your local tax professional." That was purposeful ambiguity, if you ask me.
JG
It was never a question for me whether I was eligible for the credit, the problem is what is deducted from the credit. Consulting with a tax professional would only have given me the bad news earlier than tax time, it wouldn't have changed the reality. I think Nissan could have provided a one-page sheet that made all this clear rather than the old "consult your local tax professional." That was purposeful ambiguity, if you ask me.
JG
thankyouOB
Well-known member
barsad22 said:
student loan interest and educators expenses are deductions to establish adjusted gross income on page 1 of 1040.
personal credits are something else on lines 47-53, including child, residential energy, education and foreign tax credits.
planet4ever
Well-known member
No, you subtract that from line 12, which has your tax before credits from 1040 line 46. The $7,500 is on line 11, and is compared, on line 15, to the result of that subtraction. All this is really saying is that the EV credit added to the other credits they list can't make your net tax liability go negative. i.e. they will never refund more than you gave them in the first place through payroll deductions, etc.barsad22 said:
Ray
lpickup
Well-known member
WWBD said:
The human readable form that TaxACT printed out for me did not even have that box, so I doubt it's anything important. Go ahead and put .00 if you think you have to put something there.
Let's assume that the CV rebate is taxable. I would think that for most of us, that taxable amount would be eaten up by the $7500 credit. (I didn't even use half of mine.) But then there is the state part that I can understand. So if you filed the fed w/o the $2500 CV and there is still alot of residue from the $7500 (as in my case), would you be concerned about an audit? I didn't include the $2500 but I have alot left over from the $7500 that it would matter anyway. Any thoughts?
