My New Potential EVSE Setup

Hi Everyone,

Okay, so after doing a bunch of research I think I've finally narrowed it down to using the GE Level-2 DuraStation with the 40' Jlong J1772 Extension Cable:

http://smile.amazon.com/dp/B00VVFO39W

http://shop.quickchargepower.com/JLONG-40-Amp-J1772-extension-cable-JL40A.htm

The DuraStation has a max output of 40amps, so it looks like I'll need to install 40amp breakers. The Jlong cable is also rated at 40amps max as well. My question is since the combined cable length is going to be 58', will there be any loss of amperage for having such a long cable?

For 40A continuous load you need a 50A circuit as you must derate to 80% of the stated maximum. However, if you're just charging a LEAF it maxes out at 27.5A so a 40A circuit is more than enough (40 * 0.8 = 32). You just need to set the EVSE to a maximum of no more than 32A so nobody comes along and plugs in their Tesla and overloads your circuit. Not sure if that GE has variable signaling for available amperage, but it should.

You will lose some in that long of a cable for sure, but only a few percent. There are people on here who will probably be able to tell you the exact amount, but it's not going to be a deal breaker.

Have you looked into a custom setup? Tony from QCP (where the Jlong cables come from) or several other people on this board can probably supply an EVSE with a 50' cable built in. Would probably cost less than that combo. Get yourself a hose hangar to go next to it and you'll have a nice, long range setup.

I would just run a 50 amp breaker and line to it so your set if you get a true 40 amp plugged in to it and the added cost for the wire won't be much compared to changing it down the road.

Also I would really look at an EVSE with a long enough cable for your needs rather than add an extension. The more connections you have the more likely you will have problems. Most EVSE manufactures will have options to add length and it will be less expensive than adding an extension in line, unless you plan on using the extension in multiple locations.

I almost bought an extension when I first got our Leaf, but have never needed it, the closest I came was a Volt parked in the EV spot and not plugged in, but the EVSE cord just reached to my Leaf by stretching the cord across the front bumper of the Volt, the Volt wasn't there when I got back...

+1 If you can find a seller that already has a 40' cable it should be not only cheaper but one less point of problems or failure. Whenever you add connections it's a point of failure, if you can find a EVSE already with a 40' cable you'd be much better off than trying to do it with extension cords.
Not that the extension cords don't work but if you know you need 40' and plan on needing it for the foreseeable future, personally I'd just get the appropriate EVSE and cord
I could have sworn Juicebox used to sell a EVSE with a 40' cord(or option) but I don't see it anymore. It seems like whenever I visit the Juicebox site it's different than the last time, generally for the worse :? Back when I ordered mine I could assemble it if I wanted or order it pre-made with many different options, seems like they are trying to get out of the DIY market and trying to standardize on just a few models and options, too bad IMO

jjeff said:

+1 If you can find a seller that already has a 40' cable it should be not only cheaper but one less point of problems or failure. Whenever you add connections it's a point of failure, if you can find a EVSE already with a 40' cable you'd be much better off than trying to do it with extension cords.
Not that the extension cords don't work but if you know you need 40' and plan on needing it for the foreseeable future, personally I'd just get the appropriate EVSE and cord
I could have sworn Juicebox used to sell a EVSE with a 40' cord(or option) but I don't see it anymore. It seems like whenever I visit the Juicebox site it's different than the last time, generally for the worse :? Back when I ordered mine I could assemble it if I wanted or order it pre-made with many different options, seems like they are trying to get out of the DIY market and trying to standardize on just a few models and options, too bad IMO

Click to expand...

This has always been the problem, I cannot seem to find any ESVE with anything longer than a 25' cord. The cord needs to be 60-70' to leave enough slack. Below are some pics of my current setup:

jjeff said:

+1 If you can find a seller that already has a 40' cable it should be not only cheaper but one less point of problems or failure. Whenever you add connections it's a point of failure, if you can find a EVSE already with a 40' cable you'd be much better off than trying to do it with extension cords.

Click to expand...

I'd heard that EVSEs are restricted to 25' cables by the National Electrical Code. (I personally have one with a 30' cable, but that's a custom-built OpenEVSE.) I finally looked up the details today. 625.17 says: "The overall length of the cable shall not exceed 7.5 m (25 ft) unless equipped with a cable management system that is listed as suitable for the purpose." I'm not really clear what would meet the requirements for a cable management system -- I assume my hose rack doesn't qualify? Anyway, that's why all the mass-produced EVSEs are limited to 25'.

I did find a 10 gauge 33' J1772 but note there is a disclaimer stating for use over 25' required a "cable management feature". I also find it interesting the cable is 10 gauge but they say it's rated for 32a.....since I thought 10 gauge was rated for max of 30a and for continuous use you wanted to stay under 80% which would be 24a I find it curious they actually rate it above by almost 10% and not under 20%......
http://www.amazon.com/EVoCharge-EVoReel-Replacement-Certified-Charging/dp/B016PUF5OY/ref=sr_1_3?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1454618515&sr=1-3&keywords=j1772+cable
At it's current $225 I wouldn't say it's exactly a cheap way to go, especially if the EVSE you purchase already has a cable that you have to discard. If you could purchase a EVSE cheaper without a cable it might not be so bad.

Where are you planning to mount your EVSE? Can you move it closer to the car?

There are several comments about connections. JLong uses standard J1772 connections, and you can take it with you and use it at public charge stations that are blocked. My choice would be a JLong (I use several of them at home):


JLong
http://shop.quickchargepower.com/JLONG-40-Amp-J1772-extension-cable-JL40A.htm



If you don't mind opening up the EVSE, and are capable of swapping in a new cable, we can sell you a J-Plug(tm) in any length you want:


J-Plug
http://shop.quickchargepower.com/J-Plug-J1772-40-Amp-Plug-Cable-Assembly-JPC40A.htm


We can extend the length of the cable on our JESLA (or any Tesla UMC):


JESLA
http://shop.quickchargepower.com/JESLA-is-THE-40-amp-J1772-portable-charging-solution-JESLA.htm


Extension service for JESLA / Tesla UMC
http://shop.quickchargepower.com/Service-Tesla-UMC-cable-extension-UMCExt.htm

That GE unit only operates on 240 V, is limited to 30 amps (requires 40 amp breaker) and it is not portable.

It looks like it might even have some issues:

http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?162610-Do-NOT-Recommend-GE-DuraStation-30A-Model-EVDSWGH-CP01

EVSE should be near the vehicle. This is how it is designed to work. Also this yellow extension
cord is just waiting for the trouble. DO NOT leave it there.

What you should do.
Take a shovel

Dig a small trench (20-40cm, 8-16").

Insert 240V cable into a plastic cable conduit:

Find a wooden pole (metal also works). Hammer it in the ground. HARD!
If it won't stay then make a hole large enough and pour 2 buckets of concrete in it.
Route the conduit with the 240V cable onto the pole (height of your elbow). Install (stationary) EVSE onto that pole.

Pole should be as short as possible. The shorter it is the harder it is to overthrow it. But the plug should be kept
at reasonable height so you could grab it like you grap a door handle.
My pole is up to my chest. It started wiggling as ground got really wet. I think I'll fix that this summer.
Also I regret I did not route the conduit inside the metal pole. It would be so neat. Strapped it using zip ties

If you shovel carefully you can put the lawn pieces back so there will be no marks of digging after few months.
Lay some sheeting on the grass before you throw dirt on it! Don't do it like on the photo!

Have some help with those walkway stones. You have to pull them up to lay under those. Don't let the stone
and conduit touch - that might rub a hole in the conduit and damage the cable.

Use CONDUIT! It doesn't cost a buck and you can pull the cable if you need to replace it (for example more amps
or need another EVSE).

arnis said:

EVSE should be near the vehicle. This is how it is designed to work. Also this yellow extension
cord is just waiting for the trouble. DO NOT leave it there.

What you should do.
Take a shovel

Dig a small trench (20-40cm, 8-16").

Insert 240V cable into a plastic cable conduit:

Find a wooden pole (metal also works). Hammer it in the ground. HARD!
If it won't stay then make a hole large enough and pour 2 buckets of concrete in it.
Route the conduit with the 240V cable onto the pole (height of your elbow). Install (stationary) EVSE onto that pole.

Pole should be as short as possible. The shorter it is the harder it is to overthrow it. But the plug should be kept
at reasonable height so you could grab it like you grap a door handle.
My pole is up to my chest. It started wiggling as ground got really wet. I think I'll fix that this summer.
Also I regret I did not route the conduit inside the metal pole. It would be so neat. Strapped it using zip ties

If you shovel carefully you can put the lawn pieces back so there will be no marks of digging after few months.
Lay some sheeting on the grass before you throw dirt on it! Don't do it like on the photo!

Have some help with those walkway stones. You have to pull them up to lay under those. Don't let the stone
and conduit touch - that might rub a hole in the conduit and damage the cable.

Use CONDUIT! It doesn't cost a buck and you can pull the cable if you need to replace it (for example more amps
or need another EVSE).

Click to expand...

Believe me, I've been wanting to do this for some time now. The problem is that the neighborhood association wouldn't allow this setup for starters. And this isn't the safest neighborhood, that pole would get vandalized eventually. If the EVSE is up against the house, it looks way less conspicuous and has a way less chance of being targeted, sad to say, but I cannot exactly afford to move at the moment.

Is this your land? Up to the driveway...
Also I would inform others that you own an EV and that requires safe charging at home.
Cord on the ground is
1) way too dangerous
2) very easy to steal (also it does cost more money compared to cable that is in the ground).

If they don't like that you have very small pole (size of a mailbox):

They can eat their jealousy. Then force to remove all poles everywhere.

And then just tell that you are going to install a cable discreetly between your parking spot and house.
If you move then you will remove the pole and the cable (leave the conduit in the ground).

Just do it. If they start to do stupid things then just speak with local authorities (city or whatever level).
Inform that you have the right to charge the vehicle at home SAFELY and ask for permission on paper.
It is very rare for vandals to do stuff with mailboxes, same with similar looking EVSE boxes.
Install camera on the house. Really good investment for EVSE and vehicle.

I was thinking a nice steel lamp post with a 240vac outlet on the base of it. But whatever works...

This is a tough one - hard to get a good setup without a garage or even a driveway. I'd be very hesitant to invest a lot of time and money into a new EVSE and trenching/installation/etc.

Why not just keep doing what you're doing, but "upgrade" things? I assume you're using the stock EVSE to charge at L1 with a nice 12 gauge extension cord. If that's working on L1 then you can charge twice as fast (or more) with minimum additional investment and no additional risk of theft/etc. Just run 240V through (substantially) the same equipment you're currently using: Get your stock EVSE upgraded by EVSEupgrade.com, chop off the ends of that extension cord and replace them with a 240V plug and receptacle (L6-20 recommended, or L6-30 if you upgrade to a 10 gauge cord), and either replace the outlet/circuit with a 240V one (if it's a standalone outlet it's an easy switch, but it's probably not) or have a new circuit run to the same place.

However, having the cord going across the sidewalk like that is a really bad permanent solution, so you still might want to consider trenching. I would say just install the 240V outlet at the end though (perhaps with a lockbox on it) instead of leaving a hardwired EVSE down at the curb. You can get one of these for pretty cheap - I've got one installed on the side of my house and I'm sure it'd work out just fine on a small post:
Of course you'll want to either replace the receptacle with one suited to the wiring you run or just run wiring appropriate to support a 14-50.

arnis said:

Is this your land? Up to the driveway...
Also I would inform others that you own an EV and that requires safe charging at home.
Cord on the ground is
1) way too dangerous
2) very easy to steal (also it does cost more money compared to cable that is in the ground).

If they don't like that you have very small pole (size of a mailbox):
They can eat their jealousy. Then force to remove all poles everywhere.

And then just tell that you are going to install a cable discreetly between your parking spot and house.
If you move then you will remove the pole and the cable (leave the conduit in the ground).

Just do it. If they start to do stupid things then just speak with local authorities (city or whatever level).
Inform that you have the right to charge the vehicle at home SAFELY and ask for permission on paper.
It is very rare for vandals to do stuff with mailboxes, same with similar looking EVSE boxes.
Install camera on the house. Really good investment for EVSE and vehicle.

Click to expand...

We own the land from the sidewalk up to the house, that little strip of land between the sidewalk and the street is county property. That's why I cannot install any type of post there. And why I've been forced to run a cord instead. We already have an excellent camera because of another incident (not car related), but it doesn't help if the vandals are masked.

fooljoe said:

This is a tough one - hard to get a good setup without a garage or even a driveway. I'd be very hesitant to invest a lot of time and money into a new EVSE and trenching/installation/etc.

Why not just keep doing what you're doing, but "upgrade" things? I assume you're using the stock EVSE to charge at L1 with a nice 12 gauge extension cord. If that's working on L1 then you can charge twice as fast (or more) with minimum additional investment and no additional risk of theft/etc. Just run 240V through (substantially) the same equipment you're currently using: Get your stock EVSE upgraded by EVSEupgrade.com, chop off the ends of that extension cord and replace them with a 240V plug and receptacle (L6-20 recommended, or L6-30 if you upgrade to a 10 gauge cord), and either replace the outlet/circuit with a 240V one (if it's a standalone outlet it's an easy switch, but it's probably not) or have a new circuit run to the same place.

However, having the cord going across the sidewalk like that is a really bad permanent solution, so you still might want to consider trenching. I would say just install the 240V outlet at the end though (perhaps with a lockbox on it) instead of leaving a hardwired EVSE down at the curb. You can get one of these for pretty cheap - I've got one installed on the side of my house and I'm sure it'd work out just fine on a small post:
Of course you'll want to either replace the receptacle with one suited to the wiring you run or just run wiring appropriate to support a 14-50.

Click to expand...

I already have a 240V 6-20R installed next to the 110V outlet. I've been running a 50' 12 gauge extension cord from the outlet down to a TurboCord for over 1.5 years now, but the damn extension cords keep failing. I have another post about that. I really just wanted to not worry about extension cords and just have a hardwired EVSE box on the front of the house with a 70' cord.

BrockWI said:

I was thinking a nice steel lamp post with a 240vac outlet on the base of it. But whatever works...

Click to expand...

Yes just tap into the J-box at the bottom of the city street light pole

Just a thought...

Looks like your neighbor across the street has a tree stump in that little strip of land between the sidewalk and the street. Will they let you plant a tree in that space? If so you could mount a small electric box at the base of a tree (powered using UF cable) and use an EVSEUpgrade device that plugs into a small box at the base of the tree at night. No cable across the sidewalk and nothing left out in the day to vandalize or steal. Not a full 30 amps to the car, but still way faster than 120 volt and likely cheaper and safer than having an exposed cord across that sidewalk every day (no way the J1772 extension cord will fit in that crack) which is likely to upset the neighbors.

kevintylernelson said:

I already have a 240V 6-20R installed next to the 110V outlet. I've been running a 50' 12 gauge extension cord from the outlet down to a TurboCord for over 1.5 years now, but the damn extension cords keep failing. I have another post about that. I really just wanted to not worry about extension cords and just have a hardwired EVSE box on the front of the house with a 70' cord.

Click to expand...

Just read through your extension cord thread. Sounds like a voltage drop issue - did you ever measure that? Did the errors happen immediately upon powering the Turbocord or in the middle of charging? Anyway, I second the suggestions in that thread to use a #10 cord, and also a different EVSE (in particular evseupgrade) might be less finicky about a bit of voltage drop. Also you mentioned in that thread that you often would unplug under load - DON'T DO THAT! That could cause arcing that damages your plugs/receptacles. Always unplug from the vehicle first.

Anyway back to this thread - I'd still recommend against the EVSE with a super long J-cord. Either the J-cord or extension cord is at high risk of theft/vandalism/accidental damage and if voltage drop is an issue either is susceptible to it, but J-cord is many times more expensive. And looking at your setup I really doubt that an EVSE mounted on the front of your house would be any safer than one mounted at the curb. But with either of the above options you're running a cord over the sidewalk, which is just asking for trouble. Even though the strip of land on the other side of the sidewalk is county property, it's very unlikely anyone's going to care about a small post with an outlet on it - a visible cord going all the way down to the street from your house and crossing the sidewalk will attract much more attention from vandals and noisy neighbors. It's very common for people to run electricity or plumbing down to that strip for lighting or sprinklers - doing this is really no different. Pick up 50-100' of 10/2 UF cable, dig a trench, move the 6-20 receptacle down near the curb, and charge away with your Turbocord.

If you own the land up to the sidewalk then install EVSE at the very edge of your land. Like 1" from the border

EVSE to vehicle cable can safely be 5m long and those extra pins will do the job correctly.
If the land from sidewalk up to road is the land of the state (usually roads are) then ask for permission to
install EVSE for EV. I bet they have no big reasons to say no. If they say no then go to media and tell how hard
it still is to install EVSE nowadays. They might change their mind later