SJC to Encinitas?

Anyone who's done the leg between SJC and Oceanside/Encinitas on the 5 know what it does for your economy?

I'd have maybe 40 miles of range (over relatively flat terrain) upon leaving SJC and have 35 miles left to drive, with those inclines to negotiate and a 2 mile uphill climb once off the freeway.

Trying to come up with a "plan C" for the EV Oasis charger being ICE'd or down. It'll also help me figure put just how long I'd have to L2 at the Nissan Dealership (my current "plan B").

You're in luck. Mossy Nissan Oceanside just got their DCQC up and operational. I'd give them a call to double check since it's so new, but it would make an excellent plan C...or even plan A depending on where you're starting out from exactly. As far as the route, there's a lot of gentle ups and downs as you go over ridges and through canyons/lagoons. If you allow your speed to rise a bit on the downs, and drop a bit on the ups, you can beat the range chart numbers.

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=5739&p=306208&hilit=mossy+nissan+oceanside#p306208" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Mossy is my "plan B" for the return. "Plan A" is to install a temporary breaker in my step-daughter's service panel and use my EVSE Upgrade unit. We should be there the whole afternoon, so plenty of time. And I already scoped out that she had plenty of space and the same kind of breakers as the one I keep in my bag of tricks, so we should be good to go. The only thing I don't know for sure is her load, but I've told her to keep the pool pumps off while I'm charging, so it should be OK regardless.

SJC??? Do you mean SAN? 40 miles isn't going to cut it from SJC.

DeaneG said:

SJC??? Do you mean SAN? 40 miles isn't going to cut it from SJC.

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San Juan Capistrano, not San Jose International Airport.

Oops, thanks for the clarification.

I haven't actually driven it in the LEAF (will probably be going back and forth next weekend though for the BC2BC meetup in SJC), but at only a bit more than 40 miles from the QC in San Juan Capistranto to Encinitas, you shouldn't have any issue if you keep speed to 65 mph and have 9-10 bars of charge to start with. Not all that much elevation change for most of that route. Biggest issue is keeping the speed down - high speeds are common along that stretch and much of it is open and fairly straight.

I drove this route previously when going to Tony's San Diego meetup earlier this month. I don't remember my charge when I arrived in Encinitas but I figure that I was probably a bit above LBW, with speeds of 65+. Draft a truck coming down, keep your speed around 60, and I think you should be ok. The way back seems a bit more difficult because there is a slight incline right before SJC. I'd hit up the Oceanside train depot if you are nail-biting before or after going through the no-mans-land of camp penalton. They have free blinks and a Burger King inside the station.

Haven't seen the SJC QC totally ICEed, only once have I seen one ICE car in one of the two spots. They could use signs, but the cones seem surprisingly effective.

Sitting at the EV Oasis charger right now. No worries. As anticpated (hoped?)...two spots free, no ICE'ing.

I did Sunland to Riverside QC to Escondido QC to Lakeside last week. Left Riverside with 9 bars (a 100% blink QC charge) and made it to Escondido before the VLBW, but I drove ~60mph the whole way. Then on the way back I did Lakeside to Mossy Oceanside QC to Tustin Nissan QC and made that just after LBW. 325 miles averaging 4.7 m/kw.

There really are enough QC's now that there is a little redundancy. It's very nice.

-Matt

Lopton said:

There really are enough QC's now that there is a little redundancy. It's very nice.

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Totally agreed (though I'd like to see even more).

I QC'd 5 times last week, including the two sessions on Sunday. I've been trying to only charge to the point I need, so none of my sessions has been more than 20 minutes long, because a) I don't want to stress my pack and b) I don't want to hold up anyone waiting behind me longer than absolutely necessary.

So getting back to a report on my Encinitas trip. Data collection got messed up a bit on the way down - unbeknownst to me, it turned out Naomi had arranged for us to transport two of her teenage grandchildren. This not only added added extra laden weight to the vehicle, it took us around 4 miles out of our way to go get them. We didn't, however, need to bring them back. So results on the return would be more in line with what would normally occur.

So, that said, here are the results:

% of Gids Gids Voltage
Leaving Home 76.5% 215 392v
SJC in (via detour) 38.4% 108 383.5v 34.5 miles leg (would have been 30.8 miles without the detour)

Charged for 20 minutes; consumed 6.7kWh; cost $5.07

SJC out 65.8% 185 387.5v
Encinitas freeway exit 24.9% 69 366v
Encinitas destination 21.7% 61 364.5v 36.7 miles leg

Total 71.2 miles. Used 82.2% of Gids


Encinitas destination 74% 208 391v
Encinitas freeway ramp 74% 208 391v
SJC in 40.5% 114 382v 36.4 miles leg

Charged for 10 minutes; consumed 3.7kWh; cost $2.60

SJC out 55.1% 155 384.5v
Home 24.1% 68 365.5v 30.9 miles leg

Total 67.3 miles. Used 64.5% of Gids.

As you'll be able to work out, it took us a total of 82.2% of Gids to get to our final destination from home. And then 64.5% of Gids for the return. If you discount out the 3.7 mile detour at the beginning of the trip, you'll get ~78.5% of Gids used for the outbound journey (riding by myself I get roughly 1 mile for every % of Gids @ 65mph indicated), still slightly outside the range the car will now give me at a full charge. But it's hard to say what having the extra weight of the kids did to my consumption on the way down. Maybe we could have just made it.

Either way, spending such a small amount for the quick charging, given the peace of mind it affords, is a no brainer. If I do have a really minor quibble with the way the EV Oasis charger is set up to bill, it would be the differentiation between Peak and Off-Peak times. If a Sunday at either noon or 6pm isn't off-peak, I really don't know what would be. But understand, I'm not really complaining - I'm quite happy to spend $15 an hour ANYTIME to know the charger is there and available. It just would be nice to know one way or the other. Or even do away with the tiered pricing altogether, so we're always sure of what we'd be charged.

On the way back, you'll see we did quite a bit better. This surprised me a bit. On paper, San Diego to Orange County is a slight uphill, and I expected my efficiency to be much worse than it was. I did toy with the idea of just skipping the QC on the way back, since we were doing so well. But I figured for just a couple of bucks...what the heck. As you can see from the figures, we used just 64.5% of Gids on the return, which is quite a bit below what I would normally expect to consume covering 67 miles. I'm guessing that if we'd skipped the QC we would have rolled into our driveway right around VLBW.

mwalsh said:

If I do have a really minor quibble with the way the EV Oasis charger is set up to bill, it would be the differentiation between Peak and Off-Peak times. If a Sunday at either noon or 6pm isn't off-peak, I really don't know what would be.

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For SDG&E peak is every day between noon and six.

SanDust said:

For SDG&E peak is every day between noon and six.

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EVERY DAY? What a ripoff!

SanDust said:

mwalsh said:

If I do have a really minor quibble with the way the EV Oasis charger is set up to bill, it would be the differentiation between Peak and Off-Peak times. If a Sunday at either noon or 6pm isn't off-peak, I really don't know what would be.

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For SDG&E peak is every day between noon and six.

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Hold on, Sandust. Such a sweeping statement isn't true...It depends on the rate you're on...I've attached the TOU periods for the AL-TOU rate, which is the standard commercial rate for large customers (like a hotel)...On this rate, all weekend times are in the off-peak period (for both summer and winter)....

Randy said:

Hold on, Sandust. Such a sweeping statement isn't true...It depends on the rate you're on...

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Don't be so defensive. My point was that EV Oasis may be using a tariff under which peak is noon to six and is treating the cost/kWh as a pass through or, alternatively, just mirroring the peak periods found in the residential EV-TOU tariffs which users would be familiar with. https://www.sdge.com/environment/ev-rates" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; I wouldn't say peak pricing between noon and six on weekends is a rip-off and I'm assuming SDG&E wouldn't say that either. That is, of course, the rate structure it offers.

If you're going to use peak pricing at all, having peak vary depending on the day of the week and the time of year would be something you'd want to avoid not embrace The rate plan you've outlined may be fine for large business users but it's too complicated for a consumer transaction. There is a reason McDonalds doesn't raise and lower prices depending on the time of day. Since consumers don't care about the cost structure, just their cost, sometimes slicing the baloney thinner and thinner just ends up wasting your time and confusing your customer.

The simplicity of the SDG&E rate structure for EVs is one of its major appeals. Way better than the mess that some other utilities offer.

Well, whatever it is, maybe a little clarification is in order? But, like I already said, I'm pretty happy just to have the station there either way.

Not trying to be defensive; I just don't want to see incorrect rate information out there...We work hard to try and disseminate correct information. And the one thing I've learned with rates is that it is rarely a one size fits all situation...

Demand charges are clearly the largest contributor to the bill for that charging station, not the TOU energy...

SanDust said:

My point was that EV Oasis may be using a tariff under which peak is noon to six and is treating the cost/kWh as a pass through or, alternatively, just mirroring the peak periods found in the residential EV-TOU tariffs which users would be familiar with. https://www.sdge.com/environment/ev-rates" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The simplicity of the SDG&E rate structure for EVs is one of its major appeals. Way better than the mess that some other utilities offer.

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The EV TOU rates are for residents only, not for businesses (I'm sure Randy can correct me here if this is not true). Businesses get to pay standard rates. For demand over 20 kW, they get to use the AL-TOU rate.

http://www.sdge.com/electric-tariff-book-commercialindustrial-rates" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Randy said:

Demand charges are clearly the largest contributor to the bill for that charging station, not the TOU energy...

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And don't forget that demand charges also vary depending on TOU as well. Now if only I could figure out how to read that confusing AL-TOU rate sheet...

SanDust said:

If you're going to use peak pricing at all, having peak vary depending on the day of the week and the time of year would be something you'd want to avoid not embrace

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The reality is that the peak demand varies based on factors such as time of year and day of the week. In the summer, peak is around 4 pm, but in winter peak tends to be later, at 6 pm. In colder areas in the country peak is actually in the winter, not summer, and typically is in the morning. The load curve of the day also varies quite bit throughout the seasons, as well.

JeremyW said:

SanDust said:

If you're going to use peak pricing at all, having peak vary depending on the day of the week and the time of year would be something you'd want to avoid not embrace

Click to expand...

The reality is that the peak demand varies based on factors such as time of year and day of the week. In the summer, peak is around 4 pm, but in winter peak tends to be later, at 6 pm. In colder areas in the country peak is actually in the winter, not summer, and typically is in the morning. The load curve of the day also varies quite bit throughout the seasons, as well.

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While that is true, Randy posted SDG&E's actual on-peak rates which pretty much account for seasonal peak loads as you describe: Summer 11am-6pm weekdays and winter 5pm-8pm weekdays. The real question is why does the SJC QC charge the same thing year around? I suspect it's simply done to keep the billing rates simple - Chargepoint likely can't handle more complex rates.